To think that the rioters in East Belfast are mainly bored teenagers rather than loyalists?(31 Posts)
All the news footage I've seen indicates they're between 12-18 years old.
Are they really rioting because of the flag or because it's something to do?
gin that's it totally accurate; my DS attends a 'Protestant' school but he's no religion (mixed marriage - chose not to baptise) and his school is about 1/3 Protestant, 1/3 catholic, 1/3 "other".
I agree there is something 'more' in east Belfast. But I don't get the lament that there's been 'constant' erosion of the Protestant culture, what specifically go they mean? For me a flag is just a symbol, fly the flag, don't fly it. Who really gives a fuck? Cultural identity should bf more than a flag. I also don't know what they hope to achieve now, there's no way it's going to back up or the other side will kick off do its an impasse. Protestant leaders and representatives need to take some leadership and make it clear that is not going to happen.
And while it's maybe on 1000 people directly involved in the riots, what about the thousands of people who spend July parading, decked in Union Jacks and singing sectarian songs? What about the thousands of people who vote on sectarian lines? What about the people supporting naming a town park after a hunger striker?
It's so depressing and self-destructive.
After everything that's been achieved in the last fifteen years or so.
Tee - there are 61 integrated schools in N Ireland - with only 5% of children attending one. That means 95% of children in N Ireland still attend a catholic or a protestant school.
IMO it was started by the unionist politicians playing with people like puppeteers, all to get Naomi Long of the Alliance party out of her seat in Westminster. The flag vote was just the thing they chose to rouse the population, if that hadn't happened, they would have chosen something else. I like to think they didn't anticipate it kicking off the way it has, especially in East Belfast but who knows.
There is definitely something more going on out in East Belfast - while there was violence in many other parts of the city before Christmas (I was caught up in some of it when they attacked the car I was driving and was exceedingly lucky to walk away), it has died down now it seems.
Most riots are not carried out by people driven by a cause. They may be triggered by a cause or a select few idealists, but it's nearly always the case that lots of disaffected people get stuck in for the ride and the whole thing morphs into something very unpleasant and often completely counterproductive to the original cause.
I'm from there but no longer living there and some of the shit about it on fb is awful. I think yabu in thinking there's not more to it. It's orchestrated by older loyalists
It's so depressing, and makes me ashamed to be from Belfast with the way we are being portrayed.
There are an awful lot of dreadful postings on fb at the minute from grown men and women that are just disgusting and make me feel so sad. I have a look at an ironic page on fb which shows posts poking fun at some of the idiotic comments people are making but just read one from someone who was wishing that hitler had hated republicans as much as Jews and how he would love to see them all exterminated. It is appalling to me that some people still think like this over here.
children were being pushed in buggies, carried on shoulders all wrapped in the union flag. It's being put into them from as young as that.
I hated seeing that.
It would be different if they were teaching their children to be proud to be British, that's a positive thing to involve you child in, but they aren't. These types of people use the flag to perpetuate hate and divide and are hell bent on dragging NI backwards.
Thankfully it won't happen.
" N Ireland (although peaceful for a while until now) remains a sectarian country, with clear protestant/catholic divides."
Not completely true. There are plenty of integrated areas/schools/etc. It's maybe 1,000 people involved in this nonsense.
And if their parents weren't pushing them towards this, these young people wouldn't be involved. They'd have no idea they are 'suppose to be upset' over it all.
I was shopping in Belfast city centre on Saturday and although the protest was peaceful, children were being pushed in buggies, carried on shoulders all wrapped in the union flag. It's being put into them from as young as that.
It matters not that they weren't alive during the 'troubles' they will never be forgotten or indeed be forgiven by many.
I'm in Belfast today again. It really is a lovely city when you ignore what's happening in other parts.
Another one here from NI and I'm ashamed, angry and disgusted at the behaviour & the way it's being portrayed across the media.
Unfortunately the young people aren't on their own out there, they're simply gullible and impressionable and are having their strings pulled by people much much higher up, all with their own agenda.
I'm in a mixed marriage, I grew up in a nationalist area, my dh the opposite, he was an Orangeman - it pleased me when the peace process began and a ceasefire declared - now I'm wondering how long it will last.
The decision about the flag was the catalyst for years of pent up anger to be unleashed, it's a crying shame that some of the people behind it can see no further than the end of their own bigoted noses.
The majority of people here don't want this, don't agree with it and certainly don't endorse the behaviour of a mob of ignorant people.
YABU - there are plenty of other places in the UK with bored teenagers, who don't end up rioting. I've been out of NI for nearly 20 years thank God. What scares me is that apparently normal sensible people although saying that the rioting is terrible, still defend the purpose of rioting (if that makes sense?)
As for, "they weren't even alive when it happened originally" - that's nonsense. N Ireland (although peaceful for a while until now) remains a sectarian country, with clear protestant/catholic divides.
It's the same caliber of trailer trash that hurled abuse and condoms at the children going to Holy Cross primary school in 2001.
They're as thick as mince.
Attitudes like this are ingrained, im just so grateful to my parents for bringing me up without prejudice or bigotry.
I do get why people are annoyed, I dont get the violent reaction.
It's totally ridiculous. And it's pretty much understood being directed by the UVF, which is not made up of young people.
Although young people are certainly involved. But they aren't doing this on their own volition. They weren't even alive when it happened originally. Old men always send young men out to fight their battles. This is no different.
I live in South Belfast, my husband grew up here, in the NW, and lived in East Belfast during a lot of the worst of it. He is disgusted by the whole thing.
"When it first started I couldn't understand how people could get so upset about a flag, however I have a number of friends on my fb from NI and this has really upset and angered them." having friends who were upset about it wouldn't make me think it was any less ridiculous.
I was brought up in Belfast and my mother spent the last 30 years of her life in NI. Watching the news takes me back to the bad old days when casual bigotry was the order of the day and actually, it isn't the bored teenagers who bother me as much as the older people who clearly demonstrate that nothing under the surface has changed so far as the Loyalists are concerned.
I don't live very far from all the trouble and find it quite frankly heartbreaking and embarrasing to see a small minority taking us backwards after all the work that has been put in trying to take us forwards.
Most of the people you see on TV causing the problems are youths, what you often don't see are the older men directing them. It is harder to arrest a child and if they do they just get a slap on the wrist.
I also can't believe their total lack of insight or intelligence, where do they think violence is going to get them? It's certainly not going to get the flag back up permanently, as I can't see how they could ever do that now as it will be seen as giving into violence. They are their own worst enemy, if the had kept it peaceful then maybe people would have been prepared to listen.
Needles I agree
An opportunity to 'prove themselves' to their heroes!
Its not about the flag anymore.
I live near there.
Often it is a mix of all ages, but they shove the younger ones to the front.
I might get flamed for saying that, but in my experience (of once being a youth in a disaffected Loyalist area) the young ones are dozy enough to be full of zeal and want to impress those around them.
All so fecking embarrassing. Makes me embarrassed to be a NI Protestant sometimes.
Im sick of it...fed up sitting in traffic after work because they are bored little children!
I thought the same then last night on the News at Ten they interviewed people aged 50-60 from the scene.
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