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To not give permission

(44 Posts)
sandra159 Sun 30-Nov-14 17:53:23

AIBU to not give exH permission to take DS1 on holiday over Xmas, 20-28th December?
Ds1 lives with him and we have another two who live with me, he won't take the other two though, not that I'd want them to go anyway. I just want them all together and I don't think it's fair he treats them so different.
I have a court order saying he can't take him also btw.

pauline6703 Sun 30-Nov-14 17:55:18

How old are the children and what does DS1 want to do?

mummymeister Sun 30-Nov-14 17:57:45

does the court order say he cant take him or he cant take him without your permission. if it is the former, then you have no choice but to say no. if the latter then you need to ask DS1 what he wants to do and whether he is happy not to be with his siblings.

sandra159 Sun 30-Nov-14 18:17:23

He's 12. The order says he must not.
The other two are so upset.
There's no way I'm allowing it. They should all be treated the same.

Monathevampire1 Sun 30-Nov-14 18:21:47

Surely if the court order says 'he must not' then your ex can't take the child abroad. You can't give permission if the court have already denied it.

WooWooOwl Sun 30-Nov-14 18:22:45

If you have court orders and children living away from siblings then there's obviously a huge backstory, so it's impossible to say whether YABU.

If you refuse permission will all the siblings be together over Christmas? What would be the plan for both you and your ex to spend time with all of your children together?

sandra159 Sun 30-Nov-14 18:48:06

All 3 together yes woo woo.
Surely it's better to say no and all three together than yes and have two disappointed and all apart?
There is a back story, he took him away at Easter without telling me ad didn't ask the other two, it's really hurt them, they felt left out and like they didn't deserve it, almost punished.
When I went for child contact hearing I requested it in the interim order a I knew he would do something like this, take him at Xmas to hurt me.

WooWooOwl Sun 30-Nov-14 19:01:11

So what would be your arrangements on Christmas day/Eve? Will they all be with you, will they all be with your ex, do you live close enough that you can split the day in half?

It would be better to have all three together in an ideal world, but if the reality would be swopping children, or lots of travelling for them all then it might be better to let ds1 go.

You are in a really horrible and difficult position that would be so much easier if all the children lived together. Does your ds1 want to go away? Will he feel resentful at missing out on something for the sake of being with his siblings, or would he rather be around them?

BoneyBackJefferson Sun 30-Nov-14 19:01:41

Surely it depends on what the arrangements over xmas where before he decided to go away.

And if its to see family on his side.

sandra159 Sun 30-Nov-14 19:29:03

He's already booked, for him and his dp, ds1 was living with me when he booked although he did ask could he take just him at the time of booking and I said no then.
Now ds1 has gone back to dad (don't ask!) and he's panicking in case he has to cancel.

LadyLuck10 Sun 30-Nov-14 19:40:09

What are the ages of the other two?
If the 12yo can live with him why can't he take him away on a holiday?

Dropdeadfred2 Sun 30-Nov-14 19:45:49

why didn't he want to take the others???

Monathevampire1 Sun 30-Nov-14 19:47:38

If he wants to take the child he has to go back to court and ask. The judge then decides.

WooWooOwl Sun 30-Nov-14 20:01:12

Why would the ex have to cancel? Can't your ds just come and stay with you?

Darquesse Sun 30-Nov-14 20:05:10

I think it is really unfair for him to just take one child. Are they all his children? How old are the other two?

mummymeister Mon 01-Dec-14 00:39:13

If the court has said no then the answer is no. its really very simple. this isn't about what you think, or your son or your ex. Its gone beyond that now. your ex is being cruel and manipulative using the kids to get at you. he doesn't realise that in the long run all he is doing is damaging their relationship with him. keep your cool. tell him and your son calmly and clearly that there is a court order FORBIDDING them to leave the country. its in their hands. if they go ahead and do it you will haul him back to court. simple. stop stressing about it. stop bringing in the other kids. stop discussing, arguing about it, going through all the what ifs. he cant take him without breaching the court order. tell him this. then shut up about it. don't discuss it any further with him, the kids or anyone. this is what your ex wants. he wants you to use your time stressing and worrying. so don't. don't do it. don't play his game.

sandra159 Mon 01-Dec-14 08:25:59

Other two are 10 and 6, he won't take them because he can't afford the extra two.
I've told him point blank it's not up for discussion and it's court ordered.
He can come to me, however now he know dad wanted to take him and I've said no I imagine he doesn't want to .

WannaBe Mon 01-Dec-14 08:43:01

There is obviously more to this though if your ds1 lives with his dad and the other two dc don't.

On the face of it it seems that your xh is favouring your one child, but then that one child lives with him, whereas the other two don't. How much contact do you have with your ds1? conversely, how much contact does your xh have with the other two dc? and are they all his children?

If contact is equal then I would agree that yes all three should go, but it seems that contact isn't the same for reasons which are not clear here, but the reality is that if you have residency of a child and only contact with other two children then sometimes the resident child will get to experience things which the non resident children don't.

If your ds1 is living there through his own choice then it isn't going to benefit your relationship with him if you say no.

sandra159 Mon 01-Dec-14 10:35:35

All 3 are his.
We do alternate weekends, ds1 comes to me one weekend an the other two go to him on the other weekend.

Floralnomad Mon 01-Dec-14 10:43:48

At 12 I think you should let him decide and you will just have to face the fallout with the younger 2 , you've obviously agreed to him living with his dad and if he had already booked the holiday prior to this its not like your ex is being deliberately awkward .

clam Mon 01-Dec-14 10:51:11

"At 12 I think you should let him decide"

Floral There is a court order forbidding it!! rtft

Don't start agreeing one-off variations / waivers of the court order, it might be used to stop you relying on it later if you've already agreed that he can go despite the order. I would stick with a very straightforward approach that there is a court order that you both have to respect so it's not a matter of choice. It is not up to you to give him permission; he is not allowed to take him because the court has said so.

Jackie0 Mon 01-Dec-14 11:11:22

There is no debate here or decision to be made.
It's very clear cut.........the court have already decided.
What are you all going on about?
I'm baffled

sandra159 Mon 01-Dec-14 11:21:07

Thanks all.
I just needed to be clear in my mind.
I just want all 3 when it comes to holiday, Christmas, birthdays etc to be treated exactly the same, the other two shouldn't e made to feel left out.
I'm just waiting for an email from his solicitor, you've all put my mind at rest.

clam Mon 01-Dec-14 11:25:45

Was he planning to go abroad? (note use of past tense here!)

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