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(21 Posts)
likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:02:09

what they would do 5yo ds naughty lately, complaining about everything, being very rude and ignorant and generally really mouthy. due to go swimming tomorrow, he is learning to swim and had previously been very afraid of water. didn't go last week due to illness but behaviour today has been appalling shouting, refusing, ignoring and being incrediblly rude to grandparents. I don't know what to do part of me thinks he dorsnt deserve to go swimming but dont want to ruin our progress by not going for 3 weeks. could instead withdraw all priveleges like his ds and skylanders. this isn't a one off he is being really difficult lately. people have crept round him and treated him since a family bereavement, me included sad

freddiemisagreatshag Sun 05-May-13 14:03:31

I wouldn't stop him swimming. You need to find what really makes him tick, the thing he really wants, and stop that.

freddiemisagreatshag Sun 05-May-13 14:04:47

Or alternatively, go utterly hard core - every single time he is out of line he goes to his room. With no DS no skylanders to play with.

But you need to have nerves of steel like me to do that one.

ImTooHecsyForYourParty Sun 05-May-13 14:06:00

I wouldn't use the swimming. It's a good skill to have.

I would normally suggest taking his toys and making him earn them back, but you say he's suffered a bereavement? How long ago and who was it? Does he need help to process it?

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:06:02

I am totally at a loss sad he is being unbelievable I have banned electrical things which he isn't happy about but it doesn't stop his outbursts. he is usually lovely but once he is in a mood its like he can't calm down at all. we had a close family bereavement in November and I will be first to admit he has been spoilt and pandered too by the wider family

ThingsThatMakeYouGoHmmmmmmmmm Sun 05-May-13 14:07:36

Keep swimming. Don't withdraw that, it might save his life one day. As Freddie said, what does he love to do most in the world ? That is where you strike.............. <evil cackles>

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:08:26

it wad on November , his nanna he was incredibly close to her. he talks about her often and with ease has a memory garden and box. I wonder if he is angry but can't express it. I don't what to do sad

CloudsAndTrees Sun 05-May-13 14:10:36

Don't stop him swimming, it's something he needs to learn, not a treat to be taken away as punishment.

How close was the family bereavement?

It is acceptable to pander to a child when they have lost a parent, but six months is a very long time for a 5yo.

Taking away the electronics and allowing them to be earned back would be a good start, but it may be that you need to start asking for help from outside agencies if the bereavement has affected him that badly.

WafflyVersatile Sun 05-May-13 14:13:24

There is some guidance here that may help.

www.mhprofessional.com/downloads/products/0071545271/kinz27.pdf

oinkment Sun 05-May-13 14:17:44

I find that removing all screens for a while massively improves my children in all ways.

Also, am curious to know why you are annoyed with him for being ignorant.

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:20:34

thanks for the link. he is for the most part okay but it is silly thing that make it start. will stick to removing electrical things and be firmer. I just want my happy boy back sad.

DIYapprentice Sun 05-May-13 14:20:42

DS1 (6 years old) is very mouth at the moment, and every 'no' gets a huge drama, 'woe is me' reaction.

When he starts getting the whiney tone in his voice I tell him to lose that tone right away. Tantrums, out of the room into time out in the corridor straight away. If the tantrum doesn't stop in the corridor by the time I count to 5 then he goes upstairs to his room where I don't have to listen to him as much. Then I simply ignore him - being ignored is one thing he REALLY, REALLY doesn't like, but until the tantrum stops he gets absolutely no attention from me (fortunately he's not one to break things in his room). He then gets told that another tantrum will result in X being taken away from him, and then I follow through. What REALLY hurts him is when DS2 plays with X and he knows he isn't allowed to. I don't do this that often as TBH he will easily amuse himself with other toys and this really isn't a major sacrifice to him (except perhaps the IPad!)

I've also purchased a toy he really, really wants and he needs to earn a certain amount of stars to earn it.

