To ask is something off about daycare dismissing DS?

[Kratos]

So DS is 4 non verbal with ASD and SLD. he also has a sensory issue where he constantly mouths anything he picks up, though it’s gotten a lot better. Can’t take him to neurotypical soft play or such as the noise and other kids trigger an automatic meltdown. Neurotypical nurseries also won’t take him as they are not equipped.

A daycare close to us opened a special unit for children with ASD and special needs. It provided smaller groups such with more staff on hand and sensory play/activities. I was incredibly happy about this as DS would get the social interaction and stimulus he needed while in an enviroment with other kids like him.

They had him for 5 months. In this time he really improved, more eye contact and response, less mouthing etc a week or so ago I had a phone call from one of the girls in his room saying they would have to move him form the special unit to the neurotypical preschool unit just for the month of August as they were understaffed. It was either that or take him out for the month so I agreed to the move.

A day or so ago I had a phone call from their manager saying a recent risk assement meant they couldn’t have DS back because his mouthing was a choking hazard and they think they he is almost a one to one case in terms of need. The manger said the other girls were in agreement and agreed that he was ‘too severe’ for them to cater to his needs and that they were training their girls in terms of choking hazards but they don’t think they could provide the care he needs for another year at best. I was honestly devastated as I thought he had come along so well but I’ve been mulling over it. They had him for 5 months, they knew about his mouthing, which was so much worse when he actually started the establishment. I gave them every report I had of his and explained his likes, dislikes, triggers.

Firstly, why are their girls only being trained in choking hazards now? Secondly, If they really thought he was a danger in their risk assement why wasn’t he dismissed earlier? There was no small print in terms of their special unit, no restrictions. Why now when he’s improved so much? I don’t know, I just feel things don’t add up. But Perhaps I’m just gutted because I thought he’d come along so well and now he doesn’t understand why his routine has been upset.

Has anyone had experience with this? Do you think it sounds off?

[user139328237]

If he's 4 isn't he starting school next month anyway?

[Kratos]

He is user. But I’d still like to know if this is in fact normal practice.

[SoyDora]

I wonder why they phoned to tell you they couldn’t have him back in September when they presumably knew he was starting school in September anyway? It’ll be at most about a week that they’re talking about won’t it? It seems odd.

[MaisyPops]

It doesn't sound right to me, but that doesn't mean something is 'off' as such.

It might be that (for example) there's been some sort of case review and it's meant risk assessments needed updating and that changes the situation. It might be that whathe is mouthing is smaller now than before so presents a different hazard than say a child chewing the end of their sleeve. If the nature of his mouthing has changed then it might be that they don't have the staffing capacity to manage 1-1 care.

It's not ideal and it could be them trying to find an easy way out, but there may also be genuine reasons.

Hopefully someone more specialist will be along soon to advise.

[Kratos]

Soy, they have an after school programme in the special unit which I mentioned I’d be interested in signing DS up for so I assume that’s what they meant.

Maisy, I thought something similar but he’s virutally stopped mouthing since being there. He only does it now when his teeth hurt, his molars are coming through and they knew this.

[HaveYouSeentheWritingontheWall]

Are you in England? Does your DS have an Education, Health and Care Plan? If you are and he has one and this nursery is the named placement then they cannot just exclude him like that.

I would guess that they have made this decision on the basis of 'we can't meet the needs of the child with the funding we have' if you're in the UK then the Equality act 2010 requires them to make reasonable adjustments so as to not put your DS at a disadvantage.

[Squidgee]

are you sure they mean they're dismissing him completely or just from the mainstream bit he's in for the month?

[youarenotkiddingme]

He likely mouths more in the MS nursery because of sensory overload. Mouthing is a sensory activity.

Id reply with something factual, confirming the situation and via email to keep a paper trail.

Eg,

Dear nursery manager.

Thankyou for the phone call on x date regards you no longer being able to accommodate ds in the nursery.

I understand he had to attend the MS part as the unit was understaffed during the month of August.
I also understand from your reports that his sensory seeking activities (oral) have increased again since switching from the unit to the ms nursery. I suspect this is due to not managing the environment.

