Advanced search

To think this money should be spent on helping people...

(29 Posts)
utterspanners Sun 29-Dec-13 08:55:23

Browsing the BBC News website earlier, I saw this article:

It struck me, that asides from the interesting story, that an old painting has been found and that it is worth a fortune, I can't help think that the church could find better ways of spending their new-found money.

They plan to use it to replace the church bells, to commemorate those lost in WWI, and although that seems like a noble cause, surely helping local homeless people get back on their feet, or something like that, would be far better.

I did a little bit of research about the church itself (Whaley Hall), and it turns out that this church is actually quite a big corporate conference centre and is run as a business. Presumably they still have charitable status, and through their website they still take donations from the public for renovations etc.

I can't help think that if the church wants to maintain charitable status, then it shouldn't be running itself as a business. Furthermore, with all the problems in the country (and world) at the moment, is replacement of church bells really a priority? Don't get me wrong, I am in favour of remembering our war dead, I just feel uncomfortable that this church seems to care more about building its assetts, than it does about helping the community, and may be using the anniversary of WWI as an excuse.

How many children in Africa would £400,000 save?


jonicomelately Sun 29-Dec-13 08:57:49

DP and I have just said exactly the same thing utterspanners

MelanieCheeks Sun 29-Dec-13 08:58:43

Yes it struck me as a nice idea, but hardly the highest priority.

jelliebelly Sun 29-Dec-13 08:59:47

But it wasn't the church that bought the painting it was the vicar in his personal capacity - he can choose to do what he wants with the windfall surely?

jelliebelly Sun 29-Dec-13 09:02:20

YABU what would you spend a £400k windfall on?

NewJerseyHousewife Sun 29-Dec-13 09:04:11

Regarding the idea of commemorating WWI, there are plenty of those around, unlike those who fought, their parents/wives/siblings/children of those how fought. It would have been better to commemorate those people in the 1920's when their loved ones were around to appreciate it.

Twighlightsparkle Sun 29-Dec-13 09:05:40

I saw it on the news last night, obviously a slow news day.

I presume he purchased it with his own money, therefore it's nice of him to donate the money to any cause, I wonder how many of usin the same position would donate it all to charity? I probably would donate some and spend some and save some.

However it's a very individual thing and no one else's business. On that note I'm surprised how public this guy has made it all.

utterspanners Sun 29-Dec-13 09:08:18

Interestingly, he was recently made a Canon, but I don't think that would have been linked to his donation...

AMumInScotland Sun 29-Dec-13 09:13:29

Why shouldn't it be run as a 'business'? There are costs in owning and maintaining a building like that. Of course they need income to pay for that, which they get from hosting conferences and other meetings.

It is also available for retreats and other 'spiritual' events.

How exactly do you think religions operate on a day to day basis, if they are not allowed to have income from outside to cover their costs?

If their main focus was on running the business and not running a church, then I agree they would need to look at their priorities. But all churches have to balance the books one way or another.

MrsLouisTheroux Sun 29-Dec-13 09:15:47

Interestingly, he was recently made a Canon, but I don't think that would have been linked to his donation...
Haaha! Noooo, not at all!

Justforlaughs Sun 29-Dec-13 09:17:04

Lots of money out there that isn't spent on the most beneficial things, in MY opinion, but then it isn't MY money so it's got b*** all to do with me. I like the idea of commemorating the War Dead, but it wouldn't be my priority, however, maybe it would be the priority of someone who had lost a relative during that war.

Father Jamie MacLeod bought the painting in his private capacity and that painting hung for 10 years on the wall in his study according to the interview I just heard. Now it turns out it is worth shed loads of cash he is donating the money. He is part of the Old Catholic Church in the UK which is very, very small and it seems that commemorating the 1st world war seems to be a big part of what they are doing right now.

He could have blown the lot on a nice holiday, good car, decent port and some smart suits but he isn't.

Roshbegosh Sun 29-Dec-13 09:28:17

How many children in Africa would £400,000 save? Well that would depend on how many BMWs it had to buy for officials over there first. Yes there are a few projects you could identify that do some good but really, what is there to show for all the billions sent there?

What do you personally do to help the homeless OP? Besides sitting on your sofa carping about what others should do.

