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to think some people have more human rights than others

(123 Posts)
Moreshabbythanchic Sat 20-Jun-15 09:21:30

BBC news, a suspected Somalian terrorist has had his tag removed as it is against his human rights. Apparently he thinks it is a bomb that could be detonated by MI5.

I think I've heard it all now.

infrequentposter88 Sat 20-Jun-15 09:33:35

Sorry to be doubting this, but could you post a link to the story please? Sounds a bit like Theresa May's cat.

AuntieStella Sat 20-Jun-15 09:36:16

BBC story here

AuntieStella Sat 20-Jun-15 09:37:00

If he is that delusional, I hope he is an inpatient somewhere.

LazyLouLou Sat 20-Jun-15 09:37:43

It is true... and, once past the wtf? aspects, it sort of makes sense, if he is delusional and has MH issues.

Apparently there will now be other surveillance put in place, so now he really will feel as though he is being watched, followed and monitored all the time.

Wonder if MI5 will rethink their little ankle bombs now?smile

RepeatAdNauseum Sat 20-Jun-15 09:39:39

I don't think he has more human rights. More delusions, apparently, but no more rights.

If you currently have a tag and also severe delusions about its purpose, you would be entitled to a hearing to potentially have it removed. It is not special treatment.

Trazzletoes Sat 20-Jun-15 09:40:03

So he's still going to be monitored, just not on a tag.

I don't think some people have more human rights than others. I think the issue is that some people have more need of having their rights protected than others.

WeddingNoNos Sat 20-Jun-15 09:42:41

Everyone should have the right not to suffer unnecessarily due to mental health problems.

Other surveillance measures will be put in place. If they'd just said right, you're free to go, I'd be inclined to agree with you, but this isn't a case of some people having more rights than others; it's making sure that we make reasonable adjustments to ensure that people's rights aren't contravened.

Trazzletoes Sat 20-Jun-15 09:45:36

And to be honest, if it's bad enough to breach Article 3, it will be bad for him, not just irritating or unpleasant. More like torture.

ghostyslovesheep Sat 20-Jun-15 09:45:40

everyone has the right not to be made mentally ill

StonedGalah Sat 20-Jun-15 09:47:09

I think l agree shabby. It sets a precedent and there will now be others hearing voices. My question would be did he had mh issues before or is he just being suspicious of the government?

Crocodopolis Sat 20-Jun-15 09:47:29

He is not "be[ing] made mentally ill. He is mentally ill and the argument is that the tag is making his delusions worse. Taking off the tag won't magically 'cure' him.

StonedGalah Sat 20-Jun-15 09:47:50

*did he have, not had hmm

Moreshabbythanchic Sat 20-Jun-15 09:48:10

There was obviously good reason to have him tagged in the first place but now he is going to be allowed to walk amongst us with the possibilty of doing harm. Is someone going to be with him 24/7, somehow I doubt it.

Either way, he has MH issues together with being a suspected terrorist or he has very cleverly convinced judges that his human rights overide his danger to others.

BertrandRussell Sat 20-Jun-15 09:49:19

"it's making sure that we make reasonable adjustments to ensure that people's rights aren't contravened."

This.

Trazzletoes Sat 20-Jun-15 09:51:15

No. Article 3, the right to freedom from torture, inhuman or degrading treatment is an absolute right. It can never be excused, regardless of any potential danger to others. Danger to others is never a consideration.

Otherwise you could always argue for torturing suspected criminals.

maddening Sat 20-Jun-15 09:52:02

I don't think he should be free in the community at all, there is no way they can have enough surveillance to prevent him being a threat to others who have the human right of peaceful enjoyment of their homes and community without the threat of their human rights to be alive.

ghostyslovesheep Sat 20-Jun-15 09:54:32

Okay we all have the right not to be made MORE ill hmm

I think you need to by assessed by medically trained people to be legally classed as delusional - you know rather than just saying you are hearing voices

And even with a tag this person was ' walking amongst us'

Blimey

hedgehogsdontbite Sat 20-Jun-15 09:56:27

I'm shocked he had a tag in the first place seeing as he's never been convicted of anything. Since when was it acceptable for the authorities to tag people because they suspect they might do something wrong in the future? shock

Golfhotelromeofoxtrot Sat 20-Jun-15 09:56:58

You have no idea what they will put in place to replace the tag. If this was your brother and he was beside himself in his illness, had committed terrible acts because of his illness and then feared for his life because of a piece of removable plastic on his leg, would you not beg them to take it off to help him become well again? Why is treating him as something less than human going to suddenly make him say "oh yes, I've been wrong all along, I'll be a healthy citizen now".

Trazzletoes Sat 20-Jun-15 09:57:17

And again. Article 3 trumps everything. Peaceful enjoyment... Everything.

It is meant to. It is our most basic right and protection. And so it should be. Even the right to life is qualified but there is no excuse for inhuman or degrading treatment. Thankfully.

insancerre Sat 20-Jun-15 10:03:26

I think he shouldn't have less rights because he's ill and a refugee
I'm another one thinking its shocking he had the tag in the first place
Nobody has more rights than anyone else.
Nobody
Everyone has equal rights
Its the cornerstone of a fair and just society

Moreshabbythanchic Sat 20-Jun-15 10:04:45

The courts do not go around tagging innocent people, this man has given reason to believe he is suspected of radicalising young people and making a "powerful contribution" to an Islamic terror group's media campaign.

It worries me that suspected terrorists with MH issues could be living next door to me.

Why is one persons human rights more important than the safety of the rest of the population.

Trazzletoes Sat 20-Jun-15 10:07:59

Because there is never any excuse for torturing someone.

meditrina Sat 20-Jun-15 10:08:07

"I'm shocked he had a tag in the first place seeing as he's never been convicted of anything. Since when was it acceptable for the authorities to tag people because they suspect they might do something wrong in the future?"

It a result of the TPIM, which is the "watered down" version of Labour's Control Orders. The Control Orders were found to be illegal by the courts, but that hasn't stopped Labour criticising the Tories for withdrawing an illegal measure.

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