To ask Irish & Northern Irish MNers what your views on the DUP/Tory deal are?

[stumblymonkeyagain]

There are a couple of threads knocking around on this topic where people are commenting on the impact on the Good Friday Agreement and peace in Ireland/Northern Ireland.

As an English person I won't pretend to understand the complexities and how it feels to you but wondered if you could share so I have a better understanding of the potential impact from your viewpoint?

Do you think it will impact the GFA?

How are people in Ireland (the island of...) talking about it?

[peachgreen]

We desperately need the money. So much funding was pulled or diverted during the Troubles and the aftermath. Our public transport is shocking, our hospital waiting lists are the longest in the UK, our road network is patchy at best etc etc. I wish I could trust the DUP to use it wisely but I don't. No doubt loyalist areas will see more of it than anywhere else, and not always for wise causes. I do think the deal goes against the Good Friday Agreement and I can understand nationalists being very aggrieved and I think there will be isolated incidents of violence - but I think in general the parties remain committed to peace. I think it legitimises Foster's position which is awful because she absolutely should have resigned after the RHI scandal and I worry that it will be almost impossible to form a Government here now. I am, however, pleased that the DUP are committed to a soft border with the Republic come Brexit and just pray that remains the case as a return to a hard border WOULD be disastrous.

It's a big mess. I wish we hadn't got the money in this way. But God knows we need it

[uglyflowers]

I agree with Peachgreen. I am also pretty dismayed (as a nice prod from NI) how much unionism is being conflated as being a 'terrorist' in the UK media. Even after all these years, the English haven't got a clue about NI.

[uglyflowers]

The DUP have a lot of dodgy beliefs but so do all the mainstream parties in NI. A soft border is good news though, so if they stick with that, it's good. Hope someone oversees the pit of cash to see that it is shared fairly.

[uglyflowers]

Pot - not pit

[PunjanaTea]

I'm not sure that the DUP can just decide to spend it in unionist areas. In fact I'm not sure anyone can make decisions on how it is spent without Stormont in place. Becuase it doesn't matter how much extra money there is if public services haven't got the means to gain ministerial approval.

[Eve]

... I am upset and angry by all of the anger directed at the Northern Irish people for voting for them.

NI has been ignored by the mainland for years... and now the country is getting some attention and much needed money..

...longest waiting lists in UK, highest suicide rate in UK, biggest mental health issues in UK,

and the anger being directed to the people of NI is wrong.

[AndTakeYourHorseWithYou]

how much unionism is being conflated as being a 'terrorist' in the UK media

If only there weren't so many links between the DUP and terrorism, hey?

[toooldforthisshirt37]

Put simply; Parliament is supposed to be neutral in Northern Ireland, the DUP are a party from "one side" therefore the Tories making a deal with them is seen as taking sides. I am concerned that this could be inflammatory to the more nefarious elements of the "other side". And what that could mean to the "peace.

As for the money, yes we need it (I can't speak for how much more than other areas of the UK though). But without Stormont - our local government - in place I worry how it will be spent.

I have to agree with AndTakeYourHorse, there are frightening links between the DUP and terrorists. They pretend there isn't, but homes were leafleted during the recent election with instructions to vote for their candidate by a prescribed terrorist group....and DUP refused to distance themselves from this organisation.

The Tories have gotten into bed with the DUP for their own benefit, they bought their loyalty, I can't see how this will benefit the people of the UK, in any of it's corners.

[Ozzde]

I've been wondering the last few days if some posters are hiding behind faux concern when really it's an anti NI sentiment. There seems to be so much anger directed at us.

As a gay woman the DUP don't even feature on who I vote for and I hate the fact it is them - however I am trying to remain optimistic that at least NI voices are being heard in some small way, especially when it comes to Brexit. We do desperately the need the money - health care waiting lists here are shocking for one.

Do I worry about how it will impact on the GFA? Yes of course, the paramilitaries on both 'sides' have not gone away although the loyalist side seems to be more concerned with feuding amongst themselves atm I cling to a vague hope that times have changed and we will not return to violence as it was before. However there is that very real possibility.

