to think the poorest pensioners in the UK aren't actually that poor

[twistedsista]

The minimum amount a pensioner will get at the moment if they have made no provisions is 7714.2 pa tax free + free bus / train (depending on areas) + winter fuel allowances + warm home discount + free perscriptins + consesionry prices for many things etc and most bought homes when they were reasonable so they have minimal housing costs.

Compare this to a single person on nmw who could be paying 25 a week on bus travel, 130 a week on rent with no hope of buying. they have to pay tax and if they are under 45 they will never get the benefits that they are paying for pensionrs to have at the moment.

I'm not being ageist, just looking at the sums

[Sleepyhoglet]

Yes, and? I know some pensioners are still for to work but those over 75 can work. They still need to eat etc. Perhaps the free bus could be means tested though

[arethereanyleftatall]

Yanbu. My grandmother says she's never been so rich in her life. (Sahm to 8 children previously). My mother does not need free bus passes nor prescriptions etc but she cannot see that perhaps she shouldn't accept them.

[Fram]

YABU and goady.

£130p.w rent is £6,760 p.a- that doesn't leave much from £7,714.20 to actually live on, does it? Plenty of pensioners rent!

[Fram]

And anyone on £7714 pa doesn't pay tax, so not sure what your argument there is.

[sweetlilacsinspring]

I recently started doing care work, and it's actually frightened me the extent of the poverty some people, especially the elderly, do actually live in, it's awful.

[ilovesooty]

I imagine the poorest pensioners don't own their own properties.

[Sleepyhoglet]

I should have proof read my post. Pensioners can't work so rely on that income

[Fram]

Pensioners can and do work- I know plenty that have to in order to heat their homes.

[sweetlilacsinspring]

They don't ilovesooty and some of them have to live in awful places

[Anotheronebitthedust]

I read an article recently that said that for the first time, on average retired pensioners are better off now than working people in their 20s. I'll try and find it now.

Of course it is a generalisation, but tbh I'm not surprised - if these pensioners either owned their own homes (no mortgage) or got substantial hb then that's 500-800 p/m rent or mortgage saved straight away, plus all the costs associated with working (travel, parking, childcare, etc), plus I would assume less general outgoings (I could be wrong here, my gran for example has an amazing social life!). Also don't have to pay back uni fees, but could have quite substantial savings, particularly if they bought at a good time and downsized.

Basically far less outgoings, but with income (pension, particularly if they have worked), is quite likely to be equal to/even more, a full time worker on NMW (about 12-13 grand atm I think?).

[dawndonnaagain]

You mentioned the poorest pensioners, so they would be the ones still in a position where they needed to be paying rent.
£148.00 per week, with a rent contribution is not a huge amount. By the time you have taken off a council tax contribution, gas, electricity, television licence, water, food it doesn't leave a great deal and trust me, £200 does not a whole, cold winter cover. If it were such a fabulous amount how is it that every time we have a particularly harsh winter we lose more pensioners to hypothermia than any of the Scandanavian countries?

[sweetlilacsinspring]

I think they sort of do (get free train travel) my dad did but only within his county.

[SaucyJack]

Even if they are renting, pensioners get more housing benefit than anyone else as they are exempt from the bedroom tax. The HB will be on top of their pension, plus additional council tax benefit.

[Fram]

IseenYou- West Midlands offer free train travel (within WMids) to over 65s

[70isaLimitNotaTarget]

Some older people I visit have lovely big three bedroom houses, nice areas, near the Underground etc. Until you go int the house and find they are living in one room.
Bed, commode, TV , all in one room, They can only heat this one room.
Goodness knows what's going on upstairs, they haven't been there for months, years.

[napoleonsnose]

YABU. £7714.2 works out at just under £645 a month. By the time you take off Council Tax, water, gas, electricity, car expenses (if they have one) and food, most pensioners are hardly rolling in it. My own DM (nearly 72) despite having no mortgage, a very small occupational pension from my late DF and her state pension still works 15 hours a week just to make life a bit more comfortable.

[aquehoraabren]

The current crop of pensioners are the best of in history and are better off than generation x, y and onwards will be at the same age. So in that respect you have a point.

[Andrewofgg]

Free bus pass to be means-tested?

I'm 62 and live and work in London. Not rich, not on the breadline either.

I have paid fares and taxes (rates, poll-tax, council tax) all my working live for previous cadres of sixties to have free travel without a means test. I have my Boris card and will soon have my Freedom Pass and so I should because it's my turn now. Hands off.

[aquehoraabren]

Well if the current legislation stands todays 20 and 30 year olds won't be retiring until they're in their 70s let alone collecting freebies from age 60 like the current bunch. There has always been an underlying assumption that things will always get better for younger people yet any 20-30 year old who's been paying attention will notice that it's not really happened for them, housing, pensions, cost of education all far worse, not to mention the ongoing racking up of huge amounts of national debt (mostly used to fund unsustainable pensioner benefits) that will need paying off over the next few decades.

And then you have all the off-balance sheet stuff like hospitals and schools built on hugely expensive PFI contracts, and unfunded public sector pension schemes for people who are likely to live and keep collecting them well into their 80s.

[wafflyversatile]

Why not approach it from the pov that other people are too poor rather than pensioners aren't poor enough?

[mixedgrapes]

My mum has just stopped working as my dad became old enough to claim pension credit - she is in her 50s and dad is 62. An Age UK lady came to visit and worked out that they'd actually be better off claiming it as dad had been redundant for several years and mum was on a low wage. They don't have housing costs as they've paid off their mortgage, but get full council tax paid and all the other bits like free travel (for dad) and don't have to pay the weekly bus pass for my mum as she's not working now. There are also some grants which the Age UK lady helped them to get, free new boiler and home insulation etc. My mum used to have to pay for a prescription pre-payment as she's on quite a few meds so they're saving a bit there.

So yes, they're more comfortable than they used to be, the money is only slightly more but the nice thing is that mum's job was quite a strain for her and wasn't good for her health really. I think they manage well on it because they've always been on a lowish income anyway, so they know all the frugal living tricks, and also they live in an urban environment where they now have the time to take advantage of free/low cost things but if they lived rurally they'd have to run a car rather than use free public transport and there would be fewer activities for them.