MrsDavidBowie Sun 29-Dec-13 09:31:25

It's his personal money so he can spend it how he wishes.
I did think of the Father Ted episode when they think Father Jack has died, leaving them a windfall. grin

Joysmum Sun 29-Dec-13 09:38:30

How many people in this country would it save?

We all have different priorities and things we'd do with the money. Those of us touched by cancer or dementia may spend on that. Others with kids may spend on children's charities, or those with animals on animal charities.

There's a million and one good causes out there.

JumpingJackSprat Sun 29-Dec-13 09:43:59

It's his money he can do whatever the hell he wants with it.

QueenArseClangers Sun 29-Dec-13 09:53:55

I was thinking the same thing last night. The British Legion would've been a more fitting way of commemorating the fallen dead by caring for the living.

In a way I'd've rather him spent the cash on himself than be praised as being a genorous benefactor for paying for some fucking bells.

I'm sure Jesus would've spent the cash differently but the church aren't known for being 'christian'...

Birdsgottafly Sun 29-Dec-13 12:41:01


If you want to help Africa, rethink everything you buy, but especially chocolate/coffee/anything to do with the Dairy/Beef trade and buy everything Fair Trade.

All if the crap bought to celebrate Christmas has done nothing but add to landfill and their exploited situation/environmental hardship.

That besides, if priorities were rethought by everyone, as well as politicians/leaders etc, then we would be able to comfortably afford to preserve all the architecture, old structures that should be kept.

Life in the UK isn't that tough that we cannot preserve our heritage and I think it should be in the spending budget.

We have lost lots of Grade 1&2 buildings in Liverpool, thanks to underspending, yet we are relying on tourism more and more, as well as enough native people wanting these to be preserved.

It us a shame that other countries such as Iran/Iraq gave lost so many old places if worship because if conflict. We are all losing perspective, by being caught up in propaganda.

Birdsgottafly Sun 29-Dec-13 12:46:10

Also, I think that helping "the homeless get back on their feet" is much more complex and needs an organisation such as Shelter.

Small local charities do, do good, but for smaller local causes, rather than complex problems that need the input of lots of different services.

Except for Children's Hospices, which is a disgrace that these ever needed Charity intervention.

Onesleeptillwembley Sun 29-Dec-13 12:48:19

It's the churches that hold the most precious items anyway. Catholics encouraging the poor and deprived to breed whilst holding in to billions upon billions locked away in vaults. And some wonder why anybody with any sense is anti established religion.

Bowlersarm Sun 29-Dec-13 12:52:11


Agree with Birds

CustardoPaidforIDSsYFronts Sun 29-Dec-13 12:58:04

1) you can and should run a charity as a business if it is to succeed
2) it is his money
3) I agree that the money could be better spent. Whilst in itself it is a drop in the ocean and probably will not solve any problems, it could have guarenteed certain staff posts for 3 to 5 years. It can also be used as match funding - leverage if you like to bring in further funds from other funding bodies.

ComposHat Sun 29-Dec-13 14:15:10

Surely the Catholic Church could use this money more profitability by lining the interior of a building with gold or maybe buying the silence of a victim of child abuse at the hands of one of their priests or maybe print up some more tracts telling Catholics in developing countries where AIDS is rife that using condoms is a sin?

Be thankful it was spent on something as harmless as Church Bells!

WooWooOwl Sun 29-Dec-13 15:02:34

Most charities are run like businesses, and most will be limited companies as well as being charities.

No charity is allowed to receive a donation and then spend it on something that isn't one of their intended aims or beneficiaries that has been approved by the CC.

So for example, a charity that looks after stray dogs has been given a donation that the giver specified has to be spent on dog food. The charity is bound by law to spend that money on dog food. Not on vets fees, or on new bedding, or on anything else that may be desperately needed. It has to be spent on dog food. If a massive donation was given to a dogs home to spend on whatever they want, they are still legally obliged to spend that money on on the dogs home, even if they have a very healthy bank balance and lots of guaranteed income and there is a children's hospice about to shut down because of a lack of funds next door.


DoYouLikeMyBaubles Sun 29-Dec-13 15:04:45

Why is it always 'children in africa'.

That could help a lot of children over here.

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now