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To think that this is the end of women's athletics?

(1001 Posts)

MNHQ have commented on this thread.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:38:57

And women's international sport generally?

Transgender competitors will be allowed to compete as the gender of their choosing pre-operatively and after just one year of hormone treatment.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:39:54

Sorry - forgot the link;

www.olympic.org/Documents/Commissions_PDFfiles/Medical_commission/2015-11_ioc_consensus_meeting_on_sex_reassignment_and_hyperandrogenism-en.pdf

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers Sat 23-Jan-16 21:40:37

YANBU, I think it's awful.

Men who cannot make the grade competing as men now have a second bite at the cherry, leaving actual women out in the cold.

Horrible.

honeysucklejasmine Sat 23-Jan-16 21:41:49

YANBU.

I don't believe that a bunch of male athletes are going to start taking oestrogen to win medals, but I do think that YANBU nonetheless.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:42:42

Exactly Ali. I actually find it very worrying.

I've said 'international' but of course national bodies will follow suit and it just feels like a dangerous precedent for wider society, somehow.

I'm really very shocked.

SurferJet Sat 23-Jan-16 21:44:59

YANBU - I'm absolutely shocked at this.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:46:19

I don't believe that a bunch of male athletes are going to start taking oestrogen to win medals

A insanely ambitious handful might (competitors can 'only' switch genders every 4 years, apparently), but even if they don't, transwomen have just been given a huge advantage over women in sport and athletics which is hard to justify, I think.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:47:03

An insanely.. (obviously smile )

Alibabsandthe40Musketeers Sat 23-Jan-16 21:47:53

honey you say that, but there having been situations in various sports already where pre-op transwomen have been allowed to compete as female. And they are basically men - tall, with deep set tendons that give them better strength when they are at full stretch and accommodate larger muscles. Pelvis better constructed for running because of not having to take a female reproductive system into account. So so many advantages, which are in no way wiped out by taking hormones for a year.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:49:11

Maybe creating a group of medal-winning, 'role-model' trans-sexuals is part of the appeal of the idea?

BombadierFritz Sat 23-Jan-16 21:49:23

Iran are going to do well next olympics. Bet a few other countries wont have any qualms either about forcing males to take hormone treatment.

honeysucklejasmine Sat 23-Jan-16 21:52:08

I don't disagree with you, it is blatantly unfair. It shouldn't be allowed. What I mean is, athletes who are transwomen will dominate sport, rather than men thinking "oh, what a good idea" and exploiting it to their gain.

At least, I hope. I may be hopelessly naïve.

I wonder... If men can now compete in women's sport... Will it be taken more seriously?

mudandmayhem01 Sat 23-Jan-16 21:52:17

There is a massive advantage in having been through a male puberty that will never be completely reversed by surgery or hormone treatment. Also if women from East Germany were willing/ coerced into talking male hormones to win medals, why wont men do the same.The pressure on young athletes from poor countries to use athletics as a way out of poverty for themselves and their families is immense.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:54:09

Quite Bombadier hmm The GDR was ahead of the times, apparently.

It's such a blatantly political decision (it makes no sense in sporting or medical terms). I thought the Olympic movement were supposed to be beyond politics?

They've certainly held out long and hard against complete gender equality.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 21:57:02

Oh both I think honeysuckle. A general massive advantage for M-Fs and opportunistic transitions.

World's gawn mad sad

TheFallenMadonna Sat 23-Jan-16 22:00:53

I don't know much about endocrinology. A quick google puts the maximum allowed serum testosterone at inside the reference range for men (although at the lower end) and considerably outside the reference range for women.

Behooven Sat 23-Jan-16 22:09:17

Utterly ridiculous

VagueIdeas Sat 23-Jan-16 22:14:56

YANBU.

No amount of hormone treatment could reverse the physical advantage that a male bodied athlete would have.

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 22:16:28

That being the case (awful in itself), Madonna, won't doping rules become hard to justify too?

Viviennemary Sat 23-Jan-16 22:16:59

I agree it's a mad idea. But the whole transgender thing doesn't make any sense to me.

IamTheWhoreofBabylon Sat 23-Jan-16 22:17:26

Perhaps the WEP will take this up
Oh wait hmm

GarlicBake Sat 23-Jan-16 22:17:36

Good lord, Fallen shock I've just checked that.

"2. The athlete must demonstrate that her total testosterone level in serum has been below 10 nmol/L for at least 12 months prior to her first competition"
(Olympics)

"Reference ranges:
Male: 10 – 30 nmol/L
Female: 0.7 – 2.8 nmol/L"
(NHS)

Some NHS trusts will not offer testosterone treatment to male men with 9 nmol/L!

Who the fuck authorised this? angry

TinklyLittleLaugh Sat 23-Jan-16 22:20:52

I really think women have to stand up for themselves here, threaten a boycott of the olympics or something. It is absolutely ludicrous.

honeysucklejasmine Sat 23-Jan-16 22:21:27

shock Those ranges are OUTRAGEOUS!

fidel1ne Sat 23-Jan-16 22:23:54

Agree Tinkly.

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