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To be shocked at this woman's lack of parenting concern?

(117 Posts)
jojane Sun 23-Jun-13 01:23:40

I can't believe that a mother would let her child go off with a man she has JUST met in the supermarket!! I am all for not thinking every person is a peado and will happily let my children talk to people if I am there but no way would I let a complete stranger take one of my children forma burger!?,

RhondaJean Sun 23-Jun-13 17:21:37

That is a disgusting post. You could say the same about any parent who has ever let a child out to play or sent them on an errand only to have them abducted. Of course it was a poor decision and I would imagine, like some middle class British parents who shall go nameless, that she realises it now.

You are using similar reasoning to rape apologists - if the victim hadn't been drunk /worn a short skirt it wouldn't have happened.

The simple fact is this excuse for a human being should not have abducted, abused and killed the little girl. He committed the crime. He is the guilty party.

RhondaJean Sun 23-Jun-13 17:22:00

Xpost expat.

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 17:23:40

Why is this woman any more responsible than April Jones' mother, who let her child play out well out of her sight for hours?

She isn't.

The fault lies with these perpetrators and with a so-called justice system that allows men who commit these acts to walk free, over and over again.

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 17:30:35

Ever let your kids play out, Flogging? You are handing paedos opportunities on a plate. hmm

McNewPants2013 Sun 23-Jun-13 17:34:33

It the fault of the murdering scum who did this, not the mothers

Kiriwawa Sun 23-Jun-13 17:35:00

It's much less scary to blame the mum than blame the perpetrator. If we tell ourselves that we would never behave like that, we can kid ourselves that our children are invulnerable.

I agree with expat - this guy should not have been on the streets.

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 17:37:22

Exactly, Kiri.

Sparklysilversequins Sun 23-Jun-13 18:22:27

This tells a rather different story Jacksonville Times

Usual disgusting embellishments by some areas of the press to make a terrible situation even worse.

Poor little girl.

Sparklysilversequins Sun 23-Jun-13 18:26:57

Sorry here is another link I meant to post Huffington Post

somewherewest Sun 23-Jun-13 20:37:43

It still says that she got into a complete stranger's van with her three young children, which is pretty insane. I don't think for a moment that the fact I wouldn't do something like that makes my child 'invincible', but it does make them a safer, which is my responsibility as a parent. Of course in an ideal world this man just wouldn't exist, and would still be in prison. We don't parent in that world.

somewherewest Sun 23-Jun-13 20:39:08

...'or would still be in prison' even...blush

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 20:43:09

The McDonald's was IN the Wal-Mart. She thought the girl was going there and coming back, not going into his van. He's on CCTV, fgs.

So, again, is April Jone's mother responsible, too, for her daughter's death?

She let her child out to play out of her sight for hours.

Is she worthy of the same scorn that is expressed on here? How is it different? Did she hand her daughter's killer the same opportunity on a plate?

Do all those who let their child play out or send them on an errand?

How is this different?

A family in Germany a few years ago let their 9-year-old take a tram in Berlin to visit a friend. A paedo befriended him on that tram, captured on CCTV, and in minutes convinced the child to get off with him. His body was found, raped and strangled 2 days later.

Are those parents responsible any more than this woman?

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 20:44:03

April knew her killer. He was local.

So, by your definition, her mother is just as responsible, no?

working9while5 Sun 23-Jun-13 20:45:15

We've all done it. Packed a child off on a playdate when we don't know the parents. Let the family next to you at soft play watch your child while you change the other ones nappy, left them in the car when you pay for petrol, lost sight of them at the park while we talk

Really, who can say they've never taken any risk? hmm.

I left my ds1 (2.8) at the top of a stairs while I carried the buggy to the half way point of a long flight of stairs down when the lift wasn't working (train station).

I felt weird about it but otherwise we were staying there for the rest of the evening as he wouldn't even attempt to walk down them that day in a toddler strop

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 20:46:01

IMO, the responsibility lies with the perpetrator and with a so-called justice system that slaps paedos on the wrist and lets them out, over and over again.

cory Sun 23-Jun-13 21:11:31

Jan49 Sun 23-Jun-13 11:33:10
"We've all done it. Packed a child off on a playdate when we don't know the parents. Let the family next to you at soft play watch your child while you change the other ones nappy, left them in the car when you pay for petrol, lost sight of them at the park while we talk.

No "we" haven't all done it. I've never done any of those things. Playdate, I'd go along the first time."

And how does having accompanied them on one playdate ensure that the adult of the house is not a paedophile murderer biding his time until the second playdate? hmm

Or the twenty--fifth?

April Jones' murderer was well known to her family, he was the father of a friend of hers, even the most paranoid of MNers would have felt justified in trusting somebody like that.

