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To think free family/ grandparent childcare should be banned?

(455 Posts)
KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:41:34

This is a topic I keep seeing pop up and I can see both sides so wanted to throw it up for discussion.

Reasons I agree;
- It’s a HUGE and unfair financial advantage for those of us who have unpaid/ free childcare over those who don’t! It’s basically luck of the draw over whether you get to avoid £700-£900 full time nursery fees per child! In every other area of life it seems society is making it less acceptable to discriminate due to family financial status (uni funding - blind interviews) but ‘unpaid internships’ and ‘free childcare’ are two big remaining issues!

- It takes away jobs and is detrimental to the economy. (If all the children currently being looked after by family were in nursery more money would be spent, contributing to the economy, and more staff would be needed, creating jobs.)

But equally, as someone who does have free grandparent childcare lined up - of course I want to save (huge amounts) of cash and I trust my parents implicitly, no one would care for my kids better! Why should I give my children to strangers (even professionally trained ones) or fork out money I don’t need to?

The topic of childcare came up at work the other day and there was a definite ‘bloody alright for some’ attitude from those colleagues paying for childcare. It seems to be a subject that divides people very strongly!

KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:42:15

* my title should have said *to wonder if....

Cherries101 Wed 12-Dec-18 23:44:03

Does that mean banning sahp?

MrsStrowman Wed 12-Dec-18 23:44:34

So everyone should be in a worse situation because some don't have family support? Meaning having a family is even more the preserve of the wealthy who can afford one income, full time private nursery or nannies?... 🍪

Nubbin Wed 12-Dec-18 23:45:47

Surely this is just nonsense - how could you ban family care? Are you going to ban sahm as well?

Family care comes with its own pluses and minuses - re control, reliability etc.

FrancisCrawford Wed 12-Dec-18 23:46:07

what about SAHP?

By your logic it is unfair they can afford to stay at home and they are depriving nursery workers of jobs.

are you going to ban SAHP too, and make them send their kids to nursery even though they are at home anyway?

ThatThingYouDo Wed 12-Dec-18 23:47:59

This is bizarre. How would it even be possible to ban family members from looking after children they are related to?

You're talking about forcing families to pay for childcare despite the fact a grandparent or aunt could step in?

And does that mean we should ban sahp too?

KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:49:05

I mean if you’re a sahp then you’re sacrificing one salary so no I don’t think parent care could be included.

Idk- it just seems that two families could both be on minimum wage- both struggling - but one better off than the other purely because they have a family member able to provide free childcare.

It’s just like kids of wealthy parents having advantages in careers/ home buying ...etc

FrancisCrawford Wed 12-Dec-18 23:49:43

What about shift workers?

Many have arrangements where one parent works while the other is at home or a family member steps in. There aren’t many nurseries that stay open all night.

So should shift workers not have children or should the police, fire service, nurses, bus drivers etc just offer a daytime service only?

Dotty1970 Wed 12-Dec-18 23:50:51

As said in the Catherine tate show ..... What a lot of old shit!

KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:51:16

I’m not saying anything should be banned but when you read threads (like I have in the past) where people venomously argue how unfair it is- I’ve always thought - well wtf do you want to happen? Should we ban it?

FrancisCrawford Wed 12-Dec-18 23:51:27

if you’re a sahp then you’re sacrificing one salary

Not necessarily. One parent may never have worked.

BlaaBlaaBlaa Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:13

Wow. Should I live in a smaller house because some people might only be able to afford a house as big as mine? What about my car? Should I not go on holiday in case others don't have the funds to go abroad? Where would we stop?

And I say that as someone who pays for full time childcare.

Suze1621 Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:15

What a ridiculous thread!

Hedgehogblues Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:21

This is absurd. Extended family helping with childcare has been the norm for most of human history.

DownAndUnder Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:26

We can’t ban grandparents from having their grandchildren because people are jealous they don’t get free childcare. I doubt it’s bad for the economy, nurseries are full round here and people with free childcare are more likely to work/work more if they have free childcare.

KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:29

🤔 I’m not sure what the desired outcome is, or why there’s such a stigma surrounding ‘having free child care’

FrancisCrawford Wed 12-Dec-18 23:52:32

I’m not saying anything should be banned

Oh yes you are

Go back and read the title you chose for this thread

sue51 Wed 12-Dec-18 23:53:13

Don't quite get your argument .

FrancisCrawford Wed 12-Dec-18 23:53:33

why there’s such a stigma surrounding ‘having free child care’

There isn’t.

Except in your imagination.

Hyppolyta Wed 12-Dec-18 23:54:16

My parents refused to support me through GCSE and ALevels. At 16 I got a squat place to live, and worked several shite jobs.

Should everyone have to do this as they got a huge and unfair advantage? Nope.

What about those who get private schooling, tutoring, gap years, driving lessons paid for?
Inheritances, house deposits, weddings...
The list is endless.

Some parents help, some dont. Life isnt fair.

Mrskeats Wed 12-Dec-18 23:54:52

Stupidest thread of the day goes to........

Laineypopps Wed 12-Dec-18 23:55:12

So really what you are suggesting is total communism where, regardless of your circumstances, everyone gets the same to make it fair?!?

Didn't work for Russia!!

ghostsandghoulies Wed 12-Dec-18 23:57:24

Some kids are healthy. Others are not.
Some kids have 2 parents living with them. Others don't.
Some have loving grandparents. Others don't.
Some have parents who have a reasonable mortgage thanks to parental help. Others don't.

Life isn't fair and you can't make everyone's circumstances equal.

KnightlyMyMan Wed 12-Dec-18 23:57:26

@Francis

I wrote in a comment immediately following my OP- my title should have said *to wonder if...

😞- please RTFT if you’re gonna start ‘making points’

I also said I have free child care and intend to use it. But see such divided opinion on it and can see valid points on both sides!

Unfortunately all I see is one camp saying ‘this is unfair’ (but not really saying what should be done about it. Whilst the other camp say ‘sod off we don’t care and like our extra cash!’

Reallybadidea Wed 12-Dec-18 23:57:27

Literally the worst thought out argument that I've ever read hmm

PositivelyPERF Wed 12-Dec-18 23:57:48

I think....erm.....well I actually really having a fucking clue what to say to you, OP. Maybe set down the 🚬

MorrisZapp Wed 12-Dec-18 23:58:02

My best friend has a flat stomach and her legs are three inches longer than mine. I feel this is unfair. Who can I get to sort this out please?

Awwlookatmybabyspider Wed 12-Dec-18 23:58:38

Even if I did agree with such a daft idea.
How exactly would it be policed
You can hardly make it illegal for a child to spend time with their Grandparents, because that's what it boils down to.
Professional childcare workers may provide wonderful care and Education, but they don't love the child at the end of the day. If Grandparentscan and are willing to provide the child care then children are better off with them.
Also by the time childcare is paid out. Its often not worth going out to work for some parents, is it, and Then you'd probably be spitting your dummy out about people leaving their jobs.
You can't have it both ways.

Elphie54 Wed 12-Dec-18 23:58:53

Uh no. You can’t ban something just because you are jealous that someone else has it (see your first point). Absolutely ridiculous.

Not everyone has money for FT nursery. So does that mean they should be forced to pay because it’s “unfair” they have family care lined up? They would see it as unfair that they have to pay for child care when they have another option and are already financially in a bad place.

What about SAHP? Should they be banned too?

arethereanyleftatall Wed 12-Dec-18 23:59:52

I do see what you're saying.
The laws currently try to even out things - so a low wage is topped up with tax credits, a high wage cut down by taxes; a family with a lower income gets free music lessons etc etc etc
And yet free childcare, which yes could save a family £1ks, is not taken in to any consideration.
Fair point.

sue51 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:00:07

I'm happy to provide childcare for my grandchild. If it makes life a bit easier for my daughter who is a single parent, then great.

BlaaBlaaBlaa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:00:51

There is no stigma attached to using free childcare. Using paid childcare on the other hand .......

