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This Judge is unbelievable. The case is horrific but he also blames her? Murder of Carmen Miron Buchacra

(167 Posts)
vivizone Fri 22-Mar-13 22:50:12

I am so angry. How is this possible?

7 years for killing your partner with a 7 week baby because as Judge said:

'I accept what caused you to lose self control was the cumulative effect of emotional abuse by Gaby over a significant period.

Because they had been arguing by text all day. So clearly she abused him.

What planet are these Judges from?

FatimaLovesBread Sat 23-Mar-13 01:29:46

I've just seen this and new there'd be a thread about it.
Absolutely horrendous. I have a 17 week old and if DH was out on an all day bender I'd definitely be threatening to leave.
The victim blaming is disgraceful

RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief Sat 23-Mar-13 01:35:27

I think you can write to the Home Secretary and ask him to review the sentence. I'm going to look into it and do so if my understanding is correct. Maybe we should start a MN campaign if there's enough interest.

RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief Sat 23-Mar-13 01:38:00

[Coughs] Ask "her" to review the sentence. It's Theresa May isn't it? Crap. My feminist credentials are shredded. Never have I wished there was an edit button so much as now.

fuckwittery Sat 23-Mar-13 08:25:42

its the attorney general, dominic grieve, fastida linked above.
appalling. she carried out sustained pyschological abuse? Over the 11 weeks of being a new mother? the change of murder weapon is shocking, I cannot believe the jury acquitted him of murder

Moominsarehippos Sat 23-Mar-13 08:34:15

Who is looking after the baby now? Her family or social services? Poor kid. I hope to god when he gets out (which won't be all that long, let's be realistic) he does not get to be within a hundred miles.

I hope to god he gets his punishment, in this world or the next.

Moominsarehippos Sat 23-Mar-13 08:37:24

If my DH had the 'right' to strangle me every time we had a bad row (and vice versa) he'd have been in the dock years ago.

The only 'grey' area would be if one partner had subjected the other to a long period rape, beatings, financial abuse, threats, fears for their/their child's safety... Not 'fuck off, I'm leaving you'.

meditrina Sat 23-Mar-13 08:55:46

The "cumulative effect" defence/mitigation was long fought for: it is the only means by which a (usually woman) victim of prolonged DV escapes a murder charge as when s/he snaps, even when the straw that broke the camel's back was not a big event. I think it is important that this defence remains, and unless we want to start gendering the murder laws, it must be available to both sexes.

Sentencing policy often leaves me baffled.

But the verdict was reached by a Jury who had heard the full evidence.

thezebrawearspurple Sat 23-Mar-13 09:12:08

Outrageous, how on earth did they find a jury stupid enough to accept a manslaughter verdict when they had her murder on tape! It wasn't self defence overkill or a result of someone losing it and unwittingly lashing out with too much force, he forced his way in and brutally murdered her while he was telling her that he was going to kill her and she was begging for her life. Then he blames her for it! What an evil psychopath, he was the abuser here, how dare they put that on her.

She did not deserve that and not only did she lose her life, her baby lost a loving mother. Seven years is an insult but so is the verdict.

krasnayaploshad Sat 23-Mar-13 09:23:40

I have emailed the attorney general's office as fastidia has suggested.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:25:01

You are so not being unreasonable.

These is the second case I've read about where the sentence for a horrible crime is a fucking joke.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:28:21

There was a thread on here recently from a woman who was upset because her husband had gone out on the lash all night and she was stressed and upset.

A number of posters piled in to tell her off for being controlling and he was probably doing it to get away from her.

