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To be shocked at this woman's lack of parenting concern?

(117 Posts)
jojane Sun 23-Jun-13 01:23:40

I can't believe that a mother would let her child go off with a man she has JUST met in the supermarket!! I am all for not thinking every person is a peado and will happily let my children talk to people if I am there but no way would I let a complete stranger take one of my children forma burger!?,

K8Middleton Sun 23-Jun-13 12:19:56

The world is not very different. That is wrong. Child murder and child abduction rates in the UK have not changed since the 1970s (goes off to find a link before someone asks)

If anything we may be a tiny, tiny bit safer because some of the attacks on teenage girls that would not have been seen as attacks at the time would now.

If you're going to repeat The Daily Mail scaremongering please have the decency to head every post with Uniformed drivel. Thank you.

Eyesunderarock Sun 23-Jun-13 12:20:34

Then those children often become protected teenagers, and eventually run into situations that they have no idea to handle. My DD is at uni with numerous students that have fewer life skills than she did at 10.
I still think that the people who suck their teeth at this sort of incident are trying to convince themselves that nothing will happen because they are 'a better parent.'

The child died because she was targeted by a paedophile murderer.

tethersend Sun 23-Jun-13 12:21:47

But paedophiles can and do engineer opportunities, deliberately becoming known and trusted to the child and parent(s). They often target vulnerable children with parents who are unwilling or unable to protect them adequately.

In this case, he was obviously able to gain the mother's trust very quickly, no matter how misplaced it was. He is likely to have done this by identifying weaknesses in the family; they seemed 'down on their luck' and he portrayed himself as someone who could help.

jojane Sun 23-Jun-13 12:24:50

I have never actually let a waiter take my child, was just putting myself in the shoes of the poster who had, I am a waitress myself so have on occasion chatted to a child while a parent eats etx, but they are always within sight of the parent.

I realise that attackes aRe often by relatives of people known to the family. My MIL stepson is 14 but very troubled so I am always very wary when the kids go up to play in his room and keep an ear out and regualrly check etc, I have no real reason to think anything would happen but a slight gut feeling so I would never leave him alone with them and go out etc. he's very emotionally immature and so likes to play with them as he's on the same level but he can also be very sly and lash out etc.

MrsWolowitz Sun 23-Jun-13 12:27:07

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Boomba Sun 23-Jun-13 12:27:31

Why was he out of jail???

I've struggled with this, because I wouldnt have let any of my kids go with him in these circumstances.

But, I'm not vulnerable. You can't judge someone for that

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 12:29:16

I can't believe the mother fucker was out. When are we going to realise that paedos cannot be rehabilitated and must be locked up for life?

pumpkinsweetie Sun 23-Jun-13 12:32:01

They should never be realised, ever & this story shows exactly whysad

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 12:35:01

Child sex offences MUST start to carry sentences of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole.

Jan49 Sun 23-Jun-13 12:35:58

MrsW, I didn't say I've never made a parenting error. But SavoyCabbage was listing particular things and I've never done any of them. They all involve decisions, more or less. You decide whether to let your dc go off in the park alone or go on a playdate to a stranger's house. So you can decide not to let them.

K8Middleton Sun 23-Jun-13 12:37:10

This Channel 4 blog piece has lots of useful information looking at whether children are less safe now

fanjoforthemammaries7850 Sun 23-Jun-13 12:39:54

What a horrible thread.

As far as I know they were poor and hungry.

Probably not something you have really experienced

Then some plausible man offered to get them food.

Boomba Sun 23-Jun-13 12:41:46

You have no idea what any one of us has experienced fanjo

fanjoforthemammaries7850 Sun 23-Jun-13 12:43:07

Yes..hence I said "probably".

sashh Sun 23-Jun-13 12:43:22

He met them in a $ store, said they looked down on their look and offered to buy some clothes from Walmart.

They were in Walmart for about 2 hours before he offered to buy a snack, the McD was in the store.

He walked past McD and out of the door at about 11.00pm, the same time as her mother called 911.

Reading between the lines it looks as though mum wasn't letting her daughter out of her sight, or thought she wasn't.

This gives more detail

Unfortunately I can see it happening, you are looking for something in a dollar store, someone offers to get you some clothes and food and you spend a couple of hours with him. Mum probably thinks he is an angel.

And he is probably utterly charming.

You have two much smaller children, he says he is going to get a burger for them all, asks the oldest to help him carry the food.

