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AIBU?

To think it's a crime to steal from a dead woman?

25 replies

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:02

Posting for a friend for advice, with her permission.

This friend got treated terriblyy her ex. Beaten up repeatedly, one of the nurses said it was the worst cases of DV she'd ever seen at the hospital. She's the nicest person I've ever known.

She finally broke up with him at Christmas time. Unbeknownst to her, he had got a credit card out in her name. She checked her credit rating and realised what he'd done - he'd been paying it off in full, so being the lovely person that she is, she told them to block it and then let it go.

In April, her dear Mum died. A couple of months later when she was sorting stuff out, she realised her mums bank account had been emptied. When she looked at the outgoings, it was all to the credit card company. The fucking bastard had wrote down her mums bank details and had been paying off the credit card in her name with that!

She's just found out he's got another credit card in her name. Finally, she was convinced to call the police. They told her they couldn't do anything, as she wasn't the victim! It was up to the bank if they wanted to press charges! Never mind her clearly being the victim of identity fraud or suchlike, her and her brother were the sole benefactors of her mums money.

I can't believe this utter scumbag, who abused both her and her kind hearted Mum whilst she was alive, can get away with this!

I've advised her to go to CAB but would be interested for any advice. I'll send her the link to this thread.

OP posts:

Report

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:13

Nobody?!

OP posts:

SheSparkles · 16/10/2017 22:14

It's not the CAB she needs, it's the police-theft and fraud

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:15

Like I said, she called the police. They told her she wasn't the victim, the bank was - so she wasn't able to take it any further. Hence my suggestion of CAB. Ridiculous I know!

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TitaniasCloset · 16/10/2017 22:17

She needs to go back to the police but take a solicitor. What an utter bastard. Evil sick pointless man.

FenceSitter01 · 16/10/2017 22:19

It's fraud. Up to the bank to prosecute. However, if a fraud is proven, it is up to the bank to make good the deceased accounts.

I assume she did tell the bank her DM passed away and had the accounts frozen pending probate? Because part of the negligence will be the bank allowing the account to continue to operate once in receipt of a death certificate.

KarmaNoMore · 16/10/2017 22:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:24

It's fraud. Up to the bank to prosecute. However, if a fraud is proven, it is up to the bank to make good the deceased accounts.

I assume she did tell the bank her DM passed away and had the accounts frozen pending probate? Because part of the negligence will be the bank allowing the account to continue to operate once in receipt of a death certificate.

I have no idea if she did this. She's very young, as am I, and her mum died in a very tragic and unpredictable manner.

Even if she didn't manage to inform them straight away, and without him taking money from her mums account (which is disgusting), surely getting credit in someone else's name is fraud by itself?

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JohnHunter · 16/10/2017 22:31

She needs to escalate things with the Police. They do not need a "victim" to pursue a crime - they only need to know that a crime has been committed. It is a common misconception that a victim has to "press charges" but the Police will know very well that this is not true at all. Many crimes (e.g. possession of drugs) don't even have a clear victim.

Your friend is being fobbed off and needs to start making a noise.

JohnHunter · 16/10/2017 22:32

It's absolutely not "up the bank to prosecute". The Police should investigate the allegation and submit their findings to the Crown Prosecution Service whose job it is to prosecute.

VivienneWestwoodsKnickers · 16/10/2017 22:34

The bank are actually the victim now so she has to talk to the bank, tell them she wants the police involved and force them to report the offence.

McTufty · 16/10/2017 22:36

In relation to the stolen funds form the bank account, can the estate not complain to the police if they insist on a “victim”?

KERALA1 · 16/10/2017 22:36

Although when a random drained our bank account of thousands the bank reimbursed us and said it wasn't worth reporting to the police.

FenceSitter01 · 16/10/2017 22:38

It is fraud BUT the onus is always to protect yourself.

If the bank cant reasonably know the lady has passed away and the activity over the account was small amounts/similar pattern of spending then no alerts would be raised in house.

It doesn't mean they cant attempt to retrieve the money. There are two issues her. It is the bank that has been defrauded, which is largely irrelevant as it has a legal obligation to it's customer to protect the customers money. So, theoretically, once the bank decide a fraud has been committed they should put the account back straight. In reality they will try and wriggle out of this, hence me asking about the death certificate and the bank being notified.

Also, ring the banks fraud department (easily google able) and tell them exactly what happened. Keep it factual - like this - "" Mrs X passed on XYZ date. Mrs X did/did not leave a will. I (daughter) am trying to sort out her finances. I have just found an account I believe has been fraudulently emptied. I can see payments going to Y credit card. this is not my mothers credit card. These payments are made after her death - now this bit is important - you tell the bank you want a copy of their complaints procedure and details of how to contact he Ombudsman (you aren't going to do this yet BUT it does mean they will know you are serious).

