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To think Trump's vitriol over the NY attack is based solely on racism?

(87 Posts)
MycatsaPirate Wed 01-Nov-17 18:38:15

He has been very vocal over this attack, has called it evil, has said they need to send suspects to Guantanamo Bay, that he is a terrorist and they need to clamp down on immigration.

After the Vegas attack Trump said that the man 'was probably ill, had a lot of issues'.

Why the hell can't Trump supporters see him for the racist this man really is? It is sickening to see him leaping on any opportunity to push through a ban on Muslims entering the USA, even though I have no idea what race or religion the guy who was behind the NY attack was, but seems to forget that white men with legal guns kill more people in America all the time. And won't do anything to change that.

I actually despair.

Ausparent Wed 01-Nov-17 18:53:21

Because they don't want to. People are far more comfortable believing that evil is perpetrated by people who are 'other' rather than people like them.

It is the same tack used by Hitler and currently by nationalist parties all over Europe. Create an enemy and vow to fight it and people will believe you are doing what is best for them. It is harder to do in the US because there are so many mass murders perpetrated by white Americans so he needs to gloss over those and focus on those which fit his agenda.

If you look at the newspaper coverage of the murderers of Lee Rigby and Jo Cox you will see that we do the same in the UK. Her murder didn't fit the agenda so was covered differently.

It is sad and frustrating but although Trump is an extreme example, the USA is certainly not alone in this problem

milliemolliemou Wed 01-Nov-17 19:04:11

Shall we see? It seems the NY killer was following ISIS guidelines as per Nice, France and Westminster Bridge, UK.

But I agree that the US hasn't learnt to deal with the guns that kill music lovers, children etc or the other 33,000 pa - most of which seem to be accident or suicide, fewer the mass murders and gun crime.

Trump is not the man to differentiate. And clearly the majority of the people who voted for him don't either.

MycatsaPirate Wed 01-Nov-17 19:30:03

He barely said anything on Twitter about the Vegas attack and yet 50 odd people died and over 500 were injured. He just seems to gloss over this tragedy because the perpetrator was a white American man.

It makes me angry. He is going to use the NY attack as a way of claiming that they need the travel ban and to stop migrants from moving to the USA to prevent any further attacks.

There was a news conference today in NY where it was stated that this was the worst terrorist attack since 9/11. So what are they calling the Vegas shootings then?

How do we define a terrorist? Surely a terrorist is someone who commits murder and mass terror on people in the name of their beliefs? Or to cause upset to the Government? Surely the same could be said for the Vegas shooter?

Ruthlessrooster Wed 01-Nov-17 19:34:02

A terrorist is one who acts in pursuit of a distinct political agenda. The Vegas attacker had no discernable political agenda. Ergo mass murderer, not terrorist.

isadoradancing123 Wed 01-Nov-17 20:45:52

To be fair there wasn't much that trump could say about the vegas shooter, he didn't appear on anyone's radar, no obvious political or rekegious beliefs, just simply a total nutcase of a mass murderer, an isis supporter shouting alohal akbur, or whatever, is clearly a terrorist

KindergartenKop Wed 01-Nov-17 20:54:38

It was the worst terrorist attack in NY since 9/11. Las Vegas is in Nevada.

SuperBeagle Wed 01-Nov-17 21:05:12

Not every spree killer/mass shooter is a terrorist, because not every spree killer or mass shooter has a political agenda, and having a political agenda is integral to the "terrorist" label.

Martin Bryant, who shot 30+ people in the Port Arthur Massacre was not a terrorist. Anders Breivik, however, was.

Lweji Wed 01-Nov-17 21:08:59

The main difference is that they still said it wasn't the time to talk or make new laws about gun control (Las Vegas), but now NY justifies shutting down a visa programme and more "extreme vetting".

Totally different reactions even though both could lead to changes in laws and practices.

And, in fact, gun control in the US would probably save more lives than the fight against islamic terrorism, in particular "extreme vetting" as Trump has presented.

Lweji Wed 01-Nov-17 21:10:39

To be fair there wasn't much that trump could say about the vegas shooter, he didn't appear on anyone's radar,

He would have appeared if the many guns he bought had been recorded and flagged nationally, across state lines.

The question is why he didn't appear in anyone's radar, despite the number of guns he assembled.

And there was a lot that Trump could have said about him, from mental health provision to gun control.

