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To be horrified by this article about Starbucks?

(118 Posts)
PropertyNightmare Tue 16-Oct-12 12:14:50

I love Starbucks. I can't wait for the red cups.
Now I am gutted to learn that the corporation has not paid any UK income tax since 2009. Despite making 1.2 billion in that period in the UK. Apparently there is nothing 'illegal' about the tax arrangements which allow them to do this. AIBU to feel let down and a bit of a mug? The NHS and schools would have found sOme extra cash handy....

Starbucks, I am shocked and feel like you have let me down sad

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2012/10/15/starbucks-brewing-up-more-than-coffee-when-it-comes-to-tax-avoidance/

Blu Tue 16-Oct-12 12:16:08

Starbucks, Amazon...

PropertyNightmare Tue 16-Oct-12 12:16:25

This story is also appearing in the Sky News headlines.

Scholes34 Tue 16-Oct-12 12:17:04

The price and quality of the coffee is enough to stop me buying Starbuck's coffee.

Bluebell99 Tue 16-Oct-12 12:17:59

Gutted too, was looking forward to gingerbread latte season, but don't think they deserve my money.

It's on the guardian too
www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/oct/15/starbucks-tax-uk-sales

PropertyNightmare Tue 16-Oct-12 12:18:28

And why is Dave not jumping up and down like he does when it comes to the 'entitled' lot reliant on the welfare state......I'm sensing that there might be one rule for the rich and another for the poor.

PropertyNightmare Tue 16-Oct-12 12:20:14

Blue, I actually agree with you. It is too going to hurt me more than it is them but yes I think they can actually fuck off with their delicious gingerbread lattes. I'm not giving them another UK penny.

TunipTheVegemal Tue 16-Oct-12 12:21:08

Starbucks, Amazon, Facebook. Bloody ridiculous. How are small British companies supposed to compete on such an unequal tax playing field? I am sure this is only going to get worse and we're all going to be fucked.

Miggsie Tue 16-Oct-12 12:23:07

But global businesses can only register on one stock exchange and with 1 country to pay tax, so global companies choose the place where they will pay the lowest tax...not surprisingly.

So all over the world there are companies taking money from people in a country to which they do not pay taxes.

My company is in 44 countries and only pays corporate tax in the country the company is registered in.

So that's 43 countries we've pissed off I suppose.

PropertyNightmare Tue 16-Oct-12 12:26:38

It just seems so wrong though. To take so much money from the British public and give not one bean back in income tax.

LaFataTurchina Tue 16-Oct-12 12:29:05

Starbucks isn't making any profit in the UK atm tho - it's just breaking even.

WhoWhatWhereWhen Tue 16-Oct-12 12:29:12

Vodafone, Acadia group, it wont stop because no one really cares enough to start doing anything

TunipTheVegemal Tue 16-Oct-12 12:30:48

I think it's the scale of it that makes it feel wrong Miggsie, and the fact that Starbucks and Amazon are companies that are aggressively squeezing British companies out of the market.

RubberNeckNibbler Tue 16-Oct-12 12:32:12

LaFata, that's just the line they are spinning. Do you think they are providing us with crap coffee out of the goodness of their hearts? hmm

BrainSurgeon Tue 16-Oct-12 12:33:09

Miggsie is right, I work for a global company too, it's the way things work I'm afraid....
I'm not sure the press are portraying this correctly, you can't blame the company for the way the tax system is designed

TunipTheVegemal Tue 16-Oct-12 12:34:46

If that's true LaFata, might it not be something to do with their aggressive strategy of saturating an area and driving all the independents out before pruning down to just the profitmaking branches?

lljkk Tue 16-Oct-12 12:35:33

The reason that Starbucks doesn't make a profit on paper is because they pay for things like royalties for Starbucks own procedures (how they make their own cups of coffee) to other Starbucks subsidiary companies in places with lower taxes. They're profitless on paper only.

ExitPursuedByAaaaaarGhoul Tue 16-Oct-12 12:36:15

Agree it seems wrong, but they will be providing employment for lots of people in the UK and will be paying Employer's NI contributions, and the people they employ will be paying tax, so not strictly true that they are not paying anything.

takeonboard Tue 16-Oct-12 12:36:15

Turnip your 1st post nailed it, there is no chance of a small local compsny being able to compete on such an uneven playing field...more and more reasons to boycott the multinationals which have taken over our lives high streets.

BrainSurgeon Tue 16-Oct-12 12:36:19

I agree with the scale thing though. The only thing WE can do about it is to support our local businesses.
I do try to make an effort, as much as I can, to go to the local cafe or village shop... but they do struggle to compete bless them they have shit coffee and shop front

BrainSurgeon Tue 16-Oct-12 12:38:40

cross-post with takeonboard!

Merinda Tue 16-Oct-12 12:45:23

I do not understand why you are so upset.
They are a US company with a global business. The rate of tax they pay in the US is quite high. They are not doing anything illegal, but it seems that they have set up very efficient tax structures which minimise tax payments in other markets.
They are a business, and the main aim of the business is to maximise shareholder value, they are ultimately answerable to their shareholders to run the most efficient model they can.
USA taxes businesses and individuals on global income, so they basically try avoid double taxation.
One should be angry with the legislators that allow this to happen, but not with the businesses that just do what they are supposed to do.

lljkk Tue 16-Oct-12 12:48:10

and they pay VAT too.
It's things like paying royalties to their other companies that got on my wick.
I dislike the smell of coffee so it's the sort of place I avoid anyway, this just solidifies my reasoning.
Local coffee shops can't take advantage of such "efficient tax structures". Not a fair playing field.

Merinda Tue 16-Oct-12 12:57:31

I do not think that the tax situation makes much difference to the "level playing field". What makes the difference is small/medium business, which is what your local coffee shop vs. large corporation. Makes no difference if it is a US or UK company. Same as your local grocery shop vs Tesco

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