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to be fed up of people saying I don't care about innocent babies being killed re Syria

(72 Posts)
lifeinslowmotion Thu 03-Dec-15 13:47:34

Whenever people ask what my opinion is on bombing Syria and I say I agree with it I get a barage of comments about how I 'don't give a shit about innocent children and babies being killed' and 'how can any mother support killing babies?' Like I don't have any feelings whatsoever and it's one or the other. I can have sympathy for those that will undoubtedly get caught up in it and support the idea that airstrikes are necessary.

molyholy Thu 03-Dec-15 13:53:04

Why necessary? What do you see as the end goal and do you think it will be achieved? What is the strategy if this doesn't work as it hasn't in other countries? Why are lives of innocent people in this country more important than those in Syria?

Yes, you can be sad about innocent people being murdered, but what is your premise for condoning and supporting it?

Flingingmelon Thu 03-Dec-15 13:57:51

I may just be projecting my own feelings and beliefs onto you here, but can anyone really have a clear 'correct' opinion on this? If the experts are struggling worldwide (the proper ones, not the ones who just write for the papers) then how are we expected to have it cut and dried? And aren't innocent people of all ages getting killed either way?

It pisses me off how people think this is all so simple and clear cut. It pisses me off even more how people who think they know best can be such idiots and bullies about it.

ilovesooty Thu 03-Dec-15 13:58:11

Well you have every right to hold the opinion you do but it's unrealistic to expect not to have to justify it.

Enjolrass Thu 03-Dec-15 14:02:17

It's not clear cut.

Yanbu though.

It really annoys me when people, instead of debating with you start throwing insults.

I don't agree that's necessary. I am one the fence. But I don't she how insulting people helps.

lardyscouse Thu 03-Dec-15 14:02:24

The air strikes have been going on for 6 years now and the only result is people dying as they try to flee, dying as the have to stay and dying as ISIS bomb, shoot and maim in retaliation. Yup, that worked didn't it.

GloriaSmellens Thu 03-Dec-15 14:03:53

It's all bullshit. If you don't agree with bombing Syria, you are a terrorist sympathiser. If you do, then you are happy with babies being murdered.

Because everything is that black and white and clearcut hmm

Today is one of those days where I just really hate human beings and the things they are willing to do to each other. I wish I could be a hedgehog or something like that. Hedgehogs are nice!

PrussianPrue Thu 03-Dec-15 14:04:01

YANBU.

I'm not sure what I think is the best course of action but emotive arguments involving dead children are terrible and also slightly beside the point.

Children were killed in WW2 but taking on the Nazis was still the right thing to do.

I am NOT equating the conflicts but just saying that the potential deaths of civilians, whilst horrific, chilling to be talking about so dispassionately and to be avoided, does not, on its own, mean that engagement is the wrong course of action - and so is not a useful argument.

TheBunnyOfDoom Thu 03-Dec-15 14:04:18

They haven't worked so far, what makes you think our involvement will make the blindest bit of difference?!

misskelly Thu 03-Dec-15 14:07:20

Why do you support it? What do you think can be achieved? lots of other countries have been bombing in Syria for some time, it didn't prevent the terrorist attacks on Paris.

can anyone really have a clear 'correct' opinion on this? If the experts are struggling worldwide (the proper ones, not the ones who just write for the papers) then how are we expected to have it cut and dried?

Maybe the problem is that the experts who are providing an opinion aren't being as transparent as they should be. As far as I can see there are many agendas behind how to tackle the problem in Syria, who controls the oil? Arms dealers (and we are one of the biggest) and the sectarian element to all of this.

NicoleWatterson Thu 03-Dec-15 14:08:53

What about the boys being taken from villages (where their families are hostages) to fight for Isis. The girls barely into double figures forced to marry soldiers.

It's so bloody complicated, it's really not as simple as 'bombing babies' or 'terrorist sympathiser'.

