AIBU to think this may be a red flag(s)?

(24 Posts)
YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:03:50

I work in sales at the moment but am looking to change jobs (staying within the sales sector) as i'm having problems with my current workplace which cannot be resolved so I'm searching for a new job. I attended a job interview today with a company that is starting up and needs telecanvassers coldcallers in their start up(obviously). initially they will only be hiring two. My interview was with the managing director of this company,
Problem 1- When asked what they were looking for in an employee answered with "erm, erm erm erm i just want someone who can get me x amount of sales per day"
problem 2- generally nervous attitude.
problem 3- this is apparently a self employed position, i dont know what this means as any information i can find online about being self employed is in relation to owning your own business- absolutely nothing about being self employed within a business. is this even possible? Is this a bad thing? (ive never been self employed before at all). The rate of pay offered is attractive as is the commission bonus per lead however something just feels off about the whole thing
Problem 4- this is apparently the 4th company he has been a managing director in and apparently regularly hires people on a self employed basis due to the high staff turn over (Cold calling isn't the nicest of jobs unless you have a knack for getting sales while being called a twat every 3 seconds) yet couldn't tell me how i'd go about registering as self employed, how tax etc would work... surely you'd know some of this at least to be able to give basic advice to new staff?
WIBU to refuse a job offer if there is one? It smells a little fishy for me and I dont know where else to get advice

DoJo Wed 01-Jul-15 01:10:12

A company cannot insist that you are self employed unless the role meets specific criteria - they can't just call you self employed so that you work without any security and they save money on tax and national insurance. I would be very suspicious of any role which sounds like a 'normal' job but imposes this kind of criteria, and the fact that all the other stuff sounds dodgy just confirms that for me.

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:52

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:52

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:52

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:52

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:52

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:53

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:29:53

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:30:48

I've known a few cold callers work on a self employed basis but its just that, a few so its never really caught my attention. I've worked in massive call centres with 100+ cold callers on the phones at any given time so that should tell you how few there would be around, hence I don't know anyone to ask but this just feels so fishy to me. I'm currently on 7 an hour plus 10 per appointment that I get and i currently sell a less "sellable" product than I would be able to sell in my new position, this new job is closer, easier to get to (half an hour on the train, only 5min walk either end as opposed to my 1.5/2hr commute that i have now) and is £8.25 an hour plus £10 every appointment i set. IF (and thats a massive if!) its a genuine offer I really couldn't afford to turn it down but i dont know what to do!
I also desperately cannot afford to take the job offer if one is given and find out a month down the line that it was dodgy in one way or another or get fired for no good reason (its to my understanding that self employment= less secure, correct if wrong) as then OH and I have 2 kids reliant on his 6.82 an hour... ugh

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 01:34:48

Sorry computer is being an idiot.

GloGirl Wed 01-Jul-15 03:12:18

£1.25 an hour more will cost you

Job security
holiday pay
sick pay
complicated HMRC paperwork

Etc, I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.

catlovingdoctor Wed 01-Jul-15 03:19:35

I definitely think you should stay in your current position. Sounds very odd and fishy.

Optimist1 Wed 01-Jul-15 06:26:43

Am I right in thinking that the £8.25 ph rate is before you deduct what you'd have to pay for tax and NI?

Regardless of the answer, I'd trust my instincts on this one and keep looking for a new position.

Balanced12 Wed 01-Jul-15 06:27:34

I've done this I ended up being commission based only if a sale retracts within so many weeks or month you loose your money so you end up with poor pay. They are transferring risk to you avoid avoid avoid

Golfhotelromeofoxtrot Wed 01-Jul-15 06:37:28

Don't do it. It sounds like he doesn't know what he's doing.

mummytime Wed 01-Jul-15 06:43:00

Having to deal with your own tax and NI will be a major hassle.

It sounds very dodgy.

But for example my local radio station is advertising for tele-sales,which would sound a much nicer job. Or look for a business to business sales job.

AntiHop Wed 01-Jul-15 08:16:45

Sounds dodgy. Is that higher rate before tax? Once you've paid your own tax it will be much lower. I've seen this so called self employed nonsense before. It is illegal to call staff self employed unless they are genuinely self employed ie someone who freelances on particular projects. Companies who do what the company you interviewed for are trying to get out of paying tax and avoiding employment rights. You'd have to do a tax return and as well as the tax you must pay you can pay extra tax to make up for your employer not paying that tax. Unless you do that you will not be entitled to job seekers allowance if you need it (the dwp use a recent tax year to assess if you're eligible based on a recent year. It it's a year you were in proper employment, then you're ok. )

plutonimum Wed 01-Jul-15 09:20:42

They want you to offer everything and want to offer you nothing.

"Self-employed" status when in a job where they dictate the terms of employment is legally dodgy. It means they want to avoid any obligation to you and stiff the taxpayer. What other legal and moral corners will they cut? No, no, no!

YUDOTHIS Wed 01-Jul-15 11:38:24

Following advice given here I decided to do some research into the company to see if they were a genuine company at the very least (as if offered a job i'd attempt to negotiate an actual job trial as this covers and protects against reasons given and would give me a little more protection/rights) I've discovered that this company isn't new at all and has been registered for 1yr 10months, is in negative equity (-34k) and isn't the first company of its name (with the same directors so not coincidence) The other companies were raking in millions a year and then inexplicably sinking and declaring bankruptcy and the businesses now are classed as dormant (can't remember the official term)... yeah i'm not working there.

plutonimum Wed 01-Jul-15 17:11:54

Thank God. In the post preview, all I could see was "negative equity" and I was about to come on to screech that I didn't think you could pay down THAT much of your mortgage with such a paltry pay rise and at such a dodgy company!

Well done for doing your due diligence! Hopefully everyone else will, too, and having run out of suckers, the company will fold for the final time!

arowhena Wed 01-Jul-15 17:31:16

Yes avoid at all costs, Google mlm sales scam and places like appco, sounds just like that!

dreamingofblueskies Wed 01-Jul-15 17:33:56

Sounds like the type of place that ends up featuring on Rogue Traders!

FadedRed Wed 01-Jul-15 17:44:59

Sounds like you really dodged a bullet there, OP!
Suggest you do a bit of research prior to interview next time, maybe? Always useful in an interview to know something about a firm, and many expect interviewees to have done their homework as this shows an interest in the job on offer. If you had done this with Mr Dodgy, you could have saved yourself the time and worry. smile

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