Manager vs Manager

[IloveJudgeJudy]

I have just started a new job within the same company, at a different location, and doing different hours. It's a placement that could possibly lead to a permanent position.

When I was interviewed (by Grandboss and head of HR) I said I am completely flexible.

The hours are fixed at 5pm-1am. The operation is 24/7. There are 2 of us managers sharing duties. When I started the other manager asked what were my days off in my previous position - Sunday and Tuesday. She expects me to do every Saturday in this position! She said she thought I was flexible! I don't want to as it will have an extremely detrimental effect on my marriage as I won't really see my husband. She ideally wants every Friday and Saturday off and to work Sundays as there is a 50% premium for working Sundays.

I've said I'm willing to work every other Saturday/Friday, but she's not willing to do that. She wants me to be responsible for every Saturday with her 'helping me out ' if I have a specific appointment. I'm reluctant as I know I will get stuck doing every Saturday.

Atm we don't have a Bigboss. They are currently interviewing for that position so at present I don't really have a Manager to have 1:1s with.

In my previous position I did work a Rota, but within a bigger team and the latest I finished, barring any emergency, was 8pm so there was minimal impact on my personal life.

The other manager is not my line manager, but she is a signed off manager and I am not.

I really want to get this sorted asap. It's playing on my mind all the time and taking away from the enjoyment of this new position. I think we need to sort this between ourselves as adults without involving higher management, but I am at a loss as how to continue.

She's told me she's single and she said most single's nights are on Fridays and that's when she mostly sees her friends. She also told me that Saturdays are for couples (I wasn't aware of either of these! - Been married too long)

AIBU to not want to work every Friday and Saturday night?

Please help. I really am at my wits' end

[DarceyBusselsNose]

Go to HR and ask them to mediate.

[Madwoman5]

Another vote for hr. Being flexible does not mean you have to cover the same shift every week. She is taking the piss. Let hr sort out this dispute

[PuntasticUsername]

Ha, she is being ridiculous. She is not more entitled than you to particular days off just because of aspects of her personal life.

Have you pointed out to her that if you have to go above her to get this resolved, she's not at all likely to come out of it looking good? (I mean assuming sanity and no unfair influence on her part, on those decision makers).

[IloveJudgeJudy]

Thank you for the replies. So you think I should say that we should go to HR if we can't sort it?

[DarceyBusselsNose]

Yes, you don't have to do it in anantagonistic way. Just ask for clarification of shift patterns

[Justbreathing]

yes definitely got to HR
They will work out what's fair. I'm actually surprised you're supposed to work it out between you, that way always fails.

[Cakeycakecake]

Hr. Now!

[Sprinklestar]

You just split 50/50. Can't see why new colleague would think any differently! To me, being flexible means you'll step up and help out, e.g. if she can't do a Saturday of hers cos of a wedding, you'll cover and so on. It doesn't mean she gets all the good shifts and you get the dregs!

[Pandoraslastchance]

Does your contract mention anything about weekends? One of my past managers tried to screw me over by making me work every weekend so I went though my contract and the policies and found a lovely paragraph which stated I was entitled to one while weekend of in 4.

But definitely go to hr, 2 managers means you split the weekend shifts (both the undesirable Friday night's and the extra paid Sundays)

[Twistmeandturnme]

If Fridays are for singles, Saturdays are for couple and Sundays are paid more then the default should be: you work every Friday, she works every Saturday, you alternate the Sundays, and swap around to help each other out for special plans or invitations.

[honeybeetheoneandonly]

I would explain to her that being flexible means you agree to cover every other weekend (not sharing unfairly). I would also say that you don't want to fall out over this, so if you cannot come to an agreement you rather get an impartial third party (HR) involved before this is causing bad blood. That way she can mull it over and if she still doesn't agree / wants to take her chances than she knows this will be solved by HR. If you just go to HR behind her back she might resent you for it.

[IloveJudgeJudy]

Hi, all. Thank you so much for your replies. It seems the consensus is to go to HR. That's a bit of a shame as I had hoped that we would be able to sort it between us, but you've all really just confirmed what I thought we'd have to do.

