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The Super Rich

(260 Posts)
malificent7 Mon 06-Nov-17 07:30:20

I watched two tv programmes on them last week. Many living in one of their many opulent palaces all saying they didnt think they should be taxed more.
Then all the news about off shore tax evasion. If i dont pay my taxes i get a court order from the council while i sit in my tiny rental.
Aibu to feel a tinsy bit annoyed? Nothing will change though will it?
Perhaps i nedx to work harder.

malificent7 Mon 06-Nov-17 07:31:17

Btw...im up to date will ALL my taxes.

Judashascomeintosomemoney Mon 06-Nov-17 07:38:55

Are you taking about the Paradise Papers? If so that’s not tax evasion. Offshore accounts in tax havens are not illegal and no nothing will change to make people pay more tax through government legislation because too many people involved benefit. Even if individual politicians are not doing it themselves then their parties probably benefit from donors and supporters who do. They can all make noises about the injustice but none of them will ever do anything about it.

Laiste Mon 06-Nov-17 07:43:30

Was watching about this on the news earlier.

Tax avoidance and tax evasion are two different things apparently. One's illegal and one's not. Either way the bastards are skipping paying tax.

That's my take on it.

What was the bit about Queeney and the 10 million? Anyone know? Missed that as i had to go get DD up.

GreenTulips Mon 06-Nov-17 07:43:41

It was an interesting program and I thought very 'Americanized' All about greed and wealth and so anyone else.
Particularly those talking about Zero hours contracts and having very little.

This isn't he Britain we al signed up for, the lowest being stuffed and the middle being squeezed (At least they used to be people who employed others and now can't)

Doobigetta Mon 06-Nov-17 07:47:36

You should be more than a teensy bit annoyed. The gap between the super-rich and the ordinarily well off dwarfs the gap between the well off/comfortable and the poor into insignificance. It's an international scandal and a disgrace and we should be out rioting in the streets. The lack of focus on it and the outrage about people on £100k a year is Marx's false class consciousness theory in action.

BabsGangoush Mon 06-Nov-17 07:50:10

At least the interest rates are starting to go up smile

Lockheart Mon 06-Nov-17 07:53:13

It’s not just the super rich. If you have a private pension there’s good odds some of your money is being held in ‘offshore financial centres’.

Tessliketrees Mon 06-Nov-17 07:53:31

If you hoarded anything else like the super rich hoard money you are considered mentally ill.

Tessliketrees Mon 06-Nov-17 07:55:43

Doobigetta

I think part of the problem is it's just beyond the realms of our imagination. It's easy to get annoyed/defend benefit fraud or tax brackets for people who earn 100k. I can't imagine a billion pounds, my brain can't compute that level of wealth.

makeourfuture Mon 06-Nov-17 07:56:08

and no nothing will change to make people pay more tax through government legislation because too many people involved benefit.

There have existed, and exist today, progressive tax systems where burdens are shared more equally.

It can be done.

Stop electing Tories.

MamaOfTwos Mon 06-Nov-17 07:58:21

Everyone on this thread is HONESTLY saying that if they had a perfectly legal, above board way of having more net income from the same gross? No. It's sour grapes! I'm not wealthy but these threads follow the same trends as threads on landlords and anyone earning over '£xk'

Tessliketrees Mon 06-Nov-17 08:00:04

MamaOfTwos

Yes I can honestly say I wouldn't, I wouldn't now on my income which is a modest amount more than the national average. I certainly fucking wouldn't if my income was in the 7 figures.

Just because you are selfish doesn't mean everybody is.

maxthemartian Mon 06-Nov-17 08:04:11

I never thought I'd see the absolute scandal of extreme global inequality described as "sour grapes".

EvilRinguBitch Mon 06-Nov-17 08:06:39

#NotAllBillionaires
Gates, Soros, Buffett and others you haven’t heard of are on the record as thinking they should pay more tax (and in the absence of progressive tax laws are proactively giving away billions where they think it will do most good). Being super rich doesn’t mean you have to be a dick, unfortunately not enough people make that choice.

makeourfuture Mon 06-Nov-17 08:07:53

Everyone on this thread is HONESTLY saying that if they had a perfectly legal, above board way of having more net income from the same gross?

We have, as humans, a condition which makes us believe that everyone views things as we do. You feel tax avoidance is good. Many, however, understand the link between social expenditure and a well-functioning society.

Please take some time to consider your beliefs.

