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AIBU?

To not let dd (10) see her grandparents?

28 replies

DianaMitford · 18/08/2017 12:39

Backstory = exH and I lived next door to his parents for years, hence I know them very, very well. They are difficult people at the best of times and ex FIL is a total fucking nightmare, e.g blaming exH for everything that goes wrong in his life, showing total disregard for the feelings of others and behaving inappropriately towards Dd (not in a very serious way). One incident stands out when dd had a tummy bug. She was vomiting on and off for about three days. She obviously didn't feel well but she was staying hydrated and there's nothing that a GP can do, we just had to ride it out. FIL came round on the second day and demanded that we take her to the Dr. We explained that no, she didn't need to go and why, whereupon he knelt down beside her and said "If I was looking after you I'd make sure you were seen by a Dr, I would look after you properly sweetheart." Needless to say, there was an argument and bad feeling from that and other things that existed for weeks. This man has fallen out with EVERY member of his family and ALL his friends. Quite literally. But he never sees that it's him that is the problem. He is truly unpleasant and ex MIL hovers in the wings ready to console him and agree that it's all someone else's fault.

Fast forward a few years and ex FIL had two, small, strokes in the space of six months. After each one he was confused and didn't recognise his surroundings or exMIL or exH.

About a month later it was Christmas and dd went to stay with GPs with exH. Ex and I agreed that she wouldn't be driven by exFIL at any point due to the strokes and the risk they presented. Ex was very clear about this to his parents.

Dd comes home and my spidey senses are tingling. I casually asked her whether exFIL had driven her at any point and she said yes and described where and when. I was livid and phoned ex and he told me no, exFIL had not driven, that he had personally watched his mother drive out of the car park. Questioned dd a bit more and it turns out that exMIL had driven out of the car park then stopped half a mile down the road and swapped so exFIL was driving!!!
At this point we stopped contact, very shocked that he deliberately went against our instructions and deceived my ex in doing so. There was a big family rift and ex was furious with them. There was a text conversation between me and ex IL where I confirmed that the no contact was a joint decision, made carefully in order to protect our dd. The texts read something like this;

exFIL: "Please don't contact us ever again, we are in contact with (ex) and will discuss things with him."

Me: "I'm afraid that when it's to do with my dd I will be contacting you."

"I've asked you once, nicely, and now I'm TELLING you - do NOT contact us again,"

All communication between dd and GPS stopped and we gently explained to her why. I was absolutely seething. Not only did he ignore our wishes but he put dd in jeopardy, I don't think he was actually allowed to drive at that point either. Ex said that "That's it between me and my parents." Which surprised me because he'd never said that before.

About 3 months later ex asked if dd could phone gps. I said no and explained why and he reluctantly agreed. I felt that any contact at this point would be misconstrued as acceptance of their behaviour. These people are really, really not nice. This is out of character for me, I usually bend over backwards to make sure that dd sees all of her extended family.

Yesterday ex announces that he's planned a stay near his parents and he'd organised a dinner with them. All planned and sorted without asking me because he knew I would say no. We could have discussed it and perhaps found a way around it but like his parents, he's showing total disrespect for my wishes as her mother. Which means I can't trust him. He's condoning their behaviour and the way FIL spoke to me.

So the dilemma is this - do I stop her going on the break (not a holiday as such and she's already been abroad this year) and possibly upsetting her? Or do I trust my instincts and not let her go. Ex has said if she doesn't come to the dinner then she can't logistically come for any part of the break. I now don't trust ex or his parents as they've both shown sneaky behaviour. RL friends have suggested letting her go with strict instructions for her to stay with ex at all times. But after organising this dinner behind my back, I now don't trust him at all.

Basically it comes down to - do I think that there's a real risk to her? Yes.
Could I ever forgive myself if something happened? No.

I don't know what the future holds but I do know that I can't be going forward into anything involving gps dd things stand now. I'm not being petty or spiteful, I have genuine concerns and I feel that my ex has total disrespect for my feelings.

Gosh - so long! Sorry.

OP posts:
onalongsabbatical · 18/08/2017 13:32

Oh, surprised you haven't had any replies. I completely agree with you. Your FIL would surely have been not allowed to drive in these circumstances, and for them to go round the corner and swap divers and then for him to drive with your child in the car is outrageous. People are often far too tolerant of such behaviour because they don't like upsetting people. As you say, if anything happened, you couldn't forgive yourself. You're being a good mother and putting your child's safety first. I can't see an argument for doing anything else. I would do exactly the same, and however hard, I'd stand my ground on this one.

onalongsabbatical · 18/08/2017 13:33

Further, your ex is being rather spineless.

