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Nick Ross on rape - warning you may feel the need to punch a wall

(485 Posts)
DuelingFanjo Sat 25-May-13 23:09:37

sorry it's a daily mail link.

I am full of rage, particularly his comments on aggravated rape. Wtf. Presumably he means that there are situations in which he will not be able to stop himself from raping someone because it is aggravated. This has made me so angry. Please they'll me he no longer works for the BBC. I truly hope he loses his career over this. How the hell are we supposed to educate people who think like this?

limitedperiodonly Sun 26-May-13 15:31:34

bowlers surely you've noticed the 'cry rape' rhetoric. It's a Daily Mail stalwart but you don't have to read the Mail to notice it because the myth is widespread. On the rare occasions a woman is prosecuted for making a false claim it's rightly reported, but with far more alacrity than convictions for rape.

It's what makes otherwise sensible men fear that they might have consensual sex and end up in a police station. Some women fear it for their men too.

I detected it in your own post which is why I replied telling you to calm yourself. I might have got it wrong though and you might have no such fears. If that's the case, please accept my apologies.

Alisvolatpropiis Sun 26-May-13 15:44:09

I clicked on the link kind of expecting the outrage over the article to be a bit ott. I was wrong. The man is a complete and utter misguided,misoginistic prick.

Women are safer now than ever? Open mouthed shock that he wrote that and was being serious. Utter fucking moron.

Alisvolatpropiis Sun 26-May-13 15:49:56

I am genuinely incensed. The same things happen to women now as they did 100,500,1000 years ago. The fact there is legislation against these things doesn't stop them happening and doesn't make women safer. It offers after the event justice at best. Not even that if the number of reported vs prosecuted rape statistics are anything to go by.

<off too scream into a pillow>

Darkesteyes Sun 26-May-13 17:24:34

Brilliant blog Le Stewpot.

LeStewpot Sun 26-May-13 17:37:26

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ImagineJL Sun 26-May-13 17:38:52

Going back a few pages where someone said it can be "messy" if a woman has sex when she's drunk and later regrets it, implying that this highlights a grey area when it comes to rape. I have had sex with someone when I was drunk, and then regretted it the following day. I have also been raped. I can assure you the two things felt very very different. No worry about any mix-up there.

LineRunner Sun 26-May-13 17:57:50

Nick Ross can't write, can't think, can't use evidence properly, and it comes across that he would sell his soul to sell a book. His road to hell is paved with cliches.

Criminologically, the man is laughing stock.

TheFlipsideOfTheCoin Sun 26-May-13 19:46:23

I'm a bit late coming back to this thread but wanted to thank people for their kind words a few pages ago.

hackmum Sun 26-May-13 19:57:38

Yes, absolutely excellent, LeStewpot.

Did anybody here the interview a couple of days ago on the Today programme with a woman whose grand-daughter was sexually abused at the age of 6? Three years later when the case finally came to court the defence barrister accused her of being a liar and she was so traumatised the judge stopped the case and let the defendant go (unbelievable, to my mind). Three years on, at the age of 12, the girl is still deeply distressed by the whole business and suffering from what sounded like PTSD.

I just wonder what Ross makes of that, and whether, perhaps, he might consider that he should reserve his anger for that rather than at women for having the nerve to possess a vagina and look attractive.

Oh, and I wonder what he thinks about boys and men being raped by other men? Is it their fault for wearing provocative clothing? For going out late at night and getting drunk? For walking home unaccompanied?

CoalDustWoman Sun 26-May-13 20:44:31

If someone with these links to crime and justice type organisations (yes, from Wikipedia):

Ross coined the term Crime Science to promote a practical, multidisciplinary and outcome-focused approach to crime reduction (as distinct from what he claimed was often theory-driven criminology). The Jill Dando Institute which he inspired has grown to have a substantial role in University College London, spawning a new Department of Security and Crime Science[15] and other offshoots including a Forensic Science unit and a secure data lab. Ross is Chairman of the Board of the Institute, a Visiting Professor, and an Honorary Fellow of UCL, as well as an Honorary Fellow of the Academy of Experimental Criminologists. His crime science concept has since been adopted in universities elsewhere notably in New York, Cincinnati and Texas, with formal crime science courses at Loughborough in the UK and at Twente University in the Netherlands. The British Ministry of Defence DSTL has a fast-growing crime science unit and there have been plans to create a crime science department at the University of Manchester. He is a Trustee of Crimestoppers. He was an adviser to Crime Concern and Victim Support.
In 2011 he was tipped as a possible Police and crime commissioner for London.[24]

and still can't get that rape law is :

1)A person (A) commits an offence if—
(a)he intentionally penetrates the vagina, anus or mouth of another person (B) with his penis,
(b)B does not consent to the penetration, and
(c)A does not reasonably believe that B consents.
(2)Whether a belief is reasonable is to be determined having regard to all the circumstances, including any steps A has taken to ascertain whether B consents.

then what hope do rape victims have with a jury?

His article reads like something that tosser M i k e B uc h a n a n would write.

IfNotNowThenWhen Sun 26-May-13 20:59:24

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

hobnobsaremyfave Sun 26-May-13 21:23:25

glad that went.

WafflyVersatile Sun 26-May-13 21:45:40

It's relatively uncontroversial until he gets to rape then it's facepalms a go go.

Stab a drunk sleeping on a bench and you are 100% responsible for murder. You wouldn't get a reduced sentence because that drunk tempted you by being an easy target.

Oh, but if you rape a woman who is drunk then she shares the responsibility? Fucks sake.

NumTumDeDum Sun 26-May-13 21:51:18

Oh I didn't see it Hob. What was the gist?

McNewPants2013 Sun 26-May-13 21:58:46

Hope this make sense.

I love drunken sex with my husband, it makes me feel more confident and sexier. So is DH wrong in having sex with me while I am drunk.

McNewPants2013 Sun 26-May-13 21:59:14

Reading this thread has just made me think that is all

IfNotNowThenWhen Sun 26-May-13 22:04:22

Wtf? I basically said what a lot if others had said, about nick Ross protesting too much, and expecting to see him one day soon on BBC news. And there was something about his potential experiences in jail. Probably get deleted again. Don't care much.

McNewPants2013 Sun 26-May-13 22:07:01

I hope he is not going to be on the bbc news on a rape charge, because that would mean some women life has been hell.

NumTumDeDum Sun 26-May-13 22:08:42

McNewPants as long as you are consenting, which you imply you are, then yes he's fine. He has a reasonable belief you are consenting.

IfNotNowThenWhen Sun 26-May-13 22:08:45

No. I dont hope he is either. But I would not be at all surprised.

NumTumDeDum Sun 26-May-13 22:10:34

If however you say no, or your wishes cannot be ascertained because you have passed out or you are withdrawn or distressed then he can no longer have a reasonable belief you are consenting.

McNewPants2013 Sun 26-May-13 22:12:39

He would never do it if I was passed out or asleep.

Darkesteyes Sun 26-May-13 22:16:12

Great article from Owen Jones about this.

NumTumDeDum Sun 26-May-13 22:17:20

Quite right too.

CoalDustWoman Sun 26-May-13 22:18:14

McNewPants, if you are too drunk to consent, then yes there is an issue. But only if you report him to the police, of course. Being a bit tipsy to have a bit of dutch courage is not the same. Although, wouldn't you rather be confident without the booze? (None of by business).

IfNotNowThenWhen - wishing rape on anyone is beyond the pale. Or haven't you grasped this consent thing and the horror when it is ignored?

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