You have said that due to his mouthing you no longer feel able to accommodate him within the nursery at all? That a risk assessment has placed him as high risk and you have completed choking first aid but don't feel that is enough.
You state that he needs an intense 1:1 to manage a MS setting.

I'll take the above to be a correct summary unless I hear otherwise.

I was hoping to access the after school club section of the unit once ds starts school and would like your recommendations of what support ds needs to access this. This will help me approach the LA for funding and support.

Regards

Cxxx

[youarenotkiddingme]

I think right now it's not possible in this short time to get the funding for ms nursery 1:1. But it will be so helpful for you to have it documented that's what ds needs for an EHCP application or during an AR.

[Kratos]

Sorry everyone. Had a long and shitty day!

So to clarify a few things DS is statemented and has a place in a special needs school this coming september for p1.

The daycare was soemthing I discovered 5 months ago after his early years intervention placement ended. I wanted to keep giving him that social interaction in a controlled setting that helped him along at the same time. It was voluntary in the sense that I paid extra for DS to be in said special unit due to his extra needs.

Also the nursery have taken anything remotely linking to special needs off of their page, they vaguely mention a speech therapist but everything else in regards to the special unit is gone..

[Kratos]

Also this was a neurotypical daycare that added on a special needs unit. I didn’t want him to be placed in the mainstream bit permanently, I was told this was a temporary solution to their understaffing and that they were positive he would be fine in that bit. Which is another thing I don’t get, if he was such a hazard why put him into the mainstream setting...

[KateGrey]

Could it be the staff are overwhelmed? I have two with asd and youngest has just finished a hellish year in a MS. We took him out of a mainstream nursery as it was too much. We then found a really lovely mainstream nursery who were better trained around kids with asd. Some places just don’t get it, nor do they want to. I hope your son enjoys his new Sen school.

[Kratos]

Kate, I think that’s whats happened. I think they’ve bit off more than they can chew. Though it’s really shit because 2 other kids who were in the previous early intervention setting with DS were also in the special unit with him. They’ve gotten to stay so I think I’m just pissed that it seems unfair for him when he loved it so much.

[SparklyLeprechaun]

I presume someone resigned and they either couldn't fill in the position or had to get someone very junior in that they've got to train.

[spader1987]

Where the staff trained to deal with sen op? It very much sounds like they aren't from what you have said.

[Kratos]

Spader, when I first met with nursery manager to talk about DS she said they were trained and going through even more training to become “even better”. If it was a staff thing or they took on more than they could I’d have rather been told that than my kid is too much for them compared to the others ..

[youarenotkiddingme]

Sounds like they may have closed down the specialist unit if no literature refers to it.

But I agree they knew ds needs when they agreed to take him on so they should have risk assessed better initially.

Are there any SN groups you can join with ds? A FB Page for the school to get to know other parents and have playdays etc?

I found that it wasn't only ds that was isolated but I was too and that's really unhealthy.

[Rockandrollwithit]

Doesn't sound very inclusive.

My son has a medical condition that means all food is a choking hazard (basically a part of his oesophagus doesn't work correctly after surgery). We have decided not to use nursery care but the nursery we use for our older son were very accommodating when we looked into it. Learning how to deal with choking and choking hazards would not take a year!

I hope that he's going to a lovely primary school that will understand and support him.

[spader1987]

I totally agree op. Mouthing objects can be a very common behaviour so I'm surprised this is a problem for them if they are truly sen trained.
Your ds sounds very similar to my ds 8 who is also non verbal and has sld. He also goes to a special school. I hope your ds really enjoys his new school! Hopefully his school run after school clubs he can attend.
Ask about because most of the specialist groups I have found have been by asking other parents. Professionals don't pass on any information from my experience.

[Kratos]

Thank you! I’ve viewed his school a few times loved it so I’m very positive he will too!

My only issue is now for two/three weeks he’ll be wanting to go to daycare and I can’t make him understand why he can’t go. So meltdowns all around.

[lalalalyra]

Sounds like they've closed down the unit.

Their name doesn't start with W S does it? If so they've closed their specialist facility as the owner for some reason thought it would be a way to tap into serious funding. However, they realised recently that it's not, and making decent provision costs.

[Kratos]

No, La, they start with DD! Though that would have been helpful as it would have been a straightforward reason!