RainyApril Mon 06-Nov-17 08:10:09

It is human nature to want to protect as much of your own wealth as possible.

Not many people would volunteer to pay more tax than they had to.

Tax avoidance encompasses all of the perfectly legal ways to avoid tax, such as taking out an ISA.

Tax evasion is illegal and should obviously be pursued and penalised, as successive governments have repeatedly promised, and failed, to do.

Tax is tricky. No matter how much people earn, it has to appear fair. Historically, punitive taxation doesn't work because people who were perfectly happy paying 50% are going to look around for ways to avoid or evade 70%.

Tessliketrees Mon 06-Nov-17 08:19:17

Tax is tricky. No matter how much people earn, it has to appear fair. Historically, punitive taxation doesn't work because people who were perfectly happy paying 50% are going to look around for ways to avoid or evade 70%

It's interesting that we care about that type of fairness but not the fact that the whole thing is incredibly unfair in the first place. Somebody could work as hard as they can but will never ever have £10,000,000 which is a modest some in comparison to what we are talking about.

I'm not disagreeing with your point, I just think the psychology behind it is interesting. I tend to agree with Doobigetta.

GoingIn Mon 06-Nov-17 08:19:18

It's like they have so much money, insane amounts, but the more they have, the more they want to increase their wealth. Just because something isn't illegal, doesn't make it right. And many of these super rich are then hand wringing about global poverty and how the governments must do something. And they're right, governments should make this sort of dodging activity illegal and make sure everyone pays their share.

GinUser Mon 06-Nov-17 08:20:09

I am totally fed up with all this trial by journalism.
Tax evasion is illegal, but tax avoidance used to be called tax planning and is certainly not illegal.
I wish people would understand the difference between the two and not mix and muddle, much as Dame Margaret Hodge just did on the BBC.
And, quite frankly, it is none of my business how people choose to conduct their financial affairs, be they "poor" or "super rich".
This is just another example of the culture of envy, which seems all-pervading at present or possible the other side of the benefits' bashing coin? In particular you will notice that the emphasis is on tax avoidance not being illegal, but there is the "moral" question. who is empowered to make any judgements on that issue?
However, what I do find interesting is the non-dom question. About 30 years ago I worked in the financial services' sector and, in those days, it was very difficult indeed to change your domicile. Has the definition changed in the interim?

AllMyBestFriendsAreMetalheads Mon 06-Nov-17 08:21:59

I would probably mind less if the government hadn't been telling us for 7 years that the country is so skint that we can't even afford to fund our NHS properly - including telling nurses that there is no 'magic money tree' to pay them adequately for the work they do.

We should be ashamed of ourselves thinking that our country has no money, that we're 'poor' and yet we allow our politicians to constantly repeat this lie with straight faces.

But as our glorious leaders tell us, the roof is leaking and we need to fix it before the government piss all over us. Or something like that.

Tessliketrees Mon 06-Nov-17 08:22:35

This is just another example of the culture of envy

Oh do fuck off, I am not envious. I have everything I need. Many don't, there are people in this country who use foodbanks to feed their fucking kids. There are people in other countries who live in poverty that is unimaginable. I am not envious, I am furious that some twat who is only rich because of an accident of birth is quite happy to sit on their money while other starve.

1Mother20152015 Mon 06-Nov-17 08:22:57

HMRC published a paper very recently of an investigation into who some people (a minority) do not pay their full tax in small and medium businesses. This was one of the reasons - they justify their over claiming of expenses etc because of all this publicity of people either lawfully tax avoiding whch is a totally different thing or else illegal tax evasion.

HMRC see it as a bit of a problem - that tax payers will say untrue statements - like XYZ company does not pay all the tax they should under the law therefore I will not pay mine.

There are not very many super rich people around so people are always interested in them. What is the programme? If someone can name or link me to it I will watch it. Some of those people will be nasty, some nice, some act lawfully and some not just like the rest of us and programmes pick people who fit their own programme agenda.

Whocansay Mon 06-Nov-17 08:30:29

So you don't like offshore investments because they allow people to 'avoid tax'. Perfectly legally. Do you also feel the same about pensions? They also allow people to avoid paying tax.

makeourfuture Mon 06-Nov-17 08:36:02

I would probably mind less if the government hadn't been telling us for 7 years that the country is so skint that we can't even afford to fund our NHS properly - including telling nurses that there is no 'magic money tree' to pay them adequately for the work they do.

This is important. There are fundamental, real-world problems with social services. It is not envy to want a functioning healthcare system.

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