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(36 Posts)
Mmmmshop Sun 18-Dec-16 20:15:52

My SIL works for a local authority (England) managing a residential unit for adults with disabilities. Her unit is one of two in the authority.

The LA are 'restructuring'. One of the units (the other one) is becoming an outreach service. My SIL's unit is remaining exactly as it is now.

All staff from both units have been asked to reapply for their posts. My SIL and the other manager were interviewed today. The other manager has been offered and accepted the outreach manager post. My SIL has been told she was unsuccessful and her post will now be advertised externally.

As far as I can see, they've effectively sacked her through this process, bypassing all the procedures you'd usually need to follow to do that. The job she applied for had exactly the same job description as the job she's currently employed to do.

She's under the impression this is all cricket because it's 'restructuring'. AIBU to think this sounds seriously dodgy?

CherryChasingDotMuncher Sun 18-Dec-16 20:18:48

YANBU. I worked for a LA where restructuring was a great excuse for easily getting rid of people.

She does have rights, one of those rights is for her work to find her an alternative job within the authority on the same or similar wage. She needs to check the Agenda For Change policy and really get her ducks in a row

RobinHumphries Sun 18-Dec-16 20:19:19

Sounds normal for restructuring. My OH had to go through similar last year

DereksGotATail Sun 18-Dec-16 20:21:23

Standard practice in our place.

NapQueen Sun 18-Dec-16 20:22:55

Yep this is what happens. It's shit.

Our place is going through similar with three departments. One whole department was sold completely to an outside Co.

Waffles80 Sun 18-Dec-16 20:24:34

Is she in a union? If so, she needs to speak to them urgently.

If not, she needs to join a union in her next role.

EllaHen Sun 18-Dec-16 20:25:08

Does she have a union? If so, I'd be seeking advice.

Chottie Sun 18-Dec-16 20:25:35

Yep. This happened when I worked for a LA too.

zoobaby Sun 18-Dec-16 20:25:57

It is an easy way to get rid of people legally. Seen it with local authority and the NHS. There will some slight change to the roles/responsibilities or a different job title. That's how they get away with it. As cherry said, she should be able to join the redeployment pool, but that's always time limited. Perhaps she'll get a decent(ish) redundancy.

Mmmmshop Sun 18-Dec-16 20:27:14

Thanks for your replies.

What I think I'm unclear on is how they can describe her situation in particular as restructuring. Her post still exists in exactly the same form as before.

Timeforabiscuit Sun 18-Dec-16 20:30:02

Bit dodgy, i thought a restructured post had to be at least 20% different to a pre-existing one.

Pumpkintopf Sun 18-Dec-16 20:30:23

If her post is exactly the same then they can't -but I agree with pp there will probably be some slight changes somewhere that allow this process. Definitely agree with speaking to union if she has one.

Timeforabiscuit Sun 18-Dec-16 20:31:36

Does she have any legal cover through her house insurance? Chances of a redeployment are very scarce in local authority.

bunnylove99 Sun 18-Dec-16 20:33:29

You haven't said what they are offering your SIL instead of the post she has been unsuccessfully interviewed for. That might be key here.

DeciRed Sun 18-Dec-16 20:34:47

She needs to speak with an Employment Lawyer ASAP.

You could also post this under the Employment section, quite a few EL are in there, giving help. smile

Mmmmshop Sun 18-Dec-16 20:42:43

I'll suggest to her to get some proper advice, thank you. She doesn't know yet what she'll be offered instead.

Is it still a redundancy, though, is it, if her post still exists?

It's definitely exactly the same post - nothing at all has changed with her unit.

Bananabread123 Sun 18-Dec-16 23:53:04

I've managed many restructures, and if it's exactly as you describe, then i can't see how it is a restructure for her role as there is no change, and I think it's very unlikely that a local authority would make an error as blatant as that. I wonder if you know all the facts about the case. Is the role that your sister applied for exactly the same as the one she had, or does it have different or wider responsibilities that aren't obvious to an outsider?

Bananabread123 Sun 18-Dec-16 23:56:02

She does have rights, one of those rights is for her work to find her an alternative job within the authority on the same or similar wage.

Only if there is such a post available that she is able and qualified to do it. Her work do not have to find her a job vacancy that currently doesn't exist!

bittorrent123 Mon 19-Dec-16 06:26:36

I work in a similar type of organisation. This is fairly standard practice - however I have seen it done badly like this by a rogue manager and weak HR person. I'd get her to challenge it definitely.
Sorry she is going through this.

Motheroffourdragons Mon 19-Dec-16 06:35:13

I think she needs proper advice.
I don't think she can be made redundant if her job still exists, I thought the role became redundant, not the person.
Usually this sort of thing happens with restructuring when a number of jobs are disappearing.

Mmmmshop Mon 19-Dec-16 06:36:21

Banana - I've had similar thoughts and wondered if she's maybe describing it slightly inaccurately to me. If it's what she says then I'd agree, surely unlikely for a LA with access to good HR advice (and presumably a lot of experience in doing this sort of stuff) to make such a simple mistake...?

Thanks anyway for all your advice. I'll pass it onto her.

CasperGutman Mon 19-Dec-16 06:48:18

Only if there is such a post available that she is able and qualified to do it. Her work do not have to find her a job vacancy that currently doesn't exist!

Going by the info in the OP, in this case a suitable job certainly exists - it's her existing job, with the same job description! On the face of it, this seems obviously unfair. She needs to get professional advice ASAP!

ForalltheSaints Mon 19-Dec-16 07:09:39

Most restructuring I have experienced reduces the number of jobs but has been a reason to make specific people move or leave. YANBU.

mirokarikovo Mon 19-Dec-16 08:17:19

Yeah that sounds dodgy. At the minimum it is redundancy and normal redundancy terms should apply in terms of compensation and notice. However as the same role exists and is being advertised externally it isn't redundancy either and smells strongly of dismissal without going through proper disciplinary and performance management procedures. An employment lawyer and the union need to get involved asap.

mirokarikovo Mon 19-Dec-16 08:21:22

If nothing in that unit has changed then it basically isn't included in the restructure process - or have other roles within the unit changed?

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