To be at my wits end with DS behaviour at scho

[Missythecat]

Sorry posting here for traffic

Back history: DS6 has never done amazingly at school. On and off behaviour issues since reception. Mostly getting cross and messing about at carpet time.

Year 2 hits and it has got so bad. Refuses to do work, runs away, screams and shouts, hitting etc.

He has always struggled to make friends. He's quite bright but doesn't listen so struggles academically too. He always tells me that school is boring etc.

I have enforced reward/punishment at home. We have a system where he earns screen time dependent on his behaviour at school. Reward charts, visual cues that I have given to school. You name it.

It has got to the point recently that I am getting called to school to come pick him up early as he is kicking off. Trouble is I am a single parent and cannot keep leaving work if I want to be able to keep my job!

Looking for any ideas, similar experiences and to mostly have a rant. I don't know how to help him at school. He's ok at home, can sometimes be a bit cheeky but nothing remotely like the behaviour at school.

Help!

[Missythecat]

Sorry for typo in thread title. Been a long day

[Wolfiefan]

What are school suggesting? How have they measured how “bright” he is? Doesn’t listen? Has his hearing been checked? What makes him cross? Is he afraid of getting work wrong or maybe struggling to get it on paper?

[Blueemeraldagain]

Ok, I would start with finding out if these exclusions are official or not (I doubt it). If not they are illegal and proof that the school is not managing/ putting in strategies to help him mange his behaviour.

[Thesnobbymiddleclassone]

It sounds like there is likely to be some additional needs not being met.

As the PP suggested his hearing may be an issue and the anger could be frustration from that.

I'd seek advice from the GP as this has clearly gone on for quite a while.

[walkinginshadows]

Perhaps get his hearing and eyesight checked

[immummynoiam]

You are in partnership with the school, it’s not just your problem. My DN was like this, he has an adhd diagnosis and he was sent to a PRU in the end where they massively helped him. Your ds needs more support from them - excluding him and calling you isn’t resolving anything and as you say, you may end up sacked at some point if it carries on.

[Missythecat]

Hearing is fine. The school agree he is "bright". I do think he finds not knowing or getting an answer wrong stressful. We have had one meeting where we discussed strategies. But his behaviour escalated so much since then that I'm not sure how much has been put in place.

He fidgets a lot and is easily distracted. He can read and write beautifully when focused. I would say focus is a big concern.

[Missythecat]

Eyesight is also fine. He had a optician test recently. Part of me thinks additional needs but part of me thinks he is just really fighting against school.

[Mummyshark2018]

Like someone else said are these actual exclusions? If not I would say you cannot collect him (unless obv he is hurt or the incident was really serious). What have the school put in to support him? What do you think he's trying to communicate through his behaviour?

[BayofBiscuits]

I am also interested to know what the school are doing. They can't just send him home. Next time I would ask if they are officially excluding him, and if they aren't then don't pick him up.

If they are, there ought to be a meeting on the day he goes back to discuss strategies going forward. They should be looking at what triggers the behaviour and how they can prevent those triggers.

It does sort of scream undiagnosed SEN as well. So they should be looking at that to see if there is anything going on.

[Missythecat]

I would say that even when I'm not called he spends 60% of the time in the head's/SENCOs office as he had misbehaved and is sent to there. So he gets out of class that way. I fully understand their position though

[WickedGoodDoge]

I don’t have much advice, I’m afraid, but wanted to let you know that our DS was the same at that age. We were tearing our hair out over his behaviour at school! The school ended up having him assessed by the Educational Psychologist who advised that she saw no primary problems, but a range of secondary problems caused by how the school were dealing with DS (I won’t get into the detail as it’s probably not relevant). We were advised by the EP to not carry through the reward/punishment at home as it was putting him under too much pressure which was leading to a cycle of worse behaviour at school followed by withdrawal of privileges at home etc. She felt he needed an escape or safe place at home and to let the school,focus on the behaviour there. Your child may obviously be completely different, though!

I did want to say that there can be light at the end of the tunnel- DS gradually improved his behaviour and at 16, he’s now a model student and top performer. You would never recognise him if you hadn’t seen him since his younger self.