PickAChew Thu 13-Dec-18 00:00:57

Divvent be daft.

dinnafashsassenach Thu 13-Dec-18 00:01:02

My nursery bill is 2k per month so yes, it kills me a little bit inside to hear people bragging about their unlimited free childcare.

dinnafashsassenach Thu 13-Dec-18 00:02:21

But what you are talking about is rubbish

user1473878824 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:03:08

No one should be able to buy a house! No one should buy a car! No or should be able to eat whatever they want and not put on weight*! No one should be a SAHP! Just because some people can’t have something it doesn’t mean everyone shouldn’t.

*Apart from that one. The bastards.

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:03:37

This thread is born entirely of me reading others complain about how unfaur it is that others have free childcare - and thinking, ‘well yeah I can see that, but what’s your suggestion- do we ban it?’

I should clarify that my ‘banning’ it isn’t a ‘serious’ suggestion. I don’t expect a department of the police to go around banging on grannies doors’ 😂

It’s just everytime I read comments about how unfaur free childcare is I think 🤔 well it is but what do you expect to be done about it?

OverTheHedgeSammy Thu 13-Dec-18 00:03:46

Unfortunately all I see is one camp saying ‘this is unfair’

There are always people whinging about things being unfair. Life is unfair. Yes, we can try to level out the playing field, to an extent, by giving some financial assistance, benefits, tax credits, funded nursery places, etc. But you can't create a false family to give the support a real family would. You can't give someone qualifications, they have to go out and get them. Some people are smarter, some are taller, some are better looking, etc, etc, etc.

In the end all you can do is suck it up and deal with it.

steff13 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:04:12

This is a topic I keep seeing pop up and I can see both sides so wanted to throw it up for discussion.

I don't think I understand what the "sides" are. Are there people who actually think someone shouldn't use grandparent/friend/whoever for childcare if it's available?

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:05:42

@arethereanyleft

YES!!! Exactly what I was trying to say but doing a terrible job!!!

^that

Yes it’s unfair- but no suggestions are ever made about resolving it! Just statements about it being unfair!

TheFairyAstronaut Thu 13-Dec-18 00:05:46

In Plato’s Republic, he advocates a regime whereby children aren’t raised by their parent’s, in order to overcome the distortions that arise in society from parent’s flavourings their own children.

I can’t see how any government could enforce your plan OP, grandmas would march on Westminster and disembowel MPs with knitting needles and the grandas would finish off the stragglers with a quick bash with a spade to put ‘em out of their misery.

Some kind of recognition that some people have less access to childcare than others could work.

IAmNotAWitch Thu 13-Dec-18 00:05:58

Life isn't fair. It can't be made fair.

Once you realise this it all makes a lot more sense.

The Government should not be any more involved in people's families than is absolutely strictly necessary.

Fucking Hell.

TheFairyAstronaut Thu 13-Dec-18 00:06:46

Favouring not flavouring. Parent’s flavouring their children is a society with a whole different set of problems...

dinnafashsassenach Thu 13-Dec-18 00:07:08

I dont think it's unfair I'm just insanely jealous of them envy

Sailinghappy Thu 13-Dec-18 00:07:30

Would it not make more sense to advocate free/ subsidised childcare for all working parents? I’m not suggesting I agree, just that if you want to even things out, perhaps making the situation easier for parents makes more sense than making it difficult for all?!

AnotherPidgey Thu 13-Dec-18 00:08:01

It is a valid point that family care is a financial and practical advantage to have. Many employers and schools seem to assume that there is someone avaliable for sick days/ assemblies etc. If there isn't, life can be quite fraught in attempting to cover everything or in what has to be missed out.

It shouldn't be banned though.

I'm a SAHM and give some free care to a friend's child. It is more relaxing for him than his wrap around days. If he's tired, he can chill on the sofa in front of the TV rather than in a cramped, busy room around the ends of the school day. There is less pressure of pick-ups/ drop offs. I've been there as a working parent and it's hard going for all.

Being cared for in a family/ friend's home can be a valuable experience for children.

Grandparents/ family were never an option for us. Too far away. Still working F/T. Too elderly. We knew the score on that years before TTC.

The solution is more flexible childcare and employers.

