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To wonder what the legal position is

(15 Posts)
countryandchickens Sat 18-Jul-15 20:54:50

Some years ago, a friend of mine split up form her husband and it was pretty acrimonious. He had contact, and after contact one day refused to hand the children back.

What shocked me was that the police refused to act, stating that it was a family matter.

Is that actually the case?

He took the children abroad (though still in Europe.)

I was young at the time and wondered what the legal position was?

MrsTerryPratchett Sat 18-Jul-15 20:59:44

It wasn't legal. Hague Convention.

ghostyslovesheep Sat 18-Jul-15 21:05:57

unless it was prior to 1983 - although still possibly illegal but probably not easily dealt with

countryandchickens Sat 18-Jul-15 21:07:48

No, it was definitely after 1983 smile Thank you. I'm guessing though that isn't the same within the UK - he actually took them to Ireland but I'm not sure whether it was the Republic or NI.

Euphemia Sat 18-Jul-15 21:08:46

Was this pre-1983 though?

Euphemia Sat 18-Jul-15 21:09:09

Sorry, cross-posts!

NeedsAsockamnesty Sat 18-Jul-15 21:11:22

it happens rather a lot the refusing to hand back bit without a court order you would be hard pushed to get any icy to do anything about it if the parent wot holding has PR.

Leaving the country is rather more problematic as you do need everybody with PR to consent

MissPenelopeLumawoo2 Sat 18-Jul-15 21:13:28

What happened in the end, did the children come back? must have been a nightmare for your friend.

countryandchickens Sat 18-Jul-15 21:15:34

Her DC3 did, but DCs 1 and 2 elicited to stay with their dad.

Her DC2 still won't speak to her sad

downgraded Sat 18-Jul-15 21:16:00

The Hague Convention doesn't apply to short trips abroad, so he was theoretically able to take them on holiday without telling her.

If he has PR it's extremely difficult. He can pretty much do whatever she can with the kids. I'd still be ringing the police if my kids weren't returned though, as it's totally unacceptable and worth getting documented.

downgraded Sat 18-Jul-15 21:16:43

How old were the kids? Did he have 50:50 custody? Did she fight to get the kids back?

countryandchickens Sat 18-Jul-15 21:19:21

They were 10, 8 and 4, I think.

I know she was originally the main carer but not sure of other details.

downgraded Sat 18-Jul-15 21:21:35

At that age I'd have been in court fighting for full residency and limited, supervised contact with him.

If he took a 10 year old and an 8 year old abroad and didn't come back then he kidnapped them.

If he did such a number on them that they no longer have contact with their mother then he shouldn't have had unsupervised access at all.

Didn't she fight him?

countryandchickens Sat 18-Jul-15 21:24:25

I'm not completely sure downgraded. I was young at the time - very early twenties - and the finer details went over my head somewhat.

It's always kind of scared me though.

downgraded Sat 18-Jul-15 21:25:42

Me too.

I've spent many evenings terrified that DD isn't going to be delivered home. 15 minutes after the agreed time and I'm imagining all sorts.

I can imagine how awful that must be. What a horrible man he must be.

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