To not understand how people can justify it

(668 Posts)
ijustdontunderstand Mon 14-Mar-16 18:16:21

Okay, not a bun fight I just want to understand how those who vote Tory can think the cuts to disability benefits are OK.

This is NOT saying if you vote Tory you're a bad person, at all, I just want to understand. Will you vote them in again knowing?

EatShitDerek Mon 14-Mar-16 18:18:42

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

something2say Mon 14-Mar-16 18:20:35

In all honesty I think it depends, having observed how they are used at times. But I also think that the baby is being thrown out with the bath water and that's the real problem with things like this. People need benefits at times and it needs to be a good amount, but sometimes the system is abused and used because it's our apparent right.

Tiggeryoubastard Mon 14-Mar-16 18:21:17

Trouble is; is there a viable alternative? I've always been true blue but found it a hard thing to do. Not keen on this lot at all but Labour would fuck us over again, and nobody else has the infrastructure to run the country.
As an aside, an ill ex colleague of mine was left to rot as a result of Labours policies. They employed Atos to do their dirty work, which everyone conveniently forgets.

ConfuciousSayWhat Mon 14-Mar-16 18:23:08

Because labour ruin this country every time they get In power.

coffeeisnectar Mon 14-Mar-16 18:23:36

I've never voted tory and never will. But I've seen comments about people wanting lower taxes and feeling that if disabled people just made a bit of effort they could get a job.

I honestly don't think some people have a clue about a)living with constant pain b)how little the benefits are in the first place or c) how hard it is to actually get benefits such as ESA or PIP.

I think if offered £73 a week ESA and low rate care of £55 in return for debilitating pain most people would tell you to fuck off. But some prefer to believe the propaganda churned out by the media that we are living it up in big houses with money for holidays, free car and thousands in the bank.

Pedestriana Mon 14-Mar-16 18:25:24

Friend of mine has ASD, OCD, Bipolar depression, PTSD and a number of chronic health issues.
Because she CAN walk 40 paces (albeit in permanent pain) she is considered fit for work - her benefits are being cut and her means of transport (adapted car) are being taken away.
Effectively this means that going forward, she will be housebound.
Well done Tories, well done.

AStreetcarNamedBob Mon 14-Mar-16 18:25:30

Because the system is SO abused. It's not the fault of the Tory voters it's the fault of the people who go "on the sick" when they could easily work they're just lazy or don't bother trying at interviews.

We need a welfare state but it can't be a lifestyle choice it needs to be a last resort.

SimpleSimonThePieMan Mon 14-Mar-16 18:25:47

Absolutely, I'll vote for just about anyone to keep Labour out.

ijustdontunderstand Mon 14-Mar-16 18:26:33

Do you think it is the media though? I know some incredibly intelligent people who vote conservative and they do not seem the sort to believe that sort of propaganda

ConfuciousSayWhat Mon 14-Mar-16 18:27:56

I know some misguided intelligent people who believe the media and vote labour

Works both ways

LoisWilkersonsLastNerve Mon 14-Mar-16 18:30:15

Because the system is SO abused

So why don't they deal with stopping this rather than stopping/cutting benefits for the people who need them.

rosie1959 Mon 14-Mar-16 18:30:52

I also have never trusted Labour with the Economy
I don't agree with all the cuts to benefits but there is more to choosing a party than Benefits

Bailey101 Mon 14-Mar-16 18:31:05

One of the big issues is that people who abuse the system and lie to get benefits are the ones that make the news and get gossiped about. People don't see enough of those who are in actual need and it skews the perception of disability benefits - it makes it more about 'let's be sure the wrong people don't get help' instead of 'let's be sure the right people do get help'.

ijustdontunderstand Mon 14-Mar-16 18:32:28

Do you think that's it Rosie, people don't really agree with cutting benefits but don't see it as a 'key' issue?

PageStillNotFound404 Mon 14-Mar-16 18:32:38

The disabled portion of the welfare budget isn't "SO abused" though. The fraud rate is tiny, by the DWP's own admission. The government target for getting people off DLA/PIP involves cutting benefits to over 19% of claimants that, by the DWP's own fraud figures, they accept are genuinely disabled and in genuine need.

I think thanks to a broadly right-wing media, it's easy to swallow the line that there are more undeserving "scroungers" than genuine claimants. I can only assume that the decent Tory voters with a conscience continue to buy into that false perception, because then it's easier to convince yourself that only the shiftless, lazy, benefits-lifestyle-choicers (who are actually a tiny minority) will be punished by welfare reform, when in fact the reality means this is far from the case.

Oysterbabe Mon 14-Mar-16 18:32:59

Voting a certain way doesn't mean agreeing with every policy. Labour would definitely fuck up everything.

ijustdontunderstand Mon 14-Mar-16 18:33:44

Do you think the media is right Wing?

ConfuciousSayWhat Mon 14-Mar-16 18:34:01

The left are good at arguing by shouting people down.

Most people who vote tory I know don't agree with the disability benefit cuts. As a claimant I am shocked at the hype the left spout about it. Most of it is bollocks.

ijustdontunderstand Mon 14-Mar-16 18:34:34

So if they don't agree with it why vote for it?

ConfuciousSayWhat Mon 14-Mar-16 18:34:54

Ha ha ha no. The popular media but no I believe the left commandeer most of it and have stopped watching many programmes due to how biased they have become

LoisWilkersonsLastNerve Mon 14-Mar-16 18:35:05

If its tactics then why not vote LibDem

<runs>

ConfuciousSayWhat Mon 14-Mar-16 18:35:30

Because they agree with the other policies and labour are, frankly, shit.

ClashCityRocker Mon 14-Mar-16 18:35:31

I don't recall them saying they would be cutting disabled benefits as part of their manifesto. In fact I thought they said they'd be protected?

I didn't vote for them (lib dem here) but I don't think the majority of voters were sat gleefully rubbing their hands thinking 'sod you, let's get those evil disabled people next'.

My family (including disabled benefit-dependent mother) voted Tory in the main; they just didn't think labour was a viable alternative (never did I, to be honest). I do think they became a scapegoat for the economic crash - when in reality I'm not sure any government could have prevented such global financial chaos.

but it was the Scottish vote all going to snp that really damaged labour, I think. I might be totally ignorant, but I thought Scotland was almost exclusively labour until the last GE?

7Days Mon 14-Mar-16 18:35:46

Benefits is such a catch all term. And is seen by some as free pass to lie in bed watchijg goats on your flatscreen with the curtains closed all day. Anyone could tell their story on here and everyone would see the hardship imposed. People don't want the genuine disabled penalised but think the country has no money, and it's all the fault of some bloke they know who has a cushy number, with his bad back and his depression, and his tax free nixers. Not my view but resentment is powerful

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