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:08:09

*I do see what you're saying.
The laws currently try to even out things - so a low wage is topped up with tax credits, a high wage cut down by taxes; a family with a lower income gets free music lessons etc etc etc
And yet free childcare, which yes could save a family £1ks, is not taken in to any consideration.
Fair point.*

^ this is what I meant - I’ve had very little sleep in the last few days so did a bad job coherently explaining my thoughts 😒

MilkyCuppa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:08:15

It’s a HUGE and unfair financial advantage for those of us who have unpaid/ free childcare over those who don’t!

There are many unfair advantages in life. DH’s sister was gifted a free house by her husband’s wealthy parents, while we have to pay a mortgage. My ex inherited his parents’ company and walked straight into a well paid management role, while I had to apply for jobs and start from the bottom. My DF won a small amount on the lottery and bought me a car, while others don’t have that advantage. You can’t just pick out one unfair advantage and ban it. Life is unfair, end of discussion.

DiegoVelazquez Thu 13-Dec-18 00:08:15

This is quite a strange thread.

Since we're talking about unrealistic hypothetical situations, surely the more sensible answer is to provide free childcare to those who need it, rather than force people who have it to give it up?

RCohle Thu 13-Dec-18 00:09:27

But life isn't fair.

Some people are single parents, some have a network of close friends to provide back up child care, some have high paying jobs, some people suffer ill health, some have children with disabilities ...

There isn't a perfectly level playing field, penalising people with family members able to help with child care won't change that.

WhatToDoAboutWailmerGoneRogue Thu 13-Dec-18 00:10:17

Nothing can be done about it because life isn’t fair.

Schmoobarb Thu 13-Dec-18 00:10:37

I dont think it's unfair I'm just insanely jealous of them

This! And have to bite my tongue when they moan about their free childcare. Well I did, not now as my kids are growing up so childcare isn’t as expensive anyway

BlaaBlaaBlaa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:10:48

Life can be unfair. The adult thing to do is to make the best of what you have.

I would never resent anyone for using free childcare if that's what works for them .

We chose nursery over free childcare because it worked best for us as a family.

pigsinarow Thu 13-Dec-18 00:11:38

This is the most stupid thread I have seen in ages. OP there is no ‘debate’ on this. It is not a topic. You have literally just made it up. Why? Bored?

StoppinBy Thu 13-Dec-18 00:12:30

I don't have any support for child minding for my children and I think you are being ridiculous.

That's like saying everyone has to take jobs that pay the same so everyone is equal.

Some people are lucky enough to have that support, some aren't, it's just the way it is. Life wasn't meant to be fair unfortunately.

user1473878824 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:12:36

“I should clarify that my ‘banning’ it isn’t a ‘serious’ suggestion.”

Shame about your thread title and post then, isn’t it?

Elphie54 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:12:50

“Favouring not flavouring. Parent’s flavouring their children is a society with a whole different set of problems...”

Lmfao. Now I have to clean my computer screen. Thanks for this!

QwertyLou Thu 13-Dec-18 00:13:02

If this is real, YABU.

I could just as realistically and fairly propose a ban on two-parent families.

I mean, all of you with two incomes and/or another parent to tag team childcare with - you’re really putting LPs like me at a disadvantage!

All your husbands/partners should be made to vanish like mine did - you’d then need more hours of paid childcare and that would be good for the economy confused

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:14:41

@user

I think my title is fair. Everytime I read ‘it’s so unfair’ comments I do think 🙄 ‘what do you expect them to do- ban it?’

StoppinBy Thu 13-Dec-18 00:15:23

You know what we should do..... ban all Grandparents from working, yeah that would be great, frees up jobs for the younger generation and means more of them will be able to look after their Grandies.

That sounds like a much better idea!

TheFairyAstronaut Thu 13-Dec-18 00:16:02

You could do something like give priority over free nursery places to parent’s who could prove no living relatives with say 50 miles or similar.

Onus is on those applying to prove they are eligible, something similar to old student grant system.

It’d be open to abuse by certain people, and it would create different unfairness, but it might end up unfair to fewer people than the current way of doing things.

AornisHades Thu 13-Dec-18 00:16:12

The only way that could even begin to work is taxing free childcare as a 'benefit' but it would be an administrative nightmare.

