WIBU to think that boxers should be classed by personality, rather than weight?

[FairIsFair]

What does a person's body type have to do with who they really are inside?

Why shouldn't a heavyweight be able to box against a lightweight, if he identifies as someone with more of a lightweight-type personality? Maybe booklovers could fight booklovers, and outdoorsy types could fight outdoorsy types, and we could all just move past this discriminatory, cruel obsession with how much muscle mass each boxer has in relation to his opponent.

Or would that be ridiculous, because physical pursuits are segregated by physical attributes, not personalities, for reasons of both safety and fairness?

in athletics

in football

in weightlifting

in UFC

[FairIsFair]

Maybe not, then.

[Hont1986]

YABVVU for posting YET another one of these bloody threads.

We really need a separate topic (although FWR is basically exactly that now).

[FairIsFair]

Thanks for the bump.

[averylongtimeago]

But you mustn't upset people's feelings by pointing out an inconvenient truth.
They might be very very upset.

[FairIsFair]

Yes, avery, after all of what importance are women's shattered legs, orbital bones and opportunities, when compared to the bruised feelings of a male?

[WitchesHatRim]

Interesting first post OP

[OutyMcOutface]

Well I mean lightweight isn't a personality type-maybeyou could find a better analogy?

[Stompythedinosaur]

I think we're all aware of how anti-trans mumsnet is at present. Did we need another thread to point it out?

[FairIsFair]

Is 'woman' a personality type, Outy?

I've been here a long time, Witches. I name change regularly. I'm more interested in the topic of discussion (this topic, and others) than in being a recognized personality on here.

[snash12]

This is a joke though, right?

Heavyweights don't fight feather weights because the weight advantage would most likely mean the smaller fighter would be knocked out in 2 seconds and it wouldn't be a fight!

[TrojanWhore]

They'd still fight by weight. Whichever sex/gender they identified as. There is zero reason to extend the actual issue (how sports deals with those individuals whose chromosomes do not match their sex/gender, as the old rules are increasingly unpopular) into stupid fantasy scenarios which are simply not happening.

I think we need to start running a sweepstake for 'most ridiculously contrived example'

[virtualreality]

snash12,

I think that is the point the OP is making, a veiled reference to self ID.

[MongerTruffle]

Why does "Dried fruit - just NO" link to this thread?

[BarbaraofSevillle]

But the point being snash is that effectively heavyweights can simply say that they identify as lightweight and then they have to be allowed to fight against lightweights.

[FairIsFair]

Chromosomes determine sex, so everyone's chromosomes match their sex, whether that's male, female, or intersex.

Gender identity is just personality as viewed through sexist stereotypes. So the issue is whether sports should be segregated by sex / body type, or by personality.

Right now, the move is toward segregating sports by personality. I find that troublesome.

[FairIsFair]

Not really a veiled reference seeing as the links are all about male bodies people competing against women because of their 'Gender identity.'

Just trying to look at the issue from another angle to see if the logic holds up. I don't think it does.

[SaskaTchewan]

huh?!?

If you mean that male-born should only fight male-born opponents, and female-born only female-born opponents, I agree.

People should be able to self-identify as whatever they want AS LONG AS it doesn't impact anyone else. I self-identify as the Queen of England, still waiting for the keys of Buckingham Palace.

[FairIsFair]

Saska, your Majesty, I mean that the logic that says athletes of any kind should be grouped for competition according to how they say they feel inside, as opposed to what physiology they have, is similar to the logic that would say boxers should be classed by shared interests rather than by weight.

If it seems ridiculous that sports, including contact and combat sports, would be segregated by personality, then what is the difference between personality and gender identity?

[FairIsFair]

And since Outy didn't answer, I'll make it clear that I don't think 'woman' is a personality type. But people who believe in 'Gender identity' apparently do, otherwise what could 'feeling like', 'living as', or 'thinking like' a woman possibly mean?

[ChelleDawg2020]

It's an interesting idea. Maybe boxers could be "bid upon" by a public vote, that way the more interested the public were in a fight, the more the boxers would earn. There would be no hiding either, if the public say that Boxer A must fight Boxer B, they must fight or retire.

I would pay a fucking fortune to see Nicola Adams v Rio Ferdinand, for example, and I'd remortgage my house to see Chris Eubank Jr take on his dad.

The payouts to the boxers should be voted on by the public for a second time after the fight to ensure that neither of them "goes easy" on their opponent.

[coldcanary]

That Aussie rules player is built like a brick shit house! Is he really expecting to be accepted by other players in the league? I play in a women’s league for a non contact sport - I wouldn’t be happy about being up against a transwoman and I’m not exactly tiny myself.
The 60 minutes programme that covered this is getting shredded on Twitter at the moment for tweeting their congratulations. Many people predicting the end of the (fairly newly created I think?) women’s league.

[Aftershock15]

Scary comment on here 'whose chromosomes do not match their sex'.

Chromosomes define your sex - that’s the whole point.

And yes I do realise there are a very small number of XY individuals who are androgen insensitive so appear female, but this isn’t what we are talking about is it? Intersex always seems to get included in the debate by people in favour of a transgender agenda, whereas true intersex people seem to want to back away from the trans debate.

[FairIsFair]

Yes, chromosomes determine sex, and 'gender identity' determines.... personality?

Can anyone explain how organising sports by 'Gender identity' is any different to organising sports by personality?

[Stompythedinosaur]

I am not a trans person so I may not express this as well as someone with personal experience.

As I understand it, the feeling of being the wrong sex is not, as many on mn would have it, simply a case of liking 'girl things' or 'boy things'. It is a deeper issue than that. This makes sense to me, because I feel a sense of being a woman that isn't related to liking pink and flowers (I do not particularly like these things). I actually like many stereotypical male pursuits, but I feel clear that I am a woman.

So I don't think that gender identity is an issue of personality preference at all.

[bellasuewow]

Yadnbu op and this is why as soon as the gra is changed to allow men to self declare as women I predict that it will quickly be rescinded as only then will people wake up to the ridiculousness of allowing people to identify as whatever they want when we have segregation for good reason for protected characteristics like sex, race and disability etc.