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To wonder wether this is actually possible?

(18 Posts)
icooksocks Sat 15-Oct-11 15:08:31

A lady on a group I belong to has announced she had to terminate a baby because tests showed it had Downs Syndrome, Edwards Syndrome AND Pateau's.
Now I'm quite prepared to be corrected but I wouldnt have thought it was even possible to have all three. I have triple checked to make sure she hasnt written OR but nope it definitely says AND.
And don't get me wrong-no matter what the circumstances are behind the termination-I wouldn't judge her for having one, I was just a bit confused.

Yama Sat 15-Oct-11 15:11:03

Kinda sounds like you are judging.

There are any number of possibilities involving misinformation.

icooksocks Sat 15-Oct-11 15:15:51

Honestly I'm not. But if it isnt possible then I would wonder what her reasons are and be wary-thats all. I'm not planning to go guns blazing with an accusation of lying or suchlike.

worraliberty Sat 15-Oct-11 15:17:34

Why don't you ask her about it?

I know it's a delicate subject but she's obviously ok to discuss it because she's put it 'out there'?

Summerbird73 Sat 15-Oct-11 15:17:42

I would leave it. It is none of your business what her reasons are. She is going through a horrendous time as it is so any suggestion that she has got her info wrong is just insensitive.

Leave her alone

KittyFane Sat 15-Oct-11 15:19:02

What has it got to do with you- I don't understand?
If you just want to know if it is possible to have all 3 out of curiosity that's different.

icooksocks Sat 15-Oct-11 15:21:59

It doesnt have a fat lot to do with me at all, and yes curiosity is a large part of it.

ScarahStratton Sat 15-Oct-11 15:23:51

Are you feeling wary because you think it could be massive attention seeking? I can understand where you are coming from OP. I've been bitten so many times, by people I trusted, that an announcement like this would be a huge red flag for me.

CailinDana Sat 15-Oct-11 15:23:59

Theoretically it is possible to have all three, in the sense that it is possible to have three copies of chromosome 21, 18 and 13 but it is statistically almost impossible and the child wouldn't have three different syndromes mixed together in the way that she seems to think it would. Basically a child with that level of genetic abnormality wouldn't need to be terminated as they wouldn't survive and I'm guessing they wouldn't develop at all in the womb, so you're right to be a bit confused However, it's not your place to ask questions especially if she isn't a close friend, just commiserate with her and be there for her if you can.

CalmaLlamaDown Sat 15-Oct-11 15:27:10

I would leave it alone, she is most likely devastated at the moment.

Trills Sat 15-Oct-11 15:27:24

So you suspect trollery, essentially.

Down's is trisomy 21
Edwards is trisomy 18
Patau's is trisomy 13

I think either she is confused or lying, I am doubtful a foetus with that level of chromosomal abnormality would live long enough to test.

Tinsie Sat 15-Oct-11 15:33:45

She probably had a test that showed high probability of all three trisomies (perfectly possible, I would imagine) and got a bit confused. I wouldn't think it matters and would personally not discuss it any further with her unless she was a close friend or showed a willingness to talk about it.

EllaDee Sat 15-Oct-11 15:38:21

I see why you might think she's lying, but think about the other possibilities:

1) It may be true. This is unlikely, but you'll feel a right cow if it is true. So you need to report her to that forum's mods and keep quiet.

2) It may be she's confused - they may have said there's a chromosomal disorder like Down's (this is how Edwards was explained to a woman I know, who'd not heard of it, when she asked what it was). If you think so, you could ask, I suppose.

3) It may be she is lying and knows it, but really does have to terminate, and wants to talk about it while not wanting to be judged. It's really hard to talk about termination without feeling you have to justify it an awful lot to yourself and everyone else, I think. So maybe she is not being totally truthful, but still needs support. Obviously you can probably tell whether that's true or not by how she posts, but I thought it might be worth bearing in mind.

helpmabob Sat 15-Oct-11 15:42:38

I know someone that had one and tested high for another and was told it was quite likely the baby had both. She had no choice but to terminate so 2 out of 3 is definetely a possibility. And not knowing what causes these defects, maybe something similar can trigger all three so it may be possible. It was the most heartbreaking thing my friend had ever gone through and the stress can make such a complicated prognosis confused for the best of us.

Don't ask her.

I don't know if it is possible to have all three.

After losing my second baby I joined SANDS and got to know so many people who made the 'choice' to terminate babies they desperately wanted because there was so much genetically wrong with the doctors had said they would not survive to full term or survive birth.

I know what CailinDana means when she says " Basically a child with that level of genetic abnormality wouldn't need to be terminated as they wouldn't survive and I'm guessing they wouldn't develop at all in the womb" but when some parents are told their baby has so much wrong and will not survive for much longer they feel they are doing their best for their child by terminating the pregnancy rather than waiting for their baby to die as the overwhelming emotion is that if your baby cannot be helped you don't want to prolong any suffering the baby my be going through because of the condition. It's a horrifically painful and unselfish choice for a parent to make.

And I know from personal experience that when you are given bad news about your baby, and doctors are telling you all sorts of things, it's very difficult to get anything straight in your head beyond "your baby has died" or "your baby will most likely die very soon." Everything else becomes background noise and it's easy to get confused.

So as the others say, she may be confused about what was said to her and genuinely believe her poor baby had all three conditions.

Bereaved parents often like to talk about their babies and their experiences, but not questioned in a way that might be hurtful. This mum may already be feeling very sensitive to any criticism of her 'choice' (for want of a better word, as these terminations usually happen when the parents feel every other choice has been taken away) and she may be alert to any questions that sound critical or disbelieving.

If you are concerned about trolling then it's best not to call it out on the forum, it will inevitably lead to other people getting dragged into an argument as they either try to defend her or out her. Flag it up to the Mods and let them do their job.

Sorry- so much genetically wrong with them that the doctors said they would not survive.

Birdsgottafly Sat 15-Oct-11 19:26:32

"I think either she is confused or lying, I am doubtful a foetus with that level of chromosomal abnormality would live long enough to test."

I handled a case of a woman who had given birth to a still born baby with a very complex range of abnormalities, as her other children were under CP plans, investigations were done to establish drug use etc, it was found that the baby had a 'mix' (i don't fully understand but we had a top consultant report into it) of conditions, very rare, and only 1 seen in the UK about every 15 years (or less), so you have to be careful, as these things do happen.

If this woman had told anyone her story, she wouldn't have been believed. I handle quite a few of people's cases were you couldn't 'get your head round' what they have been through.

OP i would slightly distance yourself from her, if you do not feel comfortable, it isn't helpful to her or you.

What worries me is that this (if it is true) must be very rare and will easily identify her.

Trills Sat 15-Oct-11 19:28:37

Thanks for that Birdsgottafly - I stand corrected.

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