AdoraBell Thu 13-Dec-18 00:16:54

Ooh OP I had the most fair parents who refused to look after a grandchild when my sister had to work after her husband fucked off with his secretary.

BlaaBlaaBlaa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:17:39

I've rarely seen people say it's unfair- people might be envious but we're all adult enough to understand everyone has different lives.

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:19:13

It’s interesting to actually consider options though right? Rather than just saying ‘it’s not fair’ - subsidised nursery for working parents- free spaces for those with no help.
Better than nothing

Stompythedinosaur Thu 13-Dec-18 00:20:48

It is not possible to make life completely fair. What you are arguing is like insisting everyone has to use a wheelchair because some people have to.

I think we should be trying to support people in a worse situation having things improved rather than taking things away from those in a better situation. So if you were asking whether we should have more affordable and flexible childcare available to support people without family care available, I would agree with that.

BlaaBlaaBlaa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:20:55

And this would be funded how?

KnightlyMyMan Thu 13-Dec-18 00:21:26

@adorabell

So your sister needed childcare help and didn’t have grandparent support? I’m guessing some of the options being thrown around here like subsidised or free places would have helped?

BlaaBlaaBlaa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:22:03

And how would it work for those who have help but choose not to use it?

HestiaParthenos Thu 13-Dec-18 00:22:57

It sounds like you are trying to solve the unfairness issue the wrong way round.

What about providing free childcare to those who don't have grandparents who look after the children?

Forcing people to give their children to strangers (let's be real here, staying at home isn't an option for most) to create more jobs sounds like something out of a dystopic novel.

TheFairyAstronaut Thu 13-Dec-18 00:23:37

You might also be underestimating how things even out in the long-run.

Here’s how it evens out in my family.

My parent’s are both dead. DH’s are both still living. SIL and BIL both have both sets of parents alive.

We’ve never asked PILs for childcare. SIL has. She doesn’t like BILs parent’s so she doesn’t ask them. They look after BIL’s brothers kids though.

So, in old age, the deal is that BIL’s brother will look after his mum and dad. BIL and SIL will look after PILs.

DH and I will go on holiday a lot and turn up at PILs with biscuits for a chat now and then.

Redyoyo Thu 13-Dec-18 00:24:24

Well you could say then if you can't afford childcare don't have any children. Then you wouldn't have to moan about paying for it.

I'd rather they banned free parking, i currently pay £250 a month to park near my office, however our other office has free parking so if you work there you get paid more doing the same job, thats not fair but then again lifes not fair so tough titties!

RCohle Thu 13-Dec-18 00:25:35

But what sort of police state would you introduce to make sure people really had "no help"?

How much help are you allowed? Are odd nights babysitting allowed? What about emergencies? What if my kids spend Saturday with their grandma because* she* wants to see them?

Isn't telling people what they can and can't do in their free time without compensation a huge restriction on civil liberties?

Berniethefastestmilkwoman Thu 13-Dec-18 00:30:04

Yes, because life is so fair in all other ways.

I think we'd be better concentrating on evening the playing field for children born to families living in poverty. Why should they have to pay for childcare when they have grandparents willing to look after their grandchildren for free? What has it got to do with them that another family, possibly with a much higher income, has to pay for childcare? It's called doing it yourself. Builder's, car mechanics, chefs, hair dressers, plumbers, electricians etc can all do work for free for themselves and their families. They don't care that the rest of us have to pay for the same service. You can't shout 'but it isn't fair'.

Also, I'll decide who looks after my child. It is none of the government's business as long as every child is being cared for well.

I have absolutely no family help with childcare.

StoppinBy Thu 13-Dec-18 00:30:58

Entirely directed at your last post...… you are actually not in this position so what right do you think you have to judge the way people who actually are in that situation feel about it?

Yes it is unfair, so what, lots of people say different things are unfair, and the more you speak the more you sound like you are just trying to gloat about the fact you have access to free childcare.

The people who you perceive as shouting 'it's not fair' are not actually the ones who can offer free childcare spaces and realistically if free childcare spaces are allocated everyone will be then shouting 'my taxes went up, it's not fair, I don't even have kids or use free childcare' so really you are trying to simplify something that just isn't simple.