Hoppinggreen Thu 03-Dec-15 14:34:49

So far they are bombing oil fields so the chances of civilian casualties are pretty low.
However, even if/when they start to bomb other targets I do support it. On a personal level I fear for inncocents of all ages getting caught up in the bombing but if this action will destroy or seriously destabilise ISIL then maybe it's the only option.

Crazypetlady Thu 03-Dec-15 18:27:20

Sorry I think YABU if the uk was being bombed for'necessary' reasons how would you feel?

Crazypetlady Thu 03-Dec-15 18:29:15

And how would you feel if it was your children at risk.

Enjolrass Thu 03-Dec-15 18:34:23

But the OP isn't asking if she is right or for a debate on the action taken is she?

She is asking if she is unreasonable to be called fairly awful names for having an opinion.

Crazypetlady Thu 03-Dec-15 18:41:59

It isn't nice to be called names but I understand why people feel strongly about people feeling the killing of innocent children and adults is just.

ThroughThickAndThin01 Thu 03-Dec-15 18:46:35

Yanbu.

As we've been involved in airstrikes for a while now, I think the hysteria currently over innocent people being killed is out of place.

No one wants this situation. Why castigate people over it. The terrorists must be thrilled.

kesstrel Thu 03-Dec-15 18:50:58

Many more innocents will be killed, tortured and made into sex slaves if IS are allowed to expand the territory under their control. There is no simple way of avoiding the death of innocents. I very much doubt that anyone believes the situation is "just".

PrussianPrue Thu 03-Dec-15 18:51:00

But Crazy that's sort of the point. Almost no one is going to want innocent civilians to be killed. But that doesn't necessarily mean that the bombing shouldn't happen. It's an argument that derails discussion.

I don't know what I think but ISIL have to be stopped one way or another. I wouldn't want UK to be bombed, obviously. But I wouldn't want to live under ISIL either. Who would? Neither of these are good options.

Accusing someone of wanting to murder innocent children because they have a different opinion on how to prevent the spread of ISIL and hopefully assist the Syrian people is not a constructive argument.

myotherusernameisbetter Thu 03-Dec-15 18:54:21

So are all the babies being killed by ISIS guilty babies then?

Enjolrass Thu 03-Dec-15 18:55:23

It isn't nice to be called names but I understand why people feel strongly about people feeling the killing of innocent children and adults is just.

calling names doesn't help get your argument across either.
It's shutting the discussion down.

If you oppose the action, talking to people who support it and have a measured discussion is more likely to make people see your point of you.

(Not you personally just talking in general terms)

SuckingEggs Thu 03-Dec-15 18:58:31

Agree with kesstrel

What happens to those being killed, tortured and raped by Daesh? Should we leave them to it?

myotherusernameisbetter Thu 03-Dec-15 19:00:45

I'm also a bit shock confused and hmm at all these pacifists sending people death threats.

I'm a bit on the fence tbh. I do appreciate that we have to show solidarity and strength and these terrorists have to be defeated. I am also aware that they do not recognise international boundaries so it's a legal difference for us since we are already bombing on the other side of the border that we recognise. But, i am also aware that the terrorist attacks happening in Europe are not being committed with weapons being held in Syria or probably not even planned in Syria so I don't think that bombing there will prevent these things happening.

However the fact is that people are already dying and being a pacifist isn't really any use in this situation. ISIS don't want to sit at the table and negotiate and they don't really care how many innocent people die.

ThroughThickAndThin01 Thu 03-Dec-15 19:01:29

So are all the babies being killed by ISIS guilty babies then

(succinct comeback myother.). ......along with all the guilty government workers, gay people, women aged oh about 50+ because they are too old to be used as sex slaves, musicians, artists, football fans. The list doesn't stop sad

SuckingEggs Thu 03-Dec-15 19:04:07

I'm relieved to hear some sense.

And it is appalling that people are being threatened with murder - by pacifists! FFS.

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