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To wonder if a lot of people secretly hold views that are abhorrent (some offensive content)

(190 Posts)
onlythedaze Sun 23-Oct-16 09:26:29

I have been wondering about this off and on over the weekend.

I was in a quiet part of an airport lounge on Friday night, some children were running around and a couple near me made a comment that was mildly acerbic but nonetheless pleasant enough - along the lines of, thank goodness they aren't ours, and then in a very low voice, the wife said to her husband something offensive about the race of some of the children. They both laughed in a conspiratorial way.

They looked perfectly ordinary, well dressed, well presented, smiling, professional. Not BNP members or skinheads or whatever the stereotype is.

Now before anybody leaps on me for saying that I sound naive, I don't think I am - I think a lot of people are actually secretly very racist, sexist, homophobic but don't voice these views because they are considered taboo.

Or am I being dramatic?

ilovesooty Sun 23-Oct-16 09:30:32

No, I think lots of people hold views that over recent months they have been increasingly happy to express openly.

onlythedaze Sun 23-Oct-16 09:31:33

I really wasn't talking about the referendum hmm

MumOnTheRunCatchingUp Sun 23-Oct-16 09:32:10

I think it's a mix of both

papayasareyum Sun 23-Oct-16 09:34:35

believe it or not Sooty, racism existed pre Brexit hmm

SarcasmMode Sun 23-Oct-16 09:35:37

I think everyone is discriminatory in some way or another, some more than others.

I think it's human nature to put people in groups and see an us/them outlook.

I think most people's is mild and subconscious though with no hatred just ignorance, confusion or based on past experiences.

OliviaBensonOnAGoodDay Sun 23-Oct-16 09:35:40


Mishegoss Sun 23-Oct-16 09:35:55

I think you're right.

girlwithamoonandstaronherhead Sun 23-Oct-16 09:36:04

I agree, someone said something openly horrible about my family in public recently. Along racial/religious hatred lines. It was that fact that none of the people listening said anything about it that bothered me more. Perhaps it's what they are all thinking?

Andrewofgg Sun 23-Oct-16 09:37:25

And what people say to each other and don't mean to be overheard is nobody else's business; especially within a family.

There is in any case no such thing as a "view which is abhorrent" - all views are abhorrent to somebody somewhere.

SarcasmMode Sun 23-Oct-16 09:37:59

girl chances are they felt awkward and thought bringing it out would extend the discussion further.

If they did think negatively on something you can't help then let them get on with it.

robindeer Sun 23-Oct-16 09:38:04

We know you weren't but that doesn't make sooty's point any less valid, it is factually correct. I think many of us have been surprised at who amongst our acquaintance (especially through fb etc.) actually hold very xenophobic views, some openly racist with regard to refugees.

onlythedaze Sun 23-Oct-16 09:38:31

That was what I was wondering, girl - I thought, does everyone think along those lines but it's buried underneath a veneer of respectability?

FWIW the offensive comment related to two mixed race children so not a 'brexit' thing. I'm not denying that some racism, often quite overt, featured in the eventual decision but I'm certainly not convinced that the key influence was outright racism.

robindeer Sun 23-Oct-16 09:39:39

Yes papaya but either the reporting of instances of it has increased since then or the result validated those views to an extent.

ladylanky Sun 23-Oct-16 09:40:24

When I worked behind a bar a I was often suprised at the number of people whose small talk turned to racism or homophobia or misogyny. Some times just a mild turn of phrase (calling something "a bit gay" or using a phrase like "theiving arab" etc) other times its could be pretty nasty stuff. And this was often just in the couple of minutes chatter they had while I was sorting their drinks. Always really suprised me when it happened but it happened in every pub I worked in up, in every city and reasonably regularly. It makes me quite sad to think how many ordinary looking people not only held these views but happily trotted em out as a idle quip to a stranger

HardcoreLadyType Sun 23-Oct-16 09:40:46

No, I think you are right. I think lots of people hold these kind of views, but don't express them because they are worried what people will think of them, rather than actually questioning whether their views are actually reasonable.

I am very concerned about the current climate in this country, where it seems it is becoming more and more mainstream to hold intolerant and racist views. And you can hmm all you like, but the rhetoric leading up to the referendum, and government policy since, certainly have helped to lead to this phenomenon.

hmmmum Sun 23-Oct-16 09:40:53

That's a horrible thing to overhear 😞
I think some people do have points of view they don't voice in public because they're aware they're socially unacceptable. But I think if you spend any time with them you start to see it.
The only thing, you have to be wary that you don't think loads of people are secretly harbouring these views and then become suspicious of everyone when loads of people just don't think like this.
Girl with a moon that's awful, and like you say even worse that no one spoke up sad

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Sun 23-Oct-16 09:41:39

I think lots of people genuinely don't think along those lines. Of course people notice difference, it's the way we are wired, but we are not wired to think negatively about differences.

I think some people do but try to hide it as they know it is socially unacceptable.

I think some people are completely open about it.

I also think the second and third groups tend to assume that everyone is thinking it, even if they don't say it.

onlythedaze Sun 23-Oct-16 09:41:59

Okay, well we can end the discussion there.

The referendum meant frothing racists now exist when they didn't previously, and I am positive the couple wouldn't have referred to two mixed race children as 'half breeds' on June 22 hmm

OliviaBensonOnAGoodDay Sun 23-Oct-16 09:43:07

There is in any case no such thing as a "view which is abhorrent" - all views are abhorrent to somebody somewhere.

Sorry, totally disagree. There are some things which we cannot accept as a functioning society and racism is one of them.

hmmmum Sun 23-Oct-16 09:43:25

HardcoreLady I agree the current climate is grim, and over in the US too.

NataliaOsipova Sun 23-Oct-16 09:43:28

I don't know. To be honest, I worry a little that there's only a narrow range of "acceptable views" that can be expressed; not only because I think it's a threat to freedom of speech more generally, but because it's not helpful to drive these things underground. I think it's far better to have a situation where people feel able to express a range of views which can then be challenged. People therefore might change over time as they listen to the rationale of others....whereas being told "you're not allowed to say/think that" can be counterproductive. For example, at all the hoo-ha on the BBC a few years ago about the BNP chap being on Question Time. In my view, far better to let him to spout his views in a public forum as it gives people the chance to see for themselves how misguided he is. To ban him would have been to turn him into some sort of political martyr.

lostoldlogin2 Sun 23-Oct-16 09:43:46

Of course. Everyone I know (including myself) who has a black, Asian or mixed race child has had racism directed at them and their child....usually before the child is 3. Britain is a very racist place underneath the niceties.

witsender Sun 23-Oct-16 09:45:09

Well, you can't just 'end the discussion there'. That's not how it works! I really don't get why you are anti a side discussion, it is relevant.

girlwithamoonandstaronherhead Sun 23-Oct-16 09:45:59

sarcasm yes I'm hoping it was that really, and may well have been as we didn't say anything as we we're worried about the situation escalating so other people maybe felt the same.

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