Advice on coping with an obsessive mum and daughter?

[Franimal]

This has been going on for 9 months now. Apologies for long post. I am at my wits end and just looking for advice from anyone who's been through similar...

My daughter is 4 in Reception. She met a girl at preschool who is in her year but much older and bigger who has "latched on" to my DD. For this thread let's call her "other girl" OG.
At first I tried to dismiss my concerns thinking things will play out at school. Before Christmas, OG hit DD for playing with another girl. I informed the class teacher. Then things seemed better for a while but at the same time I had OG's mum following us around as if she were our shadow and watching us, encouraging this clingy behaviour. I pushed back politely as best I could. And trying to avoid too much contact, no more playdates after school and keeping conversation with mum to a bare polite minimum.

It has gotten worse recently. DD told me two weeks ago, OG is mean to her, calls her names and has hit her on two more occasions. DD also began using taunting language at home which she learnt from this child. OG also excludes DD's other friends from playing with them as other mums have approached me. DD tells me OG always sits next to her in school and she can't get away. DD has told lunch time supervisors she was hit but told to play with another child.

I have been into the school to have a meeting with the teacher who has not witnessed any of this behaviour but monitoring it for two weeks. At the same time, OG's mother approached me in the playground to ask why I declined a playdate with OG. I was caught offguard and although wanted to avoid a public confrontation I told her OG is being mean to my DD, hitting her and to keep away from us.

DD has been playing with other children. I thought things were getting better. Last week DD didn't want to cross the road towards OG and told me OG invited her over for a playdate which DD declined, I thought we were turning a corner and DD sticking up for herself and making right choices. But this week DD tells me OG is having a summer party with a bouncy castle and wants her to go. DD now wants to go but I do not want DD spending anytime whatsover with OG outside of school. It feels OG's stalker mum is desperate for our friendship is now resorting to bribing us with parties and I am being made out to be the unfair one by saying no.

Also OG's mum last week started to befriend my best school friend mum whom she'd never ever made the time of day for before... latching on to my other friends.

Help... I want to keep calm and polite but I don't know what to do? Do I need to be brutally honest to get her to leave us alone? I am meeting with the class teacher again this Friday to review things. I have requested they are put in different classes next year...

[DadDadDad]

My gut reaction on the party invitation is certainly to say no.

I think you can say to your DD that OG has been mean to her and you worry that she will be mean to DD at the party. As a tactic, it might be a good idea to book / plan a treat for your DD at the time of the party, to give you an excuse with the other mum, and to provide a diversion for your DD (so she doesn't feel "punished" for the OG's behaviour).

[DadDadDad]

On the wider point, I think the best thing is to keep ignoring / avoiding the mum, and keep addressing the OG's behaviour through the school.

[ProjectPerfect]

You told the other girls mum "to keep away from us" ?! And these girls are 4/5?

I think your over reacting in all honesty

[RainbowsAndUnicorns5]

I think you're over reacting
Your dd needs to learn how to deal with all sorts of people & personalities even people bigger than her
Telling people to stay away or keep away from play dates, parties etc is so silly honestly what is that teaching her

[RainbowsAndUnicorns5]

Dad youre suggesting op, as a grown adult ignores another adult
Wonderful advice

[crankyblob]

Mmm the level of hitting is extreme in this case but at the same time I think you could have handled it better than telling OG's mum to stay away!

Believe me when I say that girls and especially groups of girls can be quite spiteful in a school setting and if you go through school telling everyone to stay away, neither you or your daughter will have any friends left by year 6!

[jellyrolly]

The issue here is another child hitting your child as well as using manipulative behaviour in the class. I would go into school with something written down and a review date to put in the diary. Write down what you feel the unacceptable issues are and next to them what you would like to be done. The teacher may or may not be able to/prepared to do these. Agree to meet again in a couple of weeks to review the situation. I would also advise the teacher what you will be doing to support this at home. I.e. what you will be saying to your daughter and advising her to do. I would try and make it less of a drama otherwise your daughter will think this is how to behave in life. Explain to her that you will sometimes meet people you don't agree with. Ultimately she needs to find a way she is comfortable to be alongside these people. Walk away, go to a teacher, play with someone else. You know her personality best. If your DD wants to go the party then let her, go with her and keep an eye on things. If the mother asks her over again, I would suggest your DD is not as confident as she might seem about going and ask the other girl to your house then you can see the dynamics for yourself. You can't live in a bubble avoiding people, it's not very grown up.

[cloneroom]

I think you need to let the friendships take their own course. Of COURSE if your daughter is hit you need to speak to the teacher but beyond that your dd needs to learn to manage her friends.

