Is my dad or my dh? And am I for even asking?

[inabitofadilemma]

I'm in a bit of a dilemma.

Me and DH have been together for 14 years, two kids and one on the the way. We jointly own our house. Originally, we both put in savings of about 30,000 pounds as a down payment. We did well from selling and buying at the right time and renovating a run down house and took advantage of low interest rates and paid down the mortgage. My Dad gave us 40,000 pounds a few years ago to help with mortgage and renovations. Currently our house is worth about 400,000 and we have equity of 200,000.

My Dad is now wrapping up and selling his business so he can retire properly. He's done very very well out of the super high prime London prices because his business had some real estate there. As a result, he's offered to help us pay off the mortgage and upgrade our house because it'll be tight with the third child. Altogether he's offered to give us 350,000 pounds. This is, of course, a huge amount of money and will allow us to buy a bigger house mortgage free. I'm fully aware that this is very generous and we're incredibly lucky to be in this position.

However, he's stipulated a condition. Only my name on the house. He's willing to sign an agreement that DH can have 'his' share plus whatever it's appreciated in the event that we divorce (and if I die that it's in the name of the children as a trust) BUT the house MUST be in my name.

My Dad says that this is to protect me. He does actually really like DH, it's not like they've ever had any issues. They get on really well. But he says that things can change. His biggest fear is that we divorce (or I die), DH gets remarried and half of the money he gave to me ends up with another woman and her children.

DH is incredibly insulted by this especially because he always got on with my Dad. He says he will feel uncomfortable living in a home that's not his and he's very upset. We've never thought on these terms, always had a joint account and apart from the money my Dad gave us a few years ago, it's always been kind of even. DH works less than me and earns less but he's with the kids more so neither of us think of our money other than as joint money. We had a joint account before we even got married.

DH is kind of angry with me for not fighting his corner more. But I feel bad fighting with my Dad when he's about to help us out so much, I feel ungrateful doing so like some kind of spoilt brat. I totally get where DH is coming from but I also understand my Dad's reasoning. It's just how he is (he's lived with his partner for 20 years and in his will, he's very very clear about what she's entitled to and what she's not - and it's not much - in fact, I had to tell him to change it to leave her more!). My Dad is also helping my brother out in a similar way with a similar condition but they don't seem bothered by it.

So who is being unreasonable here? My Dad who is insisting that only my name is on the house? Or DH who feels hurt and insulted and thinks i should be fighting his corner more?

We could, of course, turn down my Dad's offer. We're also happy as we are, can make mortgage repayments and pay our bills just fine and carry on in our house, we'd just be a bit cramped. So it's not like we NEED this to just survive. But then i think that might be unfair to the DC because this is really THEIR money at the end of the day. And it's very hard to turn down the tempatation of a bigger house and being mortgage free.

[Alisvolatpropiis]

I think your Dad is being unreasonable.

[Alisvolatpropiis]

I would be very unhappy if my dp accepted a similar condition.

If your husband is not happy with it then you can't really accept your dads offer.

[phoolani]

Maybe your dad has been spending time on mumsnet! And read the litany of 'he left me and I have nothing' stories. I don't think he's being unreasonable; it's his money and he can stipulate whatever conditions he wants. As between yourself and DH, you could always make a contractual agreement between yourselves as to what will happen to the house in the event you separate.

[onedev]

That's a tough one really as I can see both sides. Can the house not be in both your names but with legal recognition of the differing financial percentages?

Thinking about it , does it actually matter as you're married & hence it's considered 50/50??

Sorry not much help but I would be wary now either way as this could ultimately come between you - either him resenting living in 'your ' house or you resenting him for not accepting the offer.

[CharleyFarnsbarns]

I'm sorry it's upsetting your DH. I think your dad is just looking out for his daughter.

My parents gave us a big deposit when we bought our first house but before we married. The house is in both our names but the deposit was protected so if we split up it would still be mine. It was easier because we weren't married but we all looked on it as my inheritance from my parents. DH and I were just grateful to get a big deposit.

[inabitofadilemma]

Really? OK, I guess I'll have to push back on this with him then. If he's being unreasonable then i suppose it's not ungrateful not to accept his condition.

I do see where dh is coming from. I wouldn't want to be in a similar situation. I just wonder why my DB and his wife have been so accepting of it.

[Grennie]

I actually understand your dad's views. But I also understand your Husband's. Personally I would decline your dad's offer of the money.

[inabitofadilemma]

Charley

Part of the issue is that DH and my Dad get on very well and we've been together 14 years! I think if this were a pre-nup agreement, it'd be different. DH is insulted that my Dad thinks this of him after knowing him for so long, two kids and one on the way. It's not just about the money.

