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to wonder what is wrong with Stella Creasy?

(79 Posts)
RickRoll Thu 24-Dec-15 01:28:32

Stella Creasy said that Donald Trump is not welcome in the UK, as he is a 'hate preacher'.

But when the US denies entry to someone, she's making a song and dance about how unjust it is.

She claims that there is a 'growing problem' of British Muslims being denied entry into the US.

This is based on the case of a man, his brother (no women on this trip, apparently at least one of the wives is in Pakistan), and their seven children, whose aborted trip to the US has been presented as a 'trip to Disneyland'.

It appears that one of the 'children' (actually 18) had a Facebook page saying he is a supporter of Al Qaeda/Taliban/violent jihad.

While the brother was previously denied admission to Israel (as I understand it, being refused entry to another country is generally a huge red flag for travel).

Stella Creasy has also come out in support of Shiraz Maher, a self-described 'Muslim extremist'.

While Ajmal Masroor is another complaining about not being allowed in

except that he has numerous links to extremist Islamist groups

AIBU to think that

(a) if you are going to complain about hate speech from the likes of Trump, you could keep your eyes open to hate speech from large numbers of people living in your own constituency

(b) to think that it's ludicrous to suggest that there is an active ban on Muslims entering the US, when thousands of Muslims enter the US every day, so coming out with a handful of examples of people denied entry doesn't really show anything

(c) that US immigration authorities do have the right to deny people entry based on specific intelligence (jihad support on social media, previous deportations, links to extremist organisations, and so on)


howtorebuild Thu 24-Dec-15 01:32:27

I didn't sign the Trump petition, as I believe in free speech.

I suspected there was more to the Disneyland story.

I have no idea what is going on with Stella, only she does. I guess as their MP she was helping and doing her job.

RickRoll Thu 24-Dec-15 01:39:32

She should certainly represent her constituents and try to get answers from the US, but clearly some of her constituents are in fact criminals/extremists/etc. and 'nation shaming' the US by suggesting that there is a ban on Muslims entering is offensive and also likely to drive extremism.

howtorebuild Thu 24-Dec-15 01:44:25

The FB page issue needs to be cleared up.
Stella is just making inquiries, looking for answers, maybe the fb page is show, so the family now have to deal with that.

theycallmemellojello Thu 24-Dec-15 06:24:37

The US authorities didn't give the family any reasons as to why they were denied entry, and Creasy didn't get any reasons off the US embassy, so she's asked Cameron to get the US to state the reasons. Perhaps there were legitimate reasons, but it's important that we know them and the family itself very clearly has a right to know them. If there does turn out to be something legitimate, fine. But turning away British Muslims with no justification offered clearly looks dodgy and of course we need to know what's going on.

jorahmormont Thu 24-Dec-15 06:48:26

From everything I've read, the Facebook thing is that a Facebook page with the same first name as one of the sons states the job title as "Supervisor at Taliban and Leader at Al-Quaeda". Pretty sure my sister has her job title as "Full time living legend at Hogwarts", and it's the same as all the idiots who put their "Studied at: UNIVERSITY OF LIFE" - just people being daft on Facebook.

Okay, we have to take threats seriously, but I doubt a 16 year old from London who puts his Facebook job title as "Supervisor at Taliban" is being serious. It makes a mockery of the border control if they're stopping people coming in for this. The father says that it's a fake page anyway, and only shares his son's first name.

Why can dads not take their kids on holiday alone? Possible that the mum is visiting family in Pakistan, seeing as that's where the dad grew up?

VashtaNerada Thu 24-Dec-15 06:52:51

She did know the family before this incident. Obviously terrorists don't go around publicising the fact but I think she's well within her rights as their MP to ask questions about it.

RamblingRedRose Thu 24-Dec-15 06:53:19

"Supervisor at Taliban and Leader at Al-Quaeda"... it's the same as all the idiots who put their "Studied at: UNIVERSITY OF LIFE"

It's not really the same though is it?

ObsidianBlackbirdMcNight Thu 24-Dec-15 06:59:38

You think this family were denied entry to the UK because a teenager wrote 'supervisor at the taliban ' on his Facebook page? Yeah ok

jorahmormont Thu 24-Dec-15 07:00:03

It's a fake job title/university title on Facebook written by someone lacking in common sense attempting to be funny. Yeah, I'd say it's the same, unless you're seriously suggesting that people are stating their membership of ISIS in their Facebook profiles now?

jorahmormont Thu 24-Dec-15 07:01:04

Obsidian Did I say that? No, I stated what the "Facebook issue" was according to every news report I've read about this. I have no idea why they were refused entry, just like the rest of us - I'm just saying that the reasons they've given don't add up.

sofato5miles Thu 24-Dec-15 07:01:11

You try making jokes with American immigration. See how that works out for you.