I personally think you are not behaving fantastically!

[Snoringlittlemonkey]

I was with you until you started talking about 'stalker' mum latching onto your 'best school friend mum'. That's a bit childish don't you think? Your mimicking OG's behaviour there by insinuating that they can't have their own separate friendship away from you.

[TripTrapTripTrapOverTheBridge]

You are seriously over the top and plain weird imo.

Yep,the girl shouldn't be hitting. However, if your daughter was that scared she wouldn't want to go to her party.

As for the mum, if you could provide any actual examples of really weird behaviour maybe you would seem less strange. Just saying 'following us around' doesn't help - where? When you were with her daughter? At school? Trying to make friends?

[TripTrapTripTrapOverTheBridge]

Hang on, you think she's 'bribing' you with parties? Yep,bet she hired the bouncy castle just for you too

[crankyblob]

Your comments definitely do sound like one of the overly emotionally invested mums that most of us mums (and teaching staff) at my DD's school give a wide birth to!

Best try and work out how to cope with your DD's friendships, she will have many and you haven't seen anything until she reaches year 3!

[RunnerOnTheRun]

I have been through a very very similar situation. In my case the OG was super insecure (didn't appear it), she latched on to my DD and would pinch/hit her to keep her close if she started trying to play with others. OG would also whisper things like "lets not play with anyone else today" and "lets pretend we can't write our names". It took a while for me to buck up my DD and get her to stand her ground but along with teacher's help we did it and they never ever played closely together after that, and they are much older now. We also were able to do split classes after that which massively helped.

My guess is the Mum wants to set her "school Mum" friendships in stone very early on and wants the same for her DD. School gate politics happen all the way through and friendships between the mums are often set in stone early. The first year is the rockiest.

You're dong the right thing getting the school to keep an eye out. It WILL pass. Your DD is fine to go to the party, it should not be an all out ban on speaking to/seeing the child, you can't do that for the next how ever many years. You just have to tolerate it. She is so young too, it will not carry on like this.

Another tip from me, don't keep asking your DD about it after school. Let her tell you if she wants but it got to the stage that my DD would be like "Mummy stop asking!!"

[PaulAnkaTheDog]

You are waaaaaaaaay over the top. Also, how is she 'much older'? The hitting isn't on but you also sound a bit pfb and petty.

[paxillin]

If your dd is still afraid of OG, don't let her go to the party. Maybe the girls have sorted it now, especially since the teachers keep an eye.

Your jealousy at OG mum "latching onto (your) best school friend mum" is exactly what you accuse OG of though, isn't it? Your best friend can't play with OGM. Stop it right there, it's fine to do this at 4, but not as a grown up.

[Janecc]

In all honesty, I would really not want my DD to go. However, realistically if she wants to go, I would probably let her. She needs to find out how to deal with others herself and school is just the beginning steps of a long journey to adulthood. I would definitely be staying and monitoring the situation. From your perspective, it will be interesting to witness the dynamics and perhaps in the days after the party, you will have some words of wisdom to teach your DD about the behaviour other than "leave us alone". That said, if the mother becomes a genuine stalker then you will have to take steps. Right now, it sounds as though the mother is socially awkward and the child is too and they are coming across as aggressive and the girl doesn't know how to play properly. Parents sometimes dub a young child as a problem before they are very old. There is a boy in dds class, who sounds a bit similar to this girl. Some parents were telling their children to stay away and he was gossiped about. He hit and punched and hair pulled no end of children including mine on several occasions. He has since settled down now, he's 8. This is not a nice situation to go through for either child. I would be telling your DD to go and find other friends to play with if she is mean to her. I would also tell her she can play with the other girl if she is kind to her. Hopefully the little girl will find her place in the school and sometimes as adults, we need to be tolerant of little children even when they are so very unkind to ours. If she doesn't, your DD needs to learn some coping strategies and learn to stay away from her. The school will be able to help with this. I understand this is a very anxious time for you. DD and I have been through a lot of problems at school. I would also be declining play dates btw.

[DameDiazepamTheDramaQueen]

I disagree that if the OG was really mean then DD wouldn't want to go to her party.

We've had similar and ds was desperate to go because his mates were going. We were just ' busy seeing granny' that day so couldn't go

I absolutely agree with Dad's post - distance yourself and ignore and let the school deal with any hitting.

[littleGreenDragon]

DN had this - a happy out going child you did lots of groups suddenly didn't want to go as the child joined everything DN was at.

DN was punished for trying to play with other children by being hit. Dinner time staff were awful with it - insisted DN play with this other child or stop moaning about being hit. DN started to not want to go to school.

