to think the children of Anjem Choudary and his wife should be removed by social services...

[babygrandmother]

for child abuse?

Surely indoctrinating your children to hate non-Muslims, homosexuals, support ISIS and violence and calling Jews "filthy Jews" is child abuse and teaching the kids to be racist and homophobic affects their mental and physical health?

If children can be removed from foster parents who support UKIP, then surely children should be removed from parents who support ISIS and promote hate?

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/17/anjem-choudarys-wife-now-faces-police-probe/

[MumOnTheRunCatchingUp]

She occupies an odd little world. She should follow her husband to jail

Are burkhas and full veil worn in jail?

[wasonthelist]

Good grief, someone married him?

I am disappointed any time and money has been wasted on this no-mark (him) - convicting him is just playing his game.

Dunno about your Q, OP - I suspect a lot of kids would need removing from a lot of parents if these were the criteria.

[MrsJayy]

I think this is the same woman from a documentary i watched about extremist women she should be investigated yes and her children should be made safe

[MumOnTheRunCatchingUp]

Where would you remove the children too tho? Assuming they are by now at least partly radicalised already?

[brasty]

Children are rarely removed from parents because the alternatives have such poor outcomes for the children. Foster parents should rightly be held to higher standards. People will be turned down for fostering for not having enough bedrooms, a child would not be taken away from their parents for that.

[Tabsicle]

What brasty said. There is a lot of evidence about the damage that removing children from their families does - it's why social services hate to do it and only make that choice when there is clear evidence that the alternative is far far worse. And it's not a punishment for the parents. It's a last resort to protect children who are in danger.

[SolomanDaisy]

I can't think of anything more likely to radicalise children than removing them from their parents due to the parents' beliefs.

[Hirosleaftunnel]

Wow racist much? Let the woman bring up her kids how she sees fit. They can decide when they grow up. Their dad wasn't always so hardcore. yABU

[brasty]

Anyway if the kids rebel as many kids do, they will become stockbrokers.

[HeddaLettuce]

If children can be removed from foster parents who support UKIP, then surely children should be removed from parents who support ISIS and promote hate?

Are you confused somehow in the difference between parents and foster-parents?

Where does it stop? Do you remove the children of ALL fundamentalist muslims? What about fundamentalist christians? What about ultra-orthodox jews, or rabid UKIP'ers, or any number of other people with strong beliefs which they teach their children?

[MumOnTheRunCatchingUp]

But the Choudreys beliefs are Isis. Not Islam or any other religion

[HeddaLettuce]

And?

[MumOnTheRunCatchingUp]

So you condone that then?

[Porg]

Would removing the kids then allow them to develop an idealised image of their parents in their heads and make them more likely to return to their family at 18 filled with even more hate for the west? Ripping the kids from their families (in the kids eyes) would surely radicalise them even more.

I agree that this is Isis not Islam. It's like all Christians being judged the same as the Westboro Church weirdos or Jews being judged the same as the people settling in the west bank. Most religions have their extreme offshoots that aren't representative of the religion as a whole.

Buddhist extremists are the exception it seems. They get more peace loving. I don't follow any religion but the Buddhist monks always seem so damn happy when they dance past you dressed in orange.

[HeddaLettuce]

Condone what?

[GreatFuckability]

If you removed every child who's parents held racist beliefs, the care system would crack. YABU.

[babygrandmother]

Wow racist much? Let the woman bring up her kids how she sees fit. They can decide when they grow up. Their dad wasn't always so hardcore. yABU

How is it racist? Islam is a religion, not a race. There are plenty of white Muslims (in fact his wife looks like a white convert). And the only racists seem to be Choudary and his wife who hate Jews (a race), as well as hating anyone not like them!

[meck]

Oh dear.
But do we really need to know how much they were claiming in benefits, I don't see how that's relevant (though it is the Telegraph).

[VestalVirgin]

If we took children away from every couple that brings the children up with hateful views, then there wouldn't be enough foster parents to take them all in.
It's a nice idea in theory, but just wouldn't work. Even if we just removed girls from families who bring them up to hate themselves (any misogynist ideology), which quite clearly is emotional abuse, there'd probably be a lack of foster parents.

Perhaps someday it will be doable, but first we will have to work to reduce those behaviours to a manageable level.

Are burkhas and full veil worn in jail?

Prisons used to be segregated by sex, and are now segregated by gender, so she'd have to identify as male to follow her husband to jail.

Veils are probably worn in jail, as there apparently have always been male guards in women's prisons (I was shocked to learn that, it's sexual assault waiting to happen, but yeah, apparently that's a thing). Not sure how this is dealt with, considering the rules for prison clothes.

[maisiejones]

Meck. Yes, their benefits are relevant as they so obviously hate everything about our society yet are happy to benefit from our support system financed by our taxes.

[hungryhippo90]

It IS important to know what they gained in benefits, I read somewhere that the belief he holds is, that the more money he takes from the kalifah, the better, like the more you can take from the enemy the better.

I do believe that children should be taken away in this set of circumstances. I have seen a few articles of what ISIS supporters children come into contact with, AK47s and Machetes whilst being stood/placed by Isis flags (few months ago, daily mail- about a family from Luton)

However, what I will say, is that I believe that any child who is completely indoctrinated into any religion is unfair in my belief, whilst it teaches a child about one religion, one area, one sects beliefs, it also makes them ignorant of other people's beliefs, and also takes away the child's right to make a decision about what they believe is right for them... I think that's quite sad.

I don't think the children will be removed however. There are plenty of children facing worse abuse in this country that is ignored day in and day out.

[DaughtersofTriton]

YANBU.

[Mjingaxx]

What the fucking hell IS this thread??

Mumsnet has become rancid recently

[meck]

Hasn't it just!