DianaMitford · 18/08/2017 13:36

Thanks Sab :)

What my ex does with his parents is up to him but when it starts endangering my child, then that's a different story....

OP posts:
Nuttynoo · 18/08/2017 13:37

Is your fil banned from driving? Having a Stroke doesn't automatically mean a driving ban. I think you aren't be unreasonable to want your dd to he safe, but that if you don't know the full medical picture you should make more of an effort to play nice to get it. I also agree that you shouldn't be contacting your ex's parents - your ex needs to do all the leg work here.

notevernotnevernotnohow · 18/08/2017 13:37

I would agree with you in theory, absolutely. But practically, when your ex has his time with he, he can take her to his parents and there is nothing at all you can do about that.

User843022 · 18/08/2017 13:38

I agree the driving incident was totally unacceptable but i dont think you should stop your ex taking his dd to see his parents really. Even if she's had a holiday this year, a break with her dad when she sees gps would surely be enjoyable too?

KimmySchmidt1 · 18/08/2017 13:38

Firstly, it is massively alarming that a grown man married a woman and then moved in next door to his parents - that is, at best, wildly ill advised and at worse a sign of an unhealthy attachment to them. Can't believe you stood for it tbh.

Secondly, I dont think you are being unreasonable. This guy sounds creepy, and your son does not seem to have an adult relationship with him. Many father son relationships are toxic, it is rarely spoken about and the meme is that mums are nasty but the truth is dads can be equally, if not more damaging to sons. You got out of that weird family and if they are going to exclude you they cannot expect to have ownership rights over your daughter.

PeppaPigTastesLikeBacon · 18/08/2017 13:39

I wouldn't let DD go. 10 is too young for her to make her own choice in terms of telling her dad she won't get in a car being driven by exFIL and I couldn't allow the chance of it happening. ExPIL seem happy to go against both yours and exDPs wishes so I don't think you are being left with a choice really!

User843022 · 18/08/2017 13:40

'Ex and I agreed that she wouldn't be driven by exFIL at any point due to the strokes and the risk they presented'

Also, tbh it's usually hcps who advise regarding this, as strokes can affect people very differently.

PollyFlint · 18/08/2017 13:41

I would probably be inclined to let her go to the dinner provided she isn't alone with the grandparents at any time, which it sounds like she won't be.

How does your daughter feel about her grandparents? She's old enough to be able to say if she'd rather not see them. I can absolutely see why you don't want her spending time alone with them if they can't be trusted with her safety but I don't think going for a meal with them in the company of her dad is that much of a problem - I think preventing her from having any relationship at all with them seems a bit much.

Don't get me wrong though; you are right to be furious over the driving thing. You must understand that it's easier emotionally for you to cut them completely than it is for your ex-husband though.

Siwdmae · 18/08/2017 13:43

What your ex does with your dd and who he takes her to see during his contact time does not concern you and he can do as he pleases, unfortunately. If he's willing to be told, you can stop him taking her, but if it's his time, then you don't have a choice, really.

User843022 · 18/08/2017 13:43

'You got out of that weird family and if they are going to exclude you they cannot expect to have ownership rights over your daughter.'

When the dd is with her df I think they can in fact expect to see their dgc. Not 'ownership' obviously.

booloobalooloo · 18/08/2017 13:45

I agree with you about the driving. Fil should not be driving if he's been told he's not to drive by the dr. If you can't trust him not to do this then you keep her away from any situation where he might be able to drive her.
But...
The holiday is your ex's agreed contact time yes? So I don't think you can or should make the decision that she can't go. Do you trust your ex to keep her safe? If no then no more contact and you go to court. If yes then you leave to make the judgement. They are going for dinner, not a long drive in fil's car.

FizzyGreenWater · 18/08/2017 13:46

As she's 10, yes I'd stop her going.

Not least as I suspect that the inappropriate behaviour you've described will no doubt go into overdrive once they have her away from you and it will be a confusing and possibly upsetting evening for your DD with FIL in her face telling her 'Your mummy wants to stop you seeing us darling but we're here for you, just go to your daddy with any problems and HE will let you see us...'

Undermining you and getting in between you and he co-parenting, and getting in between you and your DD.