He has a reward chart with things he has to do to earn stars, like his reading homework, getting dressed in the morning, brushing his own teeth, etc. He gets a star for the general ones if he does them every day of the week on his own without making a fuss. The homework ones has a tiered system, 4 gets 1 star, 7 gets 2 stars.

It will probably take about 5 weeks for him to earn it solely based on this. (Was a £30 toy so figure £1 per star was fair). However, he has the opportunity to earn extra stars with extra good behaviour, doing extra chores (picked the dandelion flower for me my yesterday!) etc.

He can also LOSE stars with really bad behaviour, such as too many tantrums, tantrums when we're out and about, etc. This seems to be working (so far).

WilsonFrickett Sun 05-May-13 14:20:48

Get a hold of 'how to talk so children will listen' - I return to that book again and again and it has really helped me when DS takes turns like this. He's acting out - whether that's directly because of the bereavement or because he has been spoilt since, so you need to get under the skin of that behaviour and why. Basically the book teaches you how to name and accept what the child feels, and where there is bad behaviour there is a natural consequence.

So stopping his swimming tomorrow isn't the right consequence - but if he was incredibly rude and shouty on the way to swimming you would be perfectly OK to say 'because of this shouting and rudeness I don't want to continue with this journey now, because you are making me sad and upset. We will go home now.' You have to deal with each bit of behaviour at the time and help them understand that there will be a directly related consequence. But the plan is you use the other techniques in there to help you deal with the behaviour before that point.

Anyway, I'm not on commission wink but I think it would really help you.

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:21:40

by ignorant I mean, I ask him to do something and he will ignore when I know he has heard sorry should of put ignoring

claraschu Sun 05-May-13 14:25:50

I think it is almost never a good idea to keep a child from any sort of exercise; it is so healthy for them (both mentally and physically) to be active. Children who are moody, grumpy, rude, etc., usually need more time running around or swimming, not less.

Ban things which are not good for him anyway, or let him suffer the natural consequences of his bad behaviour.

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 14:31:36

right still swimming a good idea then, I agree he is much better when he is kept busy and problems occur when he is bored more so.

HerrenaHarridan Sun 05-May-13 15:44:17

I would like to second, "how to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk"

It's available cheaply on amazon.

I have even bought the sister copy for a friend who is training as a teacher"how to teach so kids can learn"

It will give you lots ideas on how to phrase things so there is no room for kids to feel hard done by and help improve your insight into how your dc interprets what you say

likesnowflakesinanocean Sun 05-May-13 16:56:07

will have a look, said sorry to his grandparents and is quite upset that he's upset them and lost any electrical priveleges tonight. low and behold he is out trampolining with a smile on his face. things have been hard , hopefully we can all make some positive changes

kawliga Mon 06-May-13 00:28:01

One thing that works for me (so far, dd is 5 nearly 6) when she ignores my requests even though I know she heard - I don't repeat the request or say anything further about it. That's if I'm sure she heard and is just ignoring. Soon enough she will come along and ask me for something (to eat, to play with, etc) and I say 'yes, sure, as soon as you do what I asked you'. Slow progress but she's gradually learning that if I ask her to do something she will eventually have to do it, so she might as well get on with it. This doesn't always work, if it's something that has to be done right away then I can't let it wait but it works for things which don't have to be done immediately eg clearing away her toys.

Hope the grandparents are being patient with him though, he's only 5 and they all go through this stage.

steppemum Mon 06-May-13 00:47:25

I love that book too.

my ds can be really mouthy, but I always find he is actually much better after exercise. It helps him to release tension I think. So I wouldn't use the swimming.

He is also much worse after lots of screens, so we have tight restrictions on screen time

likesnowflakesinanocean Sat 11-May-13 20:37:25

swimming went well and his general behaviour has been better but he is still acting up. silly things like making silly noises when i talk, rude comments. we have spent some time doing the memory garden and talked this week. I know he misses his nanna, and im trying my bloody hardest sad

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