[nornironrock]

I'm so pleased that money will be coming in to our wee part of the world; as others have said it is certainly needed. Regardless of which side of the divide you sit on, we can all only hope that the money will be used wisely. For my part, I hope Stormont is back up and running as soon as possible. As Sinn Fein won't get involved in Westminster, they need to be involved somewhere - otherwise we just go round in circles.
Unfortunately, in my experience, the vast majority of English just don't understand the situation Northern Ireland, and that's where a lot of comments come from. It amazes me the complete lack of education given to children in schools about our own country!

[sashh]

Eve

I have no problem with the people of NI. I do have a problem with TM giving away £1Bn in what looks like a bribe.

It seems to be all one way, here's the cash spend it how you want rather than here's the cash but you must do X, Y and Z.

It would have been a perfect time to say you get the cash when the NI Assembly is sitting down and deciding what needs to be done oh and extend the Abortion Act to NI.

The DUP have only agreed to 3 or 4 things, that they would probably have voted for anyway.

I don't begrudge NI people the money, although it would be nice if other parts of the UK got some.

I think in England it is easy to think that everyone in NI has kissed and made up and all is good with the world.

Our news never mentions punishment shootings, but I know they are still going on.

People must have deep scars both physical and emotional from 25 years of 'the troubles'. If you sit down to dinner and the mother of your children isn't there because of the troubles you are still going to feel it now. If you have life changing injuries you will still be feeling it, if you saw something you may still see it in your dreams.

I admire NI people who have tried so hard for peace and have had to try to make agreements with people who may be responsible for the death and injury of their loved ones.

NI people do not love their family any less than the rest of the UK, a murder tears a family apart whether it is part of a series of murders or if it is a one off, whether it is politically motivated or a a psychopath.

I have no anger towards you, just admiration. I hope the money is well spent where it is needed.

[angemorange]

Glad to see some money coming into infrastructure of NI - don't think the DUP will be able to give it to 'one side' - there will be more accountability.
Some heinous comments about Northern Ireland people in general over the past few weeks in the press which hopefully will become more moderate.
Unfortunately Labour couldn't form a government on this occasion - the situation is what it is. I'd imagine the DUP would have voted with Tories anyway so extracting £1.5 billion is piece of negotiating genius. If I were a Brexiteer I'd be worried about the poor negotiating skills of the Maybot and her team!

[peachgreen]

I really hope the DUP can't just spend it where they like but they've certainly got form! I am a bit dismayed by some of the language in the agreement e.g. the bit about not investigating the crimes of police and army officers during the Troubles. Highly, highly partisan.

[SilentlyScreamingAgain]

It's hard to find independent reporting on just how much NI costs the British tax payer, it's seen as being fairly inflammatory. However, the people of NI already receive more funding than any part of the U.K.

This article is from 2011, well before the current bribe was on the table.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-14845296

This Economist article, from 2015, fleshes the problems out a bit more:

www.economist.com/news/britain/21640334-guns-mostly-silent-ulster-can-begin-deal-its-lamentable-economy-new-kind

[MissDuke]

Interesting links silently, thanks. It is strange, from being on mn, I have felt we seem 'worse off' over here financially. We have high rates of disability and poor health, longer hospital waiting lists etc. Infrastructure is poor in places and public transport is dreadful. I wonder what is going wrong.

The size of the public sector is definitely playing a part, it has reduced slightly but has a long way to go. The civil service is massive and very wasteful of resources. I worked there for years and was gobsmacked at the waste that went on and the high salaries. I am now NHS and the difference is shocking!

[FlaviaAlbia]

I'm dismayed at the DUP being in a position to make demands from the government and concerned that it could case problems for the peace process.

On the other hand, I think England and Wales voted for Brexit while the majority of NI wanted to remain so at least there's some compensation for that. We need the money as it's unlikely the British government will pay what the EU does.

Despite not voting DUP or agreeing with their politics, I'm getting a little tired of people who don't understand NI politics and history getting on their soapboxes. Suddenly going they don't like abortion, they don't like evolution being taught! They didn't give a toss when it didn't affect them...

[craftsy]

I am concerned that this could be inflammatory to the more nefarious elements of the "other side". And what that could mean to the "peace.