Are you talking a lot of money? Normally they will write off anything under 5k for the sake of good relations and avoidance of bad publicity.

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:39

But he used the £600 in her mums account, she's still £500ish (forgot the extract amount) in debt from him now.

I'm just flabbergasted the police won't help with this. He's actually gone to prison for violence against her!

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plominoagain · 16/10/2017 22:41

If she goes to the police , the odds are that they'll refer her to action fraud , which is the national fraud and cyber crime reporting agency . They deal with all types of fraud , from identity theft to credit card fraud , and this is very much their bread and butter work . They'll investigate it in exactly the same way as the police .

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:42

We're only 24. My DF is a student nurse. It is a significant amount of money to her. Plus, it's the bloody principle! I had to convince her that she didn't need to invite him to her mums funeral after everything he had done, which she felt so guilty about.

And all the while, he was doing this god I hate him!

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Genevieva · 16/10/2017 22:49

After person a dies it is still possible for theft to be carried out against their estate. Who is the executor of her will? It is likely a family member or solicitor. This person needs to contact the police, report the crime and ask for a reference number. They also need to ensure that any banks or other organisations she has contractual relationships with know she has died.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 16/10/2017 22:50

Of course its a crime. She needs to report it asap. Stealing from the living is disgusting. Stealing from the dead is beyond corrupt. If he'll do that there's no limit to the corrupt sickening twisted things he'll stoop to.
God bless your poor friend. She's been through so so much, enduring his wickedness and losing her mum.
I hope and prey that she one days the happiness she deserves.
She's lucky to have you though. You seem like an amazing friend

moreshitandnofuckingredemption · 16/10/2017 22:52

Surely it's fraud from the estate, so it's not.just the bank.that's a victim?

ILostItInTheEarlyNineties · 16/10/2017 22:52

Your friend needs to report him for fraud and theft. While she's at it, he also needs to be charged with assault for beating her to a pulp.
He will continue to control and manipulate your friend, he's clearly an abusive arse.

fodosdjdnr · 16/10/2017 22:55

Your friend needs to report him for fraud and theft. While she's at it, he also needs to be charged with assault for beating her to a pulp.
He will continue to control and manipulate your friend, he's clearly an abusive arse.

She did get him arrested for assault, he went to prison for it. She's trying to get him arrested for fraud/ theft - the police are just trying to tell her it's not an option.

She's in a lovely new relationship, and is completely free from that vile, abusive man. I'm so proud of her

Just wish I could solve this shit for her. It's honestly the last thing she needs to be dealing with on top of everything else. I was so angry tonight when she finally told me!

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Judashascomeintosomemoney · 16/10/2017 22:59

After person a dies it is still possible for theft to be carried out against their estate.
It most certainly is, I know someone who has been to prison for this very thing. She needs to go back to the police, with the executor/solicitor, the police have misinformed her.

SusieOwl4 · 16/10/2017 23:00

She is the victim because she would have been the beneficiary. However I think the law has changed and it is the banks who initially deal with fraud and then get the police involved if necessary? It seems to be a way of hiding how prevalent fraud has become . Try the bank for advice or the solicitor dealing with the probate ? I would be taking it further definitely.

EnnieMcConville · 16/10/2017 23:10

I believe she is the victim of Identity theft....he stole her details to take out a credit card in her name.

The money stolen from her mothers account is theft against her mum and the bank has been defrauded.

I think she may have an issue due to her inactions when she first realised about the credit card in her name. A smarter move would have been for her to contact her bank and say a credit card has been taken out in her name without her consent. Copies of signatures would be on file, copies of the paperwork used etc.

People really do need to start protecting themselves instead of protecting the low-lifes that commit these crimes. In my book, if someone is so hard-nosed as to commit a crime against you, why would you be kind-hearted enough to let him off? At the very least, this will be a valuable lesson that will make her stronger in the long run, and wiser I hope. Its not a nice thing to have to go through :(

ILostItInTheEarlyNineties · 17/10/2017 07:55

She is completely free from that vile abusive man
You do mention that you had to persuade your friend to not invite him to her mother's funeral, she felt so guilty. It does sound as though he still has a hold on her and her perspective of him is skewed. Probably due to the abuse she was subjected to.
Do please encourage her to see him for what he is and pursue this.

If she broke up with him at Christmas, and he's now out of prison, then I'm shocked at the short sentence he received for such an awful assault.

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