Should I hold out or speak to her today? What do you think? I've never had to really deal with someone who's so unreasonable. In my previous place we'd all really help each other out and do equal amounts of earlies, lates, etc.

[honeybeetheoneandonly]

If you can solve it amicably between you than by all means don't involve anyone else but pp have suggested HR because it sounded like you were close to a Mexican standoff. Talk to her today in a friendly manner and if the conversation goes nowhere, take it up with a higher power. Out of curiosity what was the deal for her previously? Did she always have those days off?

[FuzzyOwl]

I would speak to her again today and say that you are intending to go to HR as you are unable to agree. That might make her have a rethink and be more reasonable so it doesn't need to go that far.

[IloveJudgeJudy]

I couldn't speak to HR yesterday as no one was in. This evening my colleague and I have to sort out the next 4 weeks' rotas. I'm going to see how that goes. I will update. Thank you all again for your suggestions.

[IloveJudgeJudy]

So, I spoke to HR who told me that the other manager had already been to see them. They had told her nothing would be decided until an upper manager came in. He has been appointed and is awaiting release from his present position.

I just don't understand why she didn't tell me she'd been to HR and what they'd said.

I'll keep you updated what happens when the new upper manager arrives.

Also, she's done the next 5 weeks' rotas, giving herself 3 Fridays and Saturdays off on the trot. Should I object, or use it as evidence of how flexible I am?

[IloveJudgeJudy]

Sorry, should have said every 3 Fridays, but we're down to work every other Saturday

[scottishretreat]

If you can possibly email rather than speak, I'd email her, and cc HR, saying that as discussed you are not happy with the imbalance in the rota, and would like to agree a fairer balance for weekend working.
If you're willing to put up with this for the current rota, I'd then say that in the spirit of cooperation you will support the proposed rota for this period, but that this does not mean that you are happy with this as a long term pattern, and that you will still seek to reach a fairer plan when management are able to help.
I think that would be a useful marker, to ensure that she doesn't try to argue that you implicitly accepted her plan by not making a fuss!

[50ShadesOfEarlGrey]

Think about what you would want from the shift pattern, and how you can 'sell' that as being flexible and equal. If it were me I would want to work every other weekend, so Friday, Saturday and Sunday, then totally off the next weekend. Everyone knows where they are, who's working when, across the year it equals out in hours and pay. All this depends on total number of hours etc. and flexibility would be required for holidays.

If your organisation has to provide cover 365 then you can look ahead to Christmas/New year and work out what is best for you and therefore when this arrangement should start!

[IloveJudgeJudy]

Thank you both for that great advice. I'll do that tomorrow. I've got to play this carefully. I'll keep you posted. You've been so helpful.

[SeamstressfromTreacleMineRoad]

OP just bear in mind the fact that if she's been to HR without telling you, she'll also probably try to meet with your new manager to sell him her point of view before you can speak to him.
As Scottishretreat said - put it in writing now that you wish to meet to discuss an equitable division of labour and ensure fairness.

[scaryclown]

I think go to hr with a reasoned plan sharing dates and express concern that it seems to be for a very alcoholic social life but you also need time for the family. Anyone with any sense can see this is a manager who needs their commitment to the job questioned. I've worked with dicks who say "'I never work Fridays' or 'i go out on pay day so you need to do it' these type of people need top down instruction.

You could try saying your plan to them saying look this is the only way this will work, but don't get into an argument just say OK so you refuse this, ok.. And go to HR..but with a, 'look I've been as reasonable as I can, could you support me to make this sensible' head on

[scaryclown]

Just keep saying 'I would do it if it were fair, but it just isn' its making me work so that she can socialise.. And I can't which is unfair.

[FuzzyOwl]

I would imagine she wanted HR to agree with her and when they didn't she thought that getting you to accept would be enough. I would refuse the rota she has created and log a grievance if necessary. If you aren't already and have one, consider joining your union.

Be prepared for this to not be an amicable working relationship if this is what she is like.

[IloveJudgeJudy]

The other thing is, she wants every Sunday because of the pay premium. I'd be happy giving her every Sunday so long as I got every Saturday in return. If she doesn't want to give me that, I'm going to insist on every other Sunday, too, especially as it's an easier shift and doesn't really disrupt the weekend.