So a few like that on the jury, they wouldn't take too much convincing.

bruffin Sat 23-Mar-13 09:34:42

You don't know the full story or the evidence the jury saw.
If it had been reverse and a woman suffering emotional abuse who killed her husband this thread would have been full of disgust that the woman got any sentence at all.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:36:37

Yeah, sure bruffin. Care to back up that fatuous assertion with some evidence?

bruffin Sat 23-Mar-13 09:40:47

Ive been on musket to know exactly what the response would be.
As i said so many on this thread have commented with no evidence other than a snippets in a newspaper.
It's fatuous to write and complain about a sentence on a case you know nothing about.

bochead Sat 23-Mar-13 09:44:51

Part of my pride in being British has always been based on our justice system.

However a young man is burnt alive for the "crime" of being autistic & gay.
A new mother is murdered in front of her child for the "crime" of complaining about the other parent going on a drunken bender?

In neither case is it considered "murder". In both cases the sentences handed down trivialise that gravity of the victims suffering to such a degree that we are all shamed.

Someone needs to assure me that this murderer will not be allowed anywhere near that innocent child, and that her mother's family will be allowed to raise her in peace someplace safe.

If we can no longer trust in the rule of law, then the very foundations of our civilisation are shaken and under threat.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:46:12

Well, if you have evidence to support your opinion then you won't have any problem producing it, will you?

Can you provide an example of a case where a woman has snapped, killed her husband after emotional abuse and received a comparative sentence, or been acquitted?

FlouncyMcFlouncer Sat 23-Mar-13 09:48:44

How the fuck can it not be murder when he changed weapon halfway through because the first one wasn't working????????

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:50:26

I think that's the worst aspectbochead

It's utterly outrageous that you can kill someone and get such a ridiculously lenient sentence.

There was a case recently (linked on here) where a man stabbed his estranged wife to death and was convicted of manslaughter; he only served a few years and was able to return to the family home, with his children.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 09:51:44

Exactly Flouncy

bruffin Sat 23-Mar-13 09:53:44

I don't need to prove anything.
Last post by bochead proves a lot. It assumes this is about a text fight on the day of the murder,when it obviously isn't.
There was a recent case where a woman had made numerous rape allegations and was sentenced, there were a lot of posts claiming she must be mentally ill and didn't deserve a prison sentence.

LovesBeingWokenEveryNight Sat 23-Mar-13 09:55:07

Words fail me. I read this last night and had to put my phone away before I ranted on Fb and got myself into trouble.

To basically say it was her fault is so shocking especially in light of the recording.

flippinada Sat 23-Mar-13 10:00:15

Which means you can't back up your opinion with fact.

Accusing somebody of a crime they didn't commit, while heinous, is hardly the same as killing someone now is it?

Can you tell us how long the woman got? I wonder how long that compares to the sentences people are talking about on here.

edam Sat 23-Mar-13 10:03:13

bruffin, that's an entirely different crime, you are only dragging it in because you are struggling to bolster your very shaky case. It's not just 'snippets from newspapers' it's an actual recording of his tirade of abuse while he was strangling her to death. In front of their baby, FFS.

Re. this horrendous crime - I hate the way bullies and abusers try to claim victimhood for themselves. All that 'poor little me, I'm being so oppressed by these uppity women/black/gay/disabled/older or younger people'. Victims of discrimination make one tiny little bit of progress e.g overturning horrendous sexism in the legal system that said it was excusable for a man to murder his wife because he was provoked, but not OK for a woman, and then the bullies turn it against them, trying to claim they are the victims. It's shameful.

bruffin Sat 23-Mar-13 10:07:45

Flippepda i suspect i have hit the nail on the head from your reaction. I have been on MN for 8 years i know exactly how MN ticks when it comes to men and mental illness. There is zero sympathy.
You have no idea about the relationship between this man and woman other than the newspaper report which has virtually no details.

CecilyP Sat 23-Mar-13 10:08:08

Are you expecting Bruffin to provide you with an entire transcript of the trial, flippinada? While it is hard to imagine what the victim may have done that justified either the verdict or the lightness of the sentence, there is nothing in either of the linked articles about the sustained emotional abuse that was used as the defence. This is what both the judge and jury would have heard that we have not.

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