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To wonder if Jihadi John ever existed?

(143 Posts)
Babycham1979 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:39:15

Just that really. Another convenient bogeyman who was (even more conveniently) 'vapourised' from a distance.

We're constantly manipulated by the powers-that-be, and I can't shake the feeling that this case stinks.

Before you jump on me as a conspiracy theorist, bear in mind the following government-orchestrated events that were used to manipulate public opinion;
- abduction and murder of the Italian premier
- bombing of public squares in Italy
- hijacking of Cuban airliner and subsequent murders
- ongoing collusion, murder and torture throughht the NI 'troubles'

Am I alone? Should I be donning a tin-foil hat?

Jackie0 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:42:39

You are not alone .

rainydaygrey Fri 13-Nov-15 14:44:31

What was the Italian premier thing?

AnotherEffingOrangeRevel Fri 13-Nov-15 14:49:44

I don't know enough about the JJ situation to say much about that, but you're definitely NBU to wonder.

If anyone's in any doubt that these things happen routinely, I suggest you go to YouTube and have a listen to what Annie Machon (ex MI5 spy and whistleblower; very clever woman) has to say. Or read her book. We are fed a lot of lies.

JamesTiberiusKirk Fri 13-Nov-15 14:52:17

Not exactly sure what the "powers-at-be" gain from faking this entire person.

His childhood and subsequent radicalisation been fairly clearly documented. There are a lot of British muslims out there fighting for ISIS.

Don't see what's hard to believe about the whole thing.

Babycham1979 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:53:08

Alberto Moro was kidnapped and murdered in the early 1980s. It was blamed on left-wing terrorists but was later found by a parliamentary commission to be the security services to discredit the left-wing terrorists and prevent the formation of a government including the Communists. The same people undertook a bombing campaign and were linked to murders and bombings variously in France, Belgium, West Germany and (possibly) Northern Ireland.

Operation Gladio. You'd be justified for thinking I'm a David Icke nut-job, but this is all evidenced by parliamentary enquiries, criminal trials and reputable journalism.

Our rulers will do whatever it takes to manipulate us and keep us in fear. I don't see the whole ISIS pantomime as much different.

DirtyBlonde Fri 13-Nov-15 14:53:43

If he didn't exist, how do you explain the videos?

ThroughThickAndThin01 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:54:47

Who was appearing in the videos then? An apparition?

MyFavouriteClintonisGeorge Fri 13-Nov-15 14:55:00

Didn't that bombing campaign include the railway station in Bologna, Babycham? The bomb there killed 91 people. The memorial is very moving.

Babycham1979 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:55:42

James, I'm not suggesting he never existed. He could certainly be a patsy though, or an employee of the security services. Why not? Very few people believe Lee Harvey Oswald was a lone crazed gunman.

Very few people are convinced that Gareth Williams managed to insert himself into a holdall in a bathtub, or that David Kelly killed himself on a woodland walk.

Lostcat2 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:55:58

So were no hostages executed then? Why would the 'powers that be' make him up anyway?

Can't see the point.

AnchorDownDeepBreath Fri 13-Nov-15 14:56:14

While you're right that there has been previous cases of mass manipulation, I don't think JJ is one. For a start, it's much riskier now, with the Internet and dark Web. It'd be much easier to disprove things than it ever was before, when what the media said was just believed.

JJ has been caught on camera, on numerous occasions, too. I don't believe he was made up. He made the intelligence services look more ridiculous than they'd ever have allowed if it was planned.

Babycham1979 Fri 13-Nov-15 14:59:16

You can't see the point?

How about creating a bogeyman and an excuse to take part in yet another misguided military misadventure? We've destroyed Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan. Why should Syria be any different? Blair used the fabricated WMD dossier; Cameron tries another approach.

Gruntfuttock Fri 13-Nov-15 15:01:13

"I'm not suggesting he never existed."

The thread's title is "To wonder if Jihadi John ever existed?"

OTheHugeManatee Fri 13-Nov-15 15:02:53

I have a present for you, OP.

ThroughThickAndThin01 Fri 13-Nov-15 15:03:39

It seems off to me, disrespectful of his victims.

AnotherEffingOrangeRevel Fri 13-Nov-15 15:04:10

Clearly OP means the monster in the media. Not necessarily the man, who presumably wasn't named Jihadi John on his birth certificate.

Gruntfuttock Fri 13-Nov-15 15:07:57

Well obviously not AnotherEffing, his name was Mohammed Emwazi.

AuntieStella Fri 13-Nov-15 15:09:06

I'm not terribly clear about what OP means.

Os it that the videos were fabrications? If so, how did they come about?

It is possible (has been acknowledged by the authorities all along owing to style of editing) that JJ was the speaker, but not the killer (ability to speak good English being a separate skill to that of killing). But I've never heard anything to suggest that these videos were fabrications beyond that.

cdtaylornats Fri 13-Nov-15 15:10:54

creating a bogeyman

Why would they need to - there was no shortage of monsters in IS before him

AnotherEffingOrangeRevel Fri 13-Nov-15 15:11:16

Indeed, Grunt.

expatinscotland Fri 13-Nov-15 15:14:52

It's the same left-handed guy murdering a bunch of people on camera. But hey, conspiracy theories are more fun.

nancy75 Fri 13-Nov-15 15:16:33

To be fair OP I think Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya were in a pretty bad way before we joined in, none of them were countries that were applauded for their human rights or for their high standards of living.

ThenLaterWhenItGotDark Fri 13-Nov-15 15:19:37

Aldo Moro.

If you're going to delve into conspiracy theories, at least get the names right.

ThenLaterWhenItGotDark Fri 13-Nov-15 15:20:36

Oh, and he died in 1978.

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