[CocktailQueen]

Your dad is not being unreasonable! it's his money and he ash a perfect right to want it kept in his family and not given to your dh should he leave you.

This has happened in my extended family and caused a whole load of grief. he's just being pragmatic and organised. Can see why your dh is angry/upset though.

Is there a compromise? Could you agree that the house will be in your name but if you split up, dh will have a certain % of it or your assets?

[Adeleh]

Might it be worth chatting to a lawyer to see what options there are to protect your interests with both your names on the house? There should be a way of keeping everyone happy.
I don't think your Dad is being unreasonable. It's his money and he wants to look after his family, and for him that's you and his grandchildren. But I can see why your DH isn't thrilled. But your Dad is eager to protect your DH's interests too with acknowledging his share and appreciation. When it comes down to it, isn't it simply a matter of the name? Your DH will benefit as well by living mortgage free in a fab house. I would accept the offer gratefully.

[inabitofadilemma]

But I know my Dad. He really does like DH, they have (or at least had until now) a great realtionship but he says 'who knows what will happen in the future'.

I hate this. Maybe the money isn't worth introducing tension into our marriage.

I'll talk to my Dad tomorrow.

[MunchMunch]

I can see both sides so I would decline your dads offer but ask him if the money was for the dc then to put the money away for them.

[Magix]

I can absolutely understand where your dad is coming from , but I can also sort of see how your dh would be insulted by it . However , if this was me and my dh , my dh would absolutely agree to those terms . That's a very very generous offer from your dad and I think your dh should put his family before his pride (sorry don't mean to be harsh that's just how I see it )

[inabitofadilemma]

DH will benefit, all of us will. DH will agree but the main reason he'll agree is that this will be the DC's money and inheritance. He's not happy.

But DH thinks I should be more assertive with my Dad. I feel very ungrateful pushing him on this when it's his money and he can do with it as he wants.

[Only1scoop]

I think your dad is a realist and just protecting you and Dc.
If you and Dh were in position to help your dc one day maybe you would feel the same.
If Dh really is opposed to attached conditions then gratefully decline as the bad feeling it may cause will not be worth it.

[LogonMounstuart]

I think you DF is probably right and sensible. Your DH doesn't lose out does he? and he gets the improved lifestyle, or you decline- and live with in your current means.

[Adeleh]

I think your Dad has a point about the future. However much you like/ love someone you don't know how they'll react in extreme circumstances, and it's his right as your Dad to imagine the worst and do what he can to protect you from it.

[KeatsiePie]

Hmmm difficult.

My parents have helped us a bit with money and it's been for both of us. They've made kind of a point about wanting to support us as a unit, which is nice. Much much smaller amounts though, so not really the same as not much capital was at stake -- but I think DH would be terribly hurt if my parents wanted to do similar to yours but in my name only.

But, truthfully, I see your dad's point. I imagine that from his pov., it's not about your DH at all, it's about protecting you and his GCs. Would it be possible for you to have the house in both your names but make a legal arrangement so that you own more of the equity?

[CharleyFarnsbarns]

Yes it was definitely easier because we weren't married.

Adeleh's advice sounds good - to at least find a way of locking the money as yours but sharing ownership of the house?

[inabitofadilemma]

Oh no, there's no unanimous vote from the MN jury :(

But lots of good points to think about, thank you for that.

[KeatsiePie]

Now am fantasizing about having this problem

I really would just make a quick call to a lawyer and see if there's a compromise possible here.

[inabitofadilemma]

I'm going to talk to DH and my Dad about the idea of house in both our names but a legal agreement recognizing different amounts of equity in the house. That might work.

[Ellengriswold]

Have been in a slightly similar position and I really don't think your dad is being unreasonable. Uncomfortable conversations sometimes have to be had and money is always a difficult subject. I suggest you don't accept it unless you're all happy with the conditions. That are actually protecting your children most of all.

[Andypipkin]

I think your DH is being very unreasonable. This actually protects your children the most. If you died and your husband remarried, any stepchildren could in theory be equally entitled to the property. I doubt your husband would want that and your dad most definately wouldn't. I think your DH is being very very shortsighted. We have been given property from my mother, my husband was insistent that everything was in my name to protect our children.

[NumTumDeDum]

This wouldn't work as you are married and the house, even in your sole name would still be a matrimonial asset.

There is such a thing as a post nuptial agreement, which unlike a pre-nuptial agreement can be binding. You would need to take specialist advice from a family lawyer, preferably a member of the Law Society's Advanced Family Panel.

The alternative is that your father treats it as a loan and registers a charge in his favour against the house with repayment triggered if you divorce. I would imagine however from what you say that he wants this to be a gift, so that is probably not an option.