I'm actually far more concerned about how emboldening it is to trouble makers on the loyalist side. We've all seen how UK racists have been massively emboldened by Brexit. I've heard numerous personal reports from people in Nationalist communities now being subjected to similar verbal abuse by scrotes who are buoyed up by this new found sense of power. This has totally tipped the perception of the balance of power and that's just a damn dangerous thing to do in an area that has not had a chance to heal and grow after what was in actual fact a very long civil war.

[anonymice]

"how much unionism is being conflated as being a 'terrorist' in the UK media

If only there weren't so many links between the DUP and terrorism, hey?"
@andtakeyourhorsewithyou.
You seem to have missed the point @uglyflowers was making completely.

[SilentlyScreamingAgain]

In all fairness, you're a democracy with your own devolved Parliment. You vote for the DUP in massive numbers, they are the party with the biggest share of the vote in NI. It's not for Westminster to save you from the party you vote for.

Absolutely no one in England, Scotland or Wales voted for them, so it's much more reasonable that they're fucked off about it.

[Ozzde]

Quite Flavia, I have posted in the past on certain threads here about our laws and things our politicians have said with regards to abortion and the lgbt community and barely been acknowledged. Now all it a sudden it affects not just us it is a different story and we are getting it thrown back in our faces as if we are all the same. Some of us have been fighting years for changes and could have used support from those across the water.

Sorry bit off topic but it has got me cross last numbers of weeks.

[rockshandy]

NI really does need the money. However, it has left a bad taste in my mouth for several reasons.

1. Other parts of the UK also need money. Austerity has hit hard in many places and over the next few years we are going to feel the effects of that more and more.
   

1. It feels like bribery and I think its unacceptable that a democracy should be allowing a party to basically pay their way into government.
   

1. It unfairly sets NI up as a target for all the anger that people feel when actually there is a lot of ignorance about NI already.
   

I clearly cannot speak for everyone in NI but from the people that I know, my feeling is that people are voting for the DUP as they believe it is voting against a united Ireland. It's very much a case of "keep them'uns out" rather than actually voting in a party because you agree with their policies. If there was a referendum on gay marriage in NI I firmly believe it would be a landslide in favour. Abortion might be a harder win but attitudes are changing.

This whole deal just makes me feel really sad and dismayed at how NI is being portrayed. I love this country and we have so much to offer. But we are being seen as a bunch of religious nuts and its simply not representative of us as a whole.

[SilentlyScreamingAgain]

I clearly cannot speak for everyone in NI but from the people that I know, my feeling is that people are voting for the DUP as they believe it is voting against a united Ireland. It's very much a case of "keep them'uns out" rather than actually voting in a party because you agree with their policies

So people vote for a party for reasons of tribalism, (Dublin politicians can walk backwards quickly enough when a united Ireland is mentioned) and then when they carry out their clearly stated manifesto pledges, the rest of the U.K. should save you from them?

Does that honestly make sense to you?

[implantsandaDyson]

Tbh I too am getting more and more pissed off with people who are crying into their cornflakes about the DUP now that they feel it might affect their future. They couldn't really have given a shite when they thought the DUP were just in NI peddling their agenda but now its oh no they're such dinosaurs, they don't believe in equal marriage, abortion provision, parity - well no shit Sherlock - their policies are nothing new.

Its another mess that we who live in NI will have to live with - as I mentioned in one of the many threads that floated about after the election I'm out and about in Belfast a lot, in "interface" areas - there's a lot of crowing going out and a lot of hardening of attitudes.

[TeacherPresent]

I was talking to a chap from NI recently and he said that the two para sides were actually working more together and now had a different target...the muslims :( he specifically mentioned certain places as targets. I hope he is wrong.

[rockshandy]

the rest of the U.K. should save you from them?

I never asked anyone to save me from anything so wind your neck in.

You clearly have no idea of the intricacies of NI politics or any empathy towards a country that is still rebuilding itself after a civil war. In the last 40 years there have been far more pressing issues than abortion and gay marriage. People were being blown up while doing their shopping on a Saturday. Or being shot while they sat in a bar with their mates. Men women and children.

FFS I am getting angry now.