School were awful dealing with it - the other child had problems but then so did DN health and disturbed family at time and it wasn't DN job to sort the other child's problems.


DN Dad did what you did with the other family - stay away stuff had no impact. DSSis let her change groups outside school and kept on at the school - but really it was DN reaching breaking point and DN behaviour deteriorating and lash back that made an impact.

If you want to avoid the party - have something great planned as a family that day but if they are in different classes next year that is going to be a huge improvement anyway.

The other thing is children do fall in and out - and you do have to really consider if that what happening here or if it is more insidious.

Polite distance and being busy help and taking time to check calenders when blind sided all help. I had to dodge persistence invites for a sleep over for one of mine - she was only 5 at the time and didn't want to go but being constantly put on the spot was annoying and awkward - I had to change my route home some days as no and some very valid reasons weren't going in.

[chariotsofire]

All those who are dismissing your concerns obviously have never experienced this. I had a similar situation with my DD although there was no hitting of DD and her mum was not so intense.

My DD's friend tried to isolate her from her other friends by being unkind to them, and was very manipulative in the ways she would get DD to do as she wanted. They first met in reception and are now in yr 3 but thankfully in different classes. My DD says she does like her friend 'when she is nice' and of course loves all the expensive play dates she gets invited on. I have now started declining these on her behalf and not telling her she was ever invited as I cannot bear the thought of having to reciprocate. Friend's behaviour in the past has been so bad in terms of the way she talked to DD - quite disturbing in some ways, eg she would say in a sickly sweet voice, 'I'm sorry for my bad choices' but look totally unconcerned.

I did mention something to the school and know now I was not the only parent who did so and I believe this is why they are no longer in the same class.

In your case the hitting should be fairly easy to tackle, the possessiveness is harder to explain if the teacher hasn't experienced it. I can totally understand your daughter wanting to go to the party, my daughter found it very hard when I tried to explain that if she didn't want friend to come and play then she couldn't accept any invitations. Outright nastiness is so much more straightforward. My DD knows I don't like this girl's behaviour and DD does stick up for her other friends and won't tell them she won't be friends with them anymore unless they do what did asks (as suggested by friend) so I think all will be well in the end and hopefully they will drift apart.

As for the mum, she probably feels excluded to some extent and sees her daughter struggling and is trying to help her in a bit of a misguided way. Sorry I have no better advice, it is a tricky situation.

[Waltermittythesequel]

It feels OG's stalker mum is desperate for our friendship is now resorting to bribing us with parties and I am being made out to be the unfair one by saying no

Or, she's having a party.

You sound a bit mad to me.

How is she stalking you???

[PaulAnkaTheDog]

It feels OG's stalker mum is desperate for our friendship is now resorting to bribing us with parties and I am being made out to be the unfair one by saying no

Or, she's having a party.

You sound a bit mad to me.

How is she stalking you???

This.

[nobilityobliges]

Agree that you sound a bit OTT!

How can the girl be "much older and bigger"? It's a difference of a few months surely?

Of course the girl should not hit and tease. But realistically, they're 4, they're learning the rules and testing boundaries, if she's been pulled up on her behaviour there's no reason that she's going to continue with it forever. Fine to encourage your DD to have other friends and evennot be best friends with the other girl. But not wanting her to spend anytime with her at all is way OTT. If your DD wants to go to the party, just let her go and stay to supervise surely?

"It feels OG's stalker mum is desperate for our friendship is now resorting to bribing us with parties and I am being made out to be the unfair one by saying no." This... makes you sound insane. The OG's mum is not stalkng you nor having a party for her DD's birthday or your DD's benefit.

Also OG's mum "latching on" to your "best friend" - agree this makes you sound weirdly possessive of your friend. No reason that because your DD has had a falling out with the OG that her mum shouldn't make friends with another school mum!

[Bug2804]

I agree. Get over yourself! spending time on forum.. seriously!

[sunlover73]

My DD2 has a friend who cries if she doesn't get her own way, meaning my DD now tiptoes round her all the time. It is really tricky and def something they need to learn to deal with on their own (let's face it as adults we don't always cope with relationships/friendships head on either)
I agree that you could possibly have a couple of playdates on neutral ground, or even in a small group (say 4 friends back after school for tea? NEVER 3 odd numbers are lethal) and then you can properly observe how they interact before making a final decision of whether it's definitley an unhealthy friendship. Good luck either way - DD1 has sailed through school and has lovely friends, DD2 has found it hard all the way.

[sunlover73]

I didn't mean dealing with things totally on their own by the way - error there, but yes life isn't always sweet and lovely and there are some tough learning curves at school.