It's 11pm, the kids are going to be cranky and you can see the the McDonald's, as it's inside a store it might be more like one of those counter types you get in food courts. I don't know this, just speculating.

You watch them walk towards McDonald's and then they go out of the door.

BackforGood Sun 23-Jun-13 12:50:25

To my mine, the main question in this is why on earth was he out of prison. It said he was just finished serving 438 days for child abuse and unlawful imprisonment, but then goes on to note a whole list of offences of abuse against children since 1977.
To my mind, even without the previous record, he should have been locked away for a lot longer than 14/15months for ONE crime, even before you take into account his history.
The sentences judges and parole board need to take a serious look at themselves.

RhondaJean Sun 23-Jun-13 12:53:24

Poor child. She was the same age as my youngest.

I think the fact the mother was happy having her and two younger children out in a supermarket at 11pm suggests she was perhaps somewhat chaotic in her parenting, but, you know what, the woman made a mistake she will live with forever.

I understand the desire to judge in these cases though - it's a way of us dealing with it and trying to maintain a sense of safety in our own lives, because it could never happen to us, we would never make those bad decisions. It's just a coping mechanism.

maddening Sun 23-Jun-13 13:54:27

The thing is with the type of person such as this murderer is that they are v capable of "charming" - it is how thet trap their prey - he saw a mum who was tired and juggling 3 dc late at night - she was vulnerable to his charms and I doubt he presented himself as a sex offender and paedophile.

zoraqueenofzeep Sun 23-Jun-13 14:02:24

If the story is accurate she should be prosecuted for child neglect and endangerment and have her other children permanently removed from her care. It is the responsibility of parents to protect their children when they are too young to protect themselves, that includes not handing them over to strange men who express interest in getting them alone.

This woman was either incredibly stupid and is incapable of caring for her other children as a result or she knew he was up to no good and accepted payment to allow him molest the child although did not expect for her to be murdered.

This child would be alive had her mother not handed her over to a sexual predator, to pretend she had no responsibility in that is absurd.

Floggingmolly Sun 23-Jun-13 14:06:26

It states in the article that he had befriended them that evening. She let a man she'd known for a few hours take her 8 year old off to McDonald's...
He didn't have to "present himself as a sex offender and paedophile", most people have enough sense of self preservation to know better than this, surely???

BridgetBidet Sun 23-Jun-13 14:08:27

As others have said he tricked the mother. The McDonalds was in the Walmart store and she just allowed them to walk over to a different part of the store together and he walked out of the front door with her and took her away in his van. It wasn't like she let him go off anywhere with her, she thought they were just going a few meters away.

KD0706 Sun 23-Jun-13 14:30:56

I feel very sorry for the mother (as well as the child obviously). She will have to live with this.

If what sassh says is accurate I feel even more sorry for the mother as people are spouting untrue thins about her and blaming her when she did very little wrong.
Yes she shouldn't have let the man take her child, but she thought they weren't going far, realised very quickly that something was amiss (must have been watching, hot on their heels etc) and contacted 911 very quickly.

I know I've probably made lots of mistakes in parenting my children. I don't think I would do this particular thing but it does sound like this mum has a much more chaotic life than I have.

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 16:50:41

This man had a record from the fucking 1970s of abusing children, attempts to kidnap and assorted criminal activities and he was out?

WHY on EARTH is there blame attached to what sounds like a poor, vulnerable single parent???

This crime was perpetrated by a career paedo who should NEVER had had the opportunity to do what he did.

Floggingmolly Sun 23-Jun-13 17:04:52

The mum handed him the opportunity on a plate, expat.
The fact that he'd doubtless have found some other unfortunate victim if she hadn't doesn't minimise that.

expatinscotland Sun 23-Jun-13 17:21:27

She was vulnerable and poor.

How disgusting to say she is responsible!

Hey, want to go there? Why was the father of these children not paying up for her to feed and clothe them?

BULLSHIT she is responsible!

This man has a 35-year-old criminal record with a string of child abuse offenses and attempts of kidnap of children.

Why the HELL was he out?

ANYONE convicted of child sex offenses MUST be given life imprisonment without the opportunity of parole because there is NO way to rehabilitate such individuals. They are very clever, manipulative liars. They prey on the vulnerable - poor, learning disabled, substance abusers, children in care, etc etc.

This is the fault of the person who stands accused of abducting and murdering this child.

So, is April Jones' mother as responsible, too, for her child's murder, seeing as she let a 5-year-old play well out of her sight for hours?

Or is the criminal found guilty for murdering her?

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