You do need to speak to your Ex about it though. Bottom line is - people like this are corrosive. Tell him - your DD is getting older. Spark contact back up and just watch DD get less and less respect for you as she starts to see how awful their behaviour is and how they like to undermine her mum. Right now, he and you can co-parent. Put his parents in the mix and you possibly won't be able to do so as well. Tell him to think about where that leaves him with his DD, and whether in a few years he's going to find his daughter making excuses not to spend time with him as she doesn't want to have to field crap from her unpleasant grandparents hovering in the wings.

AnneLovesGilbert · 18/08/2017 13:47

Have you asked your ex why he's had this change of heart? From what you say, the two of you were on completely the same page about NC at the time, so there must be a reason he's changed his mind. I'm not suggesting knowing would help but it's worth a go. If you normally coparent amicably it seems strange he's taking this line now, but then he's been the product of their particular family dynamic his whole life and without you as a sanity checker maybe he's being dragged in.

Has he continued to see them while all this has been going on?

Objectively, he's an equal parent and if he's considered responsible enough to look after her normally, he's capable of looking after her while his parents are around and if it takes place in his contact time there's nothing you can do.

But as he's said if she doesn't go to meal she can't go for the rest of it it doesn't sound like he's throwing his weight around, and anticipates her not going.

Apart from the driving, which I'm sure ex is as worried about as you, hat harm are you worried will come to her?

I'm sorry they're such horrible people and I do completely understand your concerns.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 18/08/2017 14:12

OMG no YANBU.
I used to work for a man who had had a stroke, not a terribly bad one but it had rather knocked the strength in his right side.
Anyway, he was determined to drive again but at least he went the right way about it and took the test required for him to regain his licence (suspended on medical grounds) - which of course he failed spectacularly. He was hopping mad about it, but had no choice. He had a very nice sports car and wanted to drive it again but had to sell it as he wasn't going to get better enough to pass his test (he was quite elderly).

Your ex is being sneaky and yes, that would bother me too - but is he honestly likely to put your DD in danger again after going off the deep end last time with his parents? I get that you don't trust him because of the sneakiness, but do you really think he'd actually allow her to be in physical danger?

Happydoingitjusttheonce · 18/08/2017 17:42

I understand your daughter's safety is paramount but the decision on whether FIL is fit to drive isn't yours. However, I accept you would want to mitigate any risk. But not allowing your daughter to speak on the phone to get gp's is totally unreasonable. I get the sense that your dislike for the ILs is that intense that you are looking for a way to estrange your daughter from them and are hanging your hat on this. She should absolutely be alllowed to go with her dad to meet them.

EsmeeMerlin · 18/08/2017 17:53

To be honest I think you sound a tad controlling. You are not your dd's only parent and actually your ex does not need to ask your permission to take his daughter to see his parents on his contact time. He has deemed it acceptable and will be there the whole time. He went off on his parents when fil drove and that would be enough to tell me that he is looking out for dd.

He is showing disrespect for not thinking you have final say? Seriously by point blank saying no are you not disrespecting him as a father?

Whosthemummynow · 18/08/2017 18:02

I don't understand the "planning a meal behind your back"

If it was behind your back he would just take dd and not tell you.

He is your EXh and as such does not need to run his social life by you. I think you are being V V unreasonable by not letting your DD have dinner with them all. What do you think is going to happen??

Motoko · 18/08/2017 18:38

I remember when you posted about finding out that exFIL had driven your daughter.

Your exH was on the same page as you then. I wonder why he's changed his mind.

However, I don't think you should stop your DD from going and you can't dictate what your ex does with her when it's his contact time.

PotteringAlong · 18/08/2017 18:42

Why is she in danger if she goes to the meal? Surely her dad will drive there and back?

Booboobooboo84 · 18/08/2017 18:48

Tricky because his time is his and a meal with gps would be good compromise however it wasn't discussed with you it was presented as a fait accompli so I would say no to her going on this occasion.

Explain to your dp that your open to her seeing the gps in the future on your terms but that as your not being given the choice your dd can't go this time

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User843022 · 18/08/2017 19:01

'He is your EXh and as such does not need to run his social life by you. I think you are being V V unreasonable by not letting your DD have dinner with them all. What do you think is going to happen??'

Exactly. How would you respond op if your ex didn't like your rels and told you not to take dc there, surely you'd say MYOB?

PodgeBod · 18/08/2017 19:26

I think you are bu and you don't actually have any right to say that your ex can't take his daughter during his contact time. And ex-fil was right- they do not have to have contact with you at all.
Yes the driving thing was awful but surely ex is driving her now?

PodgeBod · 18/08/2017 19:41

But I think yanbu to be anxious about her going and seeing people who have been disrespectful to you and flippant with her safety.

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