Enjolrass Thu 24-Dec-15 07:02:02

There were very good reasons that they were reused entry.

Putting Supervisor at Taliban and Leader at Al-Quaeda on your Facebook isn't funny.

I am from Northern Ireland and would never have my job listed as working for the IRA.

Someone who put that on their Facebook and finds it funny, needs watching imo.

And yes traveling to a family destination without the whole family is something they look at. Because it's unusual behaviour.

Me, dh, mum, dad and dbro travelled to Florida. Dbro filled his own Visa Waiver as he didn't live with mum and dad. So a single male, in is twenties, travelling into Orlando for a holiday (not work) raised flags. He was searched and interviewed when we landed.

They was nothing else that was a concern and when he pointed out he was travelling in a group they were fine.

The US authorities have a job to do and it sounds like they did it well, to me.

They never tell people why they are refused. Incase it causes a kick off in the airport. Also remember it's not the US authorities that stopped them boarding. The airport staff did, because there is no US staff there. So if the passengers kick off, it's going to be with someone who didn't make the decision.

I feel quite sorry forever whose job it is to do that on behalf of the US.

Enjolrass Thu 24-Dec-15 07:03:04

You think this family were denied entry to the UK because a teenager wrote 'supervisor at the taliban ' on his Facebook page? Yeah ok

No it was part of it.

jorahmormont Thu 24-Dec-15 07:05:02

It's stupid. But if we're putting everyone who writes something stupid on Facebook on some kind of "watch list", they're going to have no time to watch out for actual terrorists. If stupidity on Facebook is a terrorist marker then half of the UK should be barred from entering the US too.

annandale Thu 24-Dec-15 07:13:24

'Someone who put that on their Facebook and finds it funny, needs watching imo.'


Needs watching? Fucking hell, what is happening to us?

Shutthatdoor Thu 24-Dec-15 07:13:58

You try making jokes with American immigration. See how that works out for you.

^ this.

SevenOfNineTrue Thu 24-Dec-15 07:17:03

There is a large Muslim community in Walthamstow. She is simply trying to keep those voters on her side.

The U.S. don't deny entry for no reason. I suspect there is far more to this than we know.

Enjolrass Thu 24-Dec-15 07:42:43

Needs watching? Fucking hell, what is happening to us?

Yes they need watching when the enter the US. Saying you are part of a terrorist group is not funny.

Would you think it was funny if they said they were peadophile or rapist as a joke?

Enjolrass Thu 24-Dec-15 07:44:10

But if we're putting everyone who writes something stupid on Facebook on some kind of "watch list", they're going to have no time to watch out for actual terrorists.

Saying you are part of terrorist group is different to saying something dumbass on Facebook.

RamblingRedRose Thu 24-Dec-15 07:52:24

But it's like the people who say "Nothing to declare, except the bomb in my bag". Then they wonder why they end up in a huge pile of shit and aren't allowed to fly. It was just a joke after all. These are strange times, best not to joke about these things.

There is a huge difference between saying you studied at the university of life and "joking" that you are part of a terrorist organisation.

US immigration are really scary at the best of times.

aginghippy Thu 24-Dec-15 08:09:30

The US immigration authorities can deny entry to whoever they want. Only US citizens have a right to enter the country. They don't have to explain themselves to foreign politicians, even foreign prime ministers.

They may well have information about these people. They may have mistaken them for someone else with a similar name. The decision may have been arbitrary or discriminatory. We will never know.

theycallmemellojello Thu 24-Dec-15 08:18:02

We will never know. Well, hopefully we will know, as hopefully the UK government will ask. Yes, any government can do whatever the hell it likes with regard to its own borders. But that doesn't mean that OUR government doesn't have a responsibility to protect the interests of British citizens abroad, so if somewhere looks like it is being discriminatory in its border control, and this is affecting UK citizens, then of course the UK government needs get some answers and if necessary exert some diplomatic pressure.

theycallmemellojello Thu 24-Dec-15 08:20:30

To put it another way, the fact that the daily mail has published an article defending the US authorities does not mean that we should all be completely satisfied that the US authorities are not behaving in a discriminatory fashion.

annandale Thu 24-Dec-15 08:21:50

I know it's not funny, it's stupid, offensive and ridiculous. I disagree with what you say but I will defend to the death....

I would genuinely much rather die in a terrorist incident than have this level of surveillance. Unfortunately, we now have a high risk of both.

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