SleepingStandingUp Thu 13-Dec-18 00:31:21

I assumed you meant Room 101 it rather than rallying for a law change. People are so uptight.

Anyway, my opinion is meh, life is unfair, tough.

I'm a SAHP beciaae my disabled child's care needs cannot be met by a child minder / nursery as he needs 121 care. I don't earn enough for a Nanny. He spent so much time in hospital I couldn't have worked for the first tow years. We get no meaningful famy support. We're massively financially disadvantaged compared to my friends who could return to work or made a choice not to. We aren't compared to friends who had to give up work for economic reasons.

Unfortinately that's life. You can't force my parents to have him and learn his care needs. You can't force OP to send the kids to nursery.

SleepingStandingUp Thu 13-Dec-18 00:32:38

Ooh OP maybe we tax you for using family and then use it to fund childcare places for other people.

Hedgehogblues Thu 13-Dec-18 00:34:06

*It’s interesting to actually consider options though right? Rather than just saying ‘it’s not fair’ - subsidised nursery for working parents- free spaces for those with no help.
Better than nothing*

That's completely different from banning extended family childcare

MissyCooper Thu 13-Dec-18 00:35:43

I absolutely hate this obsession with dragging everyone down the way because “some people can’t have it”. Away and mind your own business.

jessstan2 Thu 13-Dec-18 00:38:34

No I do not think it should be banned, it's entirely up to the individuals concerned. If full time care is provided by grandparents, they probably deserve payment but some of them wouldn't want it. Part time care and pick ups from school are usually free.

I was a hard up mum many years ago, I had a lovely husband (still do) but we didn't have much in the way of disposable income for a few years. My mum and my in-laws did a lot of child care while we worked and we were extremely grateful. We did treat them sometimes but didn't pay them.

If grandparents offer free childcare, accept it (all things being equal of course that the grands are good people who are able to look after kids). No reason to feel guilty just because some people don't have it, it's not your fault.

I do know a lady who retired about the same time as one of her children had a baby. She looked after the baby when daughter came off mat leave and it was not unreasonable for her to be paid, daughter was earning a decent salary by then and mum wasn't particularly well off. Still cheaper than hiring a nanny.

If and when I have grandkids I am not going to charge for looking after.

QwertyLou Thu 13-Dec-18 00:40:38

Plenty of things are “unfair.” Sometimes people just need to vent or moan about it, and that’s okay.

People are not being U to moan, we all do it! But I think YABU to use their moaning to justify this thread.

knittedjest Thu 13-Dec-18 00:50:11

This is almost as bad an idea as that psychologist who said bedtime stories should be banned because it gave rich kids an advantage. It's a race to the top, not the bottom.

MilkyCuppa Thu 13-Dec-18 00:53:44

You could do something like give priority over free nursery places to parent’s who could prove no living relatives with say 50 miles or similar.

What about people who don’t get on with their parents? Or parents who are too old or disabled to offer childcare, or simply don’t want to? Just because someone has relatives nearby doesn’t mean they have childcare. I have two parents and two PIL within 15 miles, none of whom are capable of offering childcare. There is literally no way to police who has free childcare or not.

Aneira11 Thu 13-Dec-18 01:08:07

Such an absurd thread!

LagunaBubbles Thu 13-Dec-18 01:12:37

Life is unfair at times. You can't just ban something because it is "unfair" to some people. Thats mad.

AhhhhThatsBass Thu 13-Dec-18 01:23:20

“£700-£900 full time nursery fees per child!?”

Try £1800 in London.

AhhhhThatsBass Thu 13-Dec-18 01:24:26

And no YABVU. Good luck to those who have familial support. Sometimes it’s the difference between being able to afford to work and not, I imagine.

MissConductUS Thu 13-Dec-18 01:25:31

I think that tall people have an unfair advantage. Studies show they get more and better job offers, they are considered more attractive, etc. it's insidious discrimination. And don't get me started about sports, lightbulb replacement and getting things out of the top of the cabinets.

I think we need to consider financial compensation funded by a height tax or surgical intervention or both.