This other mother didn't intentionally let her daughter out of sight with a stranger; she let her walk to the McDonald's counter inside the same shopping mall- and they suddenly walked out of the door.

And the child was 8, not 2, so only a couple of years younger than the age when most children in this country start to make their own way to and from school.

If you literally never let your 8yo walk up to the shop counter without holding on to her, what do you do with your 10yo? And with your 12yo? Sooner or later you have to let them go and take the risk.

Greenkit Sun 23-Jun-13 23:07:31

What a beautiful young girl, such a sad waste sad

Jan49 Sun 23-Jun-13 23:52:07

Hopefully you let your child do things alone when they are old enough to know not to go off with a complete stranger or get in their car or to get in the car even of someone they know when mum/dad think you are playing just outside. You teach your child "don't go anywhere without telling me first". In a busy shopping centre you keep your children close to you because you don't want them to get lost. I can't understand the argument that you have to take risk when they're younger or else they'll never be able to do it when they're older. You let them do it when they are old enough and mature enough to cope with it. You don't go straight from total supervision to total freedom. You can't take away risk completely and that applies to everyday life for all of us as adults too, but you can reduce it and take reasonable precautions.

expatinscotland Mon 24-Jun-13 00:25:39

Paedos are astoundingly clever, persuasive, manipulative liars, Jan. They are known to be. They prey upon vulnerable people at first port of call. They are charming. This is their MO. They will spend money, time, whatever to prey.

It is always their fault. ALWAYS.

Same as any other rapist or abuser. It is entirely the fault of the perpetrator.

This is why they should ALWAYS be locked up for life, because there is no known way to make them anything other than what they are: clever, persuasive, manipulative liars there to prey on whomever they can to get to children.

This appears to be what happened here.

It is NO ONE'S fault besides the person who abducted and murdered this child.

expatinscotland Mon 24-Jun-13 00:33:42

This man works for the FBI. He is the child of a heroin-addicted prostitute and spends his life dispelling myths about child sex abusers and rape.

On another show of hers, people who had coached their children in fear of strangers volunteered their children as subjects of an experiment. All were easily coaxed into going with someone who seemed trustworthy, but could have been anyone, and some of them were 12.


Paedos lie and manipulate both adults and children. It is not anyone's fault but their own.

They are rapists and abusers, and those who decree otherwise are apologists for their disgusting behaviour.

expatinscotland Mon 24-Jun-13 00:45:53

For those of you not interested in pillorying the mother, I suggest reading Gavin de Becker's 'Protecting the Gift' and 'The Gift of Fear', to learn more about the behaviour of people who might prey upon your child.

MOST do not operate like this man, they prefer those they can abuse long-term, like the Jeremy Forests and those gangs in the North of England of this world. They seek to groom, for long-term abuse.

But they are one and the same: paedos who act on their repulsive desires to the expense of everyone else because of their narcissism.

It is always entirely their fault, as it is with all rapists. They first seek parents and children who are vulnerable, be it down on their luck, learning challenged, children in care (there are all those celebs in the 70s and 80s), but they will do anything to prey and abuse.

PearlyWhites Mon 24-Jun-13 03:51:13

Clearly many people have never been to a Walmart in the states. It is not a shopping mall it is a McDonalds in the store it is no different than walking to the cheese counter. How dare people blame the mother.

TheRealFellatio Mon 24-Jun-13 04:00:53

*Not everyone is that aware, lots of folk are out of touch.
And the odds are 9 out of 10 times if the family had done this the child would have come back unharmed.*

Well even if you didn't foresee abduction and murder, who would do this? confused

I saw this yesterday. The mother must have either LDs or substance abuse issues MH issues or just be unbelievably dim if she thinks it's safe, or even acceptable to let your 8 year old go off to McDonalds with a middle aged male stranger. It's a deeply weird thing to do.

TheRealFellatio Mon 24-Jun-13 04:06:09

And I disagree that it is similar to the famous case everyone is alluding to. One was a situation that was highly unlikely to go wrong but did, the other is a situation that screams 'this will go wrong!' from the very beginning.

Leaving a child unattended and taking the tiny, tiny risk that a paedophile may break in and abduct them is hardly the same as handing them over voluntarily to a total stranger who is showing a weird and inappropriate amount of interest in them!

TheHumancatapult Mon 24-Jun-13 04:10:17

You say you never let your child of with people don't know

Well even with whet you hear in papers actually over 95% of abuse is carried out by someone you know well and trust Sometimes doneone know for years
On that base you would never let your child go anywhere at all

E d of day only person blame is this man and yeah the system that allowed him out to do this

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