EnthusiasmIsDisturbed Wed 01-Nov-17 21:14:21

Of course but at this point in time I can’t feel that worked up about his rants we read about his ridiculous ranting all the time this is just another added to the list

I do feel anger at yet again there has been another cowardly terrorist attacked on innocent people going about their everyday business

the attack yesterday was terrorism an attack on America

the LV attack there seems to be no political agenda

So of course the response is going to be different and would hardly expect Trump to call for stricter gun controls

Lweji Wed 01-Nov-17 21:15:59

would hardly expect Trump to call for stricter gun controls

Realistically, no.

But it stems from hypocrisy. Blatant hypocrisy.

isadoradancing123 Wed 01-Nov-17 22:13:51

Yes, but the fact that the gun laws are as they are, and gun control is needed, is a completely different topic

CaretakerToNuns Wed 01-Nov-17 22:17:52

YANBU.

If the attacker was a white male, Trump would have been silent.

Virtually all of this "anti-terrorism" talk is rooted in racism and Islamophobia.

bluebells1 Wed 01-Nov-17 22:20:34

What were all the Presidents doing about Gun Control, before Trump came to power? What was God's gift to mankind-Obama doing? Trump never ran on 'banning gun sale' platform. Not up to him to do that. Get the Dems who are foaming at the mouth to do the job.

And this guy in NY was an ISIS sympathiser who has brought in 23 of his relatives into the country. There has to be an end to this sort of immigration and no harm in not allowing any new immigration until the laws and background screening processes are further enhanced.

IvorHughJarrs Wed 01-Nov-17 22:20:40

I don't think it is down to racism, I think it is down to Vegas being largely unexplained and NY having a terrorist agenda

BarbarianMum Wed 01-Nov-17 22:22:57

Las Vegas is not (currently at least) classed as a terrorist attack because there seems to be no discernable political agenda behind the attack. It gets classed as mass murder and the American people are ok with mass murder.

BarbarianMum Wed 01-Nov-17 22:23:36

Sorry, a lt of American people are ok with mass murder. There are some dissenters.

redwinewhine Wed 01-Nov-17 22:33:43

Virtually all of this "anti-terrorism" talk is rooted in racism and Islamophobia

Islamophobia, a made up word designed to try and shield a stupid religion from any criticism whatsoever.

The truth is a fear of Islam is healthy, just like a fear of all religions is healthy. It pays to be suspicious of adults who believe in fairy tales that lead them to do stupid things.

Lweji Thu 02-Nov-17 02:28:16

So, what DID God's gift Obama do about gun control?
Apparently not enough to convince Congress (weighed down by gun lobbyists).

www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2017/jan/06/congress-blocked-obama-call-gun-control-mass-shoot/

No, Trump didn't run on gun control. But it's hypocritical to try and prevent one type of mass killing but not others.

Only mass killings by ISIS are a problem, it seems. Anything American born is MAGA, so ok, even if more people are killed.

Lweji Thu 02-Nov-17 02:29:42

It pays to be suspicious of adults who believe in fairy tales that lead them to do stupid things.

Like most of the current US Administration?
Although for some those gods are money rather than a supernatural being.

MrsTerryPratchett Thu 02-Nov-17 02:33:22

Why the hell can't Trump supporters see him for the racist this man really is? They can. They are also racist.

If you were pinned down in a crowd, trying desperately to stay away from the bullets... would you give the slightest shit what agenda your attacker had? No. Fact is you are massively more likely to be shot in the States by a white man with a victim complex than a Muslim terrorist. By multiples. So why are they obsessed by Islamic terrorism? Can anyone actually give a reason that isn't quite clearly prejudice?

NoTimeToDillyDally Thu 02-Nov-17 02:53:57

How America are able to have this man in such a position of power and influence, giving him a platform upon which to stand and incite racism and xenophobia on such a grand scale ... just beggars belief.

Want2bSupermum Thu 02-Nov-17 02:59:22

Actually a lot of people here are very suspicious of the vegas incident. It was clearly very well planned. The casinos watch everything. I can't believe how much equipment he got into the room with no one noticing or saying anything.

It could have been an ISIS attack or it could have been a Bernie fan gone wild. I think it's probably the latter. It certainly wasn't someone who was just a nut job.

SuperBeagle Thu 02-Nov-17 03:07:31

How people are still crapping on about "Islamophobia" after a couple of decades of countless people being mowed down by trucks, being held up in cafes, bombed in nightclubs and on the trains, flown into the ocean, and crushed by collapsing buildings after planes were flown into them beggars belief.

Terror attacks are happening in countries with strict gun control. It's futile to equate the two.

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