Leyani Thu 13-Dec-18 01:40:35

Solution is to make paid childcare more affordable. The U.K. is the most expensive country in Europe for childcare for under 5s as there's no state and often no employer contribution.

Bouledeneige Thu 13-Dec-18 01:40:57

Yes lets ban people from helping their famillies. Its really, really unfair! Lets put all children in nurseries and force all parents to work. Lets only let famillies have one child because its not fair that big famillies use more NHS and education services. Lets remove all inherited wealth and make sure everyone gets everything the same - the same house, car, wages,

They should have tried this before! Oh they did. It went really, really well.

Absolutely ludicrous.

SilverDoe Thu 13-Dec-18 01:45:40

Wtf did I just read shock confused

Racecardriver Thu 13-Dec-18 01:45:55

OMG you are so right. They should also ban being intelligent because that also gives a huge financial advantage. And work ethic too. So unfair how clever hardworking people earn much more than the rest of us. Can you tell I’m being sarcastic? We don’t have family who can take care of our children but I wouldn’t presume to tell other people what to do.

Greensleeves Thu 13-Dec-18 01:52:07

I thought this was going to be about safeguarding and the risks of unregulated carers.

I was still going to say "bollocks", but with marginally less incredulity.

MutedUser Thu 13-Dec-18 02:32:51

Plus shouldn’t we all just get paid the same wages too then no one at all will have a financial advantage .

Llioed Thu 13-Dec-18 02:43:22

Some people need to mind their own business when it comes to the care of OTHER children. I don’t stick my nose into, nor do I make judgements about how other children are looked after, be it private nursery, childminder, grandparents, SAHP....

I returned to work 3 days per week, and my mum WANTED to look after my daughter two days a week, and my in-laws looked after my daughter one day of the week. As it happens my daughter is now in nursery (pre-school) five mornings a week, so my mum still picks her up from nursery and looks after her those two “Grandma” days and the in-laws pick her up from nursery on “their day” They all love doing it, and my daughter gets to spend quality time with them all.

I can appreciate the viewpoint of “it’s not fair” however that’s not fair toward us who DO have free childcare.

I absolutely second what Ghostandghoulies says. I wish I was mortgage-free, but at the same time I don’t stomp around saying it’s unfair because my DH and I have a couple of friends who are mortgage-free, thanks to help from their parents.

OP - if you ever get anyone criticising your “free childcare” just ignore it. HTH smile

reallymate Thu 13-Dec-18 02:43:44

How completely ridiculous. This isn't the fault of 2 families on minimum wage with one having family support. How about fully funded childcare from a government that cares about its kids so every family has an equal choice? Instead of attacking those that need it the most because others are even more unfortunate. Extremely odd and very totalitarian. This isn't a dictatorship and I for one am glad it's not. Let's attack the government not each other.

reallymate Thu 13-Dec-18 02:45:48

equal chance (wrong word was used) and I'm a single parent who struggles a lot with childcare and I don't agree with you at all. Taking away help from those who need it the most is not the answer. How did this even come into your head? Seems extremely odd.

Cornishclio Thu 13-Dec-18 03:30:43

There are always people whining about things being unfair. Some families help their offspring with house deposits, some don't or can't. Some people get paid more, have better terms and conditions of employment, some have no buses where they live and have to fork out on cars. Some have families which can and will provide free childcare, some don't or can't. There is no way you can level the playing field for everyone and some people just moan about everything. We look after our granddaughters one day a week and yes it saves our daughter and her husband money as it is one less nursery day but we do it to spend dedicated time with them. She is not the type of person to brag about it though so I can't see why anyone would be offended. No one else's business.

BeanBagLady Thu 13-Dec-18 04:40:42

It is unfair!
To put this right a new Ministry should be established, responsible for banning it.

They should get all babies micro chipped at birth, and all 66 year olds should also be required to be chipped before being allowed to draw state pension.

They would then be able to monitor when children were spending day times in tne company if grandparents.

Any families that break the ban can opt to have either the baby or the grandparent interred in a special detention centre during working hours to prevent this happening.

That would ensure more fairness.

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