To be worried about what a friend is getting into?

[plaingirly]

She was telling me all about Vision Forum and how she wants to order all sorts of books and dvds from them. She has been getting into religion pretty heavily through blogs and internet forums.

I worry about her as she tends to jump head first into everything.

She has started only wearing skirts and talking about gender roles.

I have been looking into Vision Forum and there is some icky stuff written about them. She is now into the Stay At Home Daughter thing, is growing her hair and leaving little religious leaflets everywhere at work.

I don't know whether to just let her be.

What she is doing isn't popular at work and I don't want her to mess stuff up for herself as this might just be a phase. Currently she sees me as on her side as I am interested in the Amish!

[alphabite]

Leave her to it. She's an adult. Just be there if she needs you but let her come to you.

I don't know anything about Vision Forum but everyone has a right to choose religion if they wish and some people find religion late.

I wouldn't understand it either, as an aethiest but I'd accept her decisions.

[plaingirly]

I am a Christian so I understand the faith thing. I just don't want her to do anything dangerous. Plus if this is a phase she is still going to need her job afterwards.

She was joking today about moving to America to find a husband at least I hope she was joking.

[ThreadWatcher]

I have never heard of vision forum before.

Im off to investigate :)

[AgentZigzag]

I would say it's a similar thing to commenting on someones new DP, you can only give advice when it's asked for but it's up to them whether they take that advice.

If you really do care for her I would tread carefully, the last thing you want is to fall out and leave her without the connection and support she has with you.

How long have you known her? What kind of friendship do you normally have? What do you mean when you say you don't want her to do anything dangerous? Dangerous in what way?

[AgentZigzag]

I've just had a very quick look at their page, and it does seem quite extreme in the way they prescribe you should live your life.

But then, some people get comfort from that kind of structure and community.

[ThreadWatcher]

this is interesting - LOADS to read on that link!

I have heard of the 'quiverfull' idea before but never vision forum

What do your friends family think? her dh? her church?

I would be quite concerned to tbh.

[plaingirly]

She isn't married and I don't think her family know much about it.

I don't mean dangerous like drugs or anything more that she will get herself into a situation that she can't get out of.

I don't know how popular the whole movement is in America but I hadn't heard of anything similar over here.

[Alliwantisaroomsomewhere]

Daft. Fucking daft.

[ThreadWatcher]

I think there are some churches over here that subscribe to it a bit or a lot tbh (having now read a bit about it)
I certainly know some families who may be keen on it (never had a chance to politely ask though)

[MamaMary]

I am familiar with Vision Forum. Strange that a single girl would be attracted to it as it's so family oriented.


I don't subscribe to their values or 'vision' at all.

What kind of church does she go to?

[BrianButterfield]

I don't think it's strange that a single woman would be attracted to it - as it promotes unmarried daughters staying at home it's the perfect get-out clause for someone who might be fearful of independence, isn't it. Almost an escape from adulthood.

[plaingirly]

She is C of E.

Her parents aren't religious so I can't see them going for the stay at home daughter thing!

Before she got into this she was adamant she didn't want children - now she wants to get married and have babies. She tells me about bloggers who are her age and onto their 3rd child.

[AgentZigzag]

I know a couple of people who seem to spend their whole lives searching for something, trying out different ways of living, faiths, countries etc.

They aren't happy and think doing these things will fill the hole they've got, there's nothing to say they won't find it or are wrong looking though.

Having a ready made lifestyle like that wouldn't be for me (bet there's no gin for a start ), and reminds me a bit of the way prison works in that the individuals don't have to think for themselves because everything's taken care of.

But some people want that and find it works for them. If the organisation doesn't make them do anything they don't want to do or illegal and they're free to leave at any time, it's just a different way of living your life isn't it?

[WorraLiberty]

It's not for me but who's to say it won't work for her?

It obviously works for some people in order to exist.

As Zigzag said, as long as she's free to leave it's up to her.

[AgentZigzag]

After hearing the stories about how some cults can work, I can understand why you might think the people are there because they're being coerced.

If that type of life isn't for you it makes it difficult to fathom how they can be so weak in not thinking for themselves, they must be being forced by others using the religion to brainwash them into not seeing the situation for what it is (to us).

Like the religious fanaticism that produces suicide bombers, it's playing on vulnerable people and deluding them into believing they've found somewhere they belong at last, with people they can trust and who care about them.

I don't know anything about the organisation you're talking about and sure it's a caring and wholesome way of life, but it's difficult to not tar them with the same brush if you're just looking in from the outside.

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

It's not a religion, it's a cult designed to enrich Doug Phillips. They think terminating ectopic pregnancies is murder and beating infants with rods is commanded by God.

Send her to Free Jinger.

And be glad she's not in America, they can't do her as much harm over the Internet.

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

Free Jinger

Just keep emphasising the brutal mistreatment of children unfortunate enough to be born into this whackjobbery.

You might want to start your own thread at FJ, I don't have time to post there these days nor do I need to since I no longer live next door to a "Family Integrated Church" but it was very interesting when I did and seems to have gotten much bigger recently.

[ThreadWatcher]

Holdme - was the family integrated church in the UK?
Why is it called free jinger?

How did your friend first get into this plaingirly? - It definately sounds like something to actively run away from tbh.
Perfectly possible to hold some of their ideals if wished but flinging herself into it headlong doesnt sound like a good idea at all.

[AgentZigzag]

It's also a bit of an extreme contrast with the C of E isn't it?

Almost laughably so with the C of E being so laid back they're verging on the horizontal.

[solidgoldbrass]

It sounds revolting but unfortunately, just as if your friend was getting into crystal meth or dating a really vile man, you can't stop her and she's not going to listen to you. Her core problem is that she percieves herself as inadequate: possibly the only thing you could do would be to boost her self esteem and reminder that she's clever. Then she might realise that she doesn't need to be owned and can make a life for herself.

[HoldMeCloserTonyDanza]

No, this was in the US.

It's called Free Jinger because it originally grew out of discussing the Duggar family (the same Duggars who don't believe in allowing their daughters to go to college, who use their older girls as surrogate mothers for the younger children, who promote childrearing books which encourage violently beating disobedient children, and who Vision Forum recently named "Mother of the Year").

[plaingirly]

She started reading blogs by stay at home daughters and then got on to some message boards I think.

She does like the Duggars!

At the moment I don't want her to stop telling me what she is up to. We used to chat about the Amish (when that tv show was on) so I think she sees me as more open to the lifestyle.

I can see the appeal. People tell her she shouldn't be living at home at her age but these sites and blogs tell her she should. Plus they have the whole perfect family image going on.

She just jumps into things. She was all set to go join the Amish last year and before that she was convinced that she was called to be a nun.

We are the same age but I feel like her mother!

[AKissIsNotAContract]

How old is she?

[TheProvincialLady]

Chances are this will blow over too then. SGB is right - you can't do anything to stop your friend. It's all about her low self esteem and you can't do anything about that except be kind to her and a good friend.