[immummynoiam]

No I think you are being too tolerant of the school - sending him home and putting it on you to the point you are risking your job is not ok, whatever the cause for why your ds is doing what he is.

Do you have a friend that can go with you to a meeting at the school and be bad cop about what they are doing so they don’t keep calling you?

[Missythecat]

I do find lack of communication hard. I get called, calm him down then take him home. But I don't get a lot of feedback on triggers. And he is 6 so a lot of what happened is garbled. I need to know why this is happening!

[Wolfiefan]

Children generally don’t fight against school for no reason. The school needs to do all it can to identify and tackle the reason.

[Missythecat]

To WickedGoodDoge, I am wondering if ruining his safe place at home has made it worse at school too. Like a double punishment?

[immummynoiam]

I’m also on the fence about punishment - if there are SN they need rest and comfort at home but you won’t know unless he’s assessed. If you/they think he really is playing up because he wants to go home, the school needs to manage that even if he does spend all day sitting on his own at school.

[BayofBiscuits]

I agree that you are being too tolerant of the school. Please ask for a meeting with the SENCO to discuss what are they doing to ensure your son can access his education.

He's not doing this just because he is naughty, there is something causing it. So they need to figure out what. Is carpet time too busy and noisy? Does he need more help understanding the work? Is he dyslexic?

Ask for them to do an ABC lot for every incident from now on. If you Google ABC behaviour log you'll find examples. It is designed to identify patterns so you can see what is causing the behaviour.

[Wolfiefan]

The thing is that if he has additional needs that the school have failed to identify and provide for then the poor behaviour is a result of that. It’s not him choosing to act up. (If that makes sense?)
I would want a meeting ASAP with the school. How do they intend to assess the underlying causes of this behaviour and try to plan to avoid it occurring in future?

[mumonashoestring]

You've more or less described my 6 year old DS's behaviour at school. He's recently been diagnosed with high functioning autism and ADHD. We only see the really extreme behaviour at school because it's the school environment that triggers all of the anxiety and fear that drives the screaming, arguing, anger, trying to run away...

Previous posters are absolutely right when they say school can't continue to send him home when they can't cope - they can officially exclude him and in order to do that they need to do all the attendant admin. A letter explaining why he's being excluded, how long for and some work to do during the exclusion are the bare minimum. Have they offered any support with working out what's going on? An educational psychologist visit?

If they aren't pulling their collective finger out to find out why this is happening then you can go to your GP and request referral to a paediatrician for a multidisciplinary assessment which should include physical development, speech and language, psychology, hearing and a dental check. If nothing else think of it as ruling out possibilities.

[BayofBiscuits]

I definitely wouldn't punish him at home. Maybe he is feeling very anxious, and punishments only work if he is 100% in control of his behaviour. If it is being caused by anxiety then it is more like a panic attack, in the moment he can't just stop it.

My son is very similar and the school have action plans coming out of their ears for him and I have weekly discussions with the SENCO.

[DanielRicciardosSmile]

He sounds very similar to my DS at that age, he was diagnosed at 7 with ASD and we got a statement for him at 8 (now an EHC). It did get easier (he's now nearly 14, and doing very well in a mainstream secondary with fantastic SEN support), but it was devastating at the time - I used to find myself thinking "Why can't you just behave?!"

Have you been referred to CAMHS or Community Paediatrician (not sure what area you're in so could be either who would help) for assessment? Have school had involvement from Ed Psych or the LA Behavioural Support Team? Getting the right support in school is essential - DS had an amazing lead TA from year 4 to year 6, and it really helped immensely.

[Missythecat]

Definitely will google ABC log, thank you.

I have a meeting with SENCO this week. So need to be really prepared. They did offer him 1-2-1 time if he had a good day the day before if you get what I mean as they think he struggles with having to fight for attention with other kids. But not sure if that has happened or if that is working.

[BayofBiscuits]

He gets 121 only if he's had a good day? That is nuts.

[Missythecat]

No referral to CAHMS. I wanted to do this myself but think I need school backing?