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to ask for your opinion on an argument

(40 Posts)
slightlymad72 Fri 02-Sep-11 18:51:47

that is going on in my house between 2 teenagers (19)

My DD and her boyfriend are discussing (loudly) discrimination in sports.

Her argument is that if a woman is good enough to complete alongside men then she should be allowed to and not be discriminated against because of her gender.

His argument is there are seperate men and women teams because the men would have an unfair advantage, so in order for women to have a chance of winning they must compete against their own sex. This cannot be classed as discrimination because the men aren't being mean about it.

AIBU to ask the MN jury for their judgment and then I can bash either/both around the head with it and put a stop to the argument before something decent comes on the telly.

(by the way I support DD, especially when the 'its not discrimination because they are not being mean' argument raised its head)

ChippingIn Fri 02-Sep-11 18:54:29

If we have until something decent comes on the tele we probably have weeks if not months to discuss this grin

Hmmmmm I can, unhelpfully, see both sides and it's something I've argued about discussed before. Still not sure... will be interesting to see the replies.

thisisyesterday Fri 02-Sep-11 18:57:02

i think if women WANT to compete against men they ought to be allowed to

the whole "they don't have a chance of winning" thing is utterly irrelevant.
i don't see a movement to ban shit football teams because they have no chance of winning hmm
perhaps someone should point out to DD's boyfriend that it's the taking part that counts wink

i think it's up to women to decide whrether or not they want to play against a mens team

i would LIKE to see mixed sex teams. not separate teams competing against each other.
each team ought to be able to choose the best at the sport... out of men AND women

GetAwayFromHerYouBitch Fri 02-Sep-11 18:57:32

Well, I think the England football team should not be the men's team

Them we might win stuff and not have to bang on about 1966 ad nauseum.


heleninahandcart Fri 02-Sep-11 18:58:18

DD's should be allowed to compete - fine

BF's unfair advantage argument - fine

But, and neither of them are saying this, 'Women must compete against men'- no

If both were accepted in the same events, this would result in a) a mess and b) the women's events being classed as secondary (which already happens to a degree)

slightlymad72 Fri 02-Sep-11 18:58:45

I was thinking of putting 'until corrie comes on' but I thought we might need more time, 'something decent' gives us a greater chance to discuss it in full, hurl insults at each other and drink copius amounts of brew and wine grin

HedleyLamarr Fri 02-Sep-11 19:04:28

Michelle Wie has competed against men in golf. Though it could be argued golf is not a sport. grin

michelleseashell Fri 02-Sep-11 19:04:40

Ooh but if women are allowed to compete against men if they want then are men allowed to compete against the women if they want?

If not then I suppose that proves that men do have a natural advantage.

slightlymad72 Fri 02-Sep-11 19:07:50

Golf is not a sport, its an excuse to wear very dodgy clothes.grin

SarahStratton Fri 02-Sep-11 19:11:17

What slightlymad said. grin

Yama Fri 02-Sep-11 19:17:56

I think Serena Williams would beat most/all male tennis players.

I think the very top end of each sport would be male but the rest would be a mixture of male and female.

I think perception is key.

I think we need to re-educate ourselves.

Your dd is correct.

I think generally on all aspects of reality we live in a disillusioned sexist realm of doom.

gardenpixies32 Fri 02-Sep-11 19:21:17

My three sisters were very good at sport growing up (apart from me who had 2 left feet).

When they were younger, they were as good and in many situations better than the boys at a variety of sports. My mum received a phone call asking if my sister could play on the boys cricket team when she was 10! She could out bowl and out bat most of the boys!

Another sister was a great swimmer (and still is) and she would kick ass in the pool and leave the boys in her wake! It caused great upset from time to time! I remember her being 11 and racing a uni (male) friend of mine (he was 20) in the 100m freestyle and she shamed him!

However, this didnt last and as the boys on her swimming team grew bigger (age 14 and up) they could out swim her.

Women should be free to be part of a team if they are genuinely good enough.

Andrewofgg Fri 02-Sep-11 19:23:10

A few years ago one of the big bookies offered the same long, long odds against any of the following in the next fifty years

A woman Pope
A British woman winning Wimbledon
The Second Coming

Curiously the odds against a British man winning Wimbledon were quite a bit shorter!

KeepingUpWithTheCojones Fri 02-Sep-11 19:26:56

interesting serena williams was brought up as she reckons she couldn't beat any man within the top 100

That's the extent of my knowledge on this topic, I'm afraid, stolen from a FB argument i saw...

KeepingUpWithTheCojones Fri 02-Sep-11 19:31:28

mind you, having read her comment, it's becuase men's and women's tennis is different. She says. <confused>

JodieHarsh Fri 02-Sep-11 19:32:31

I am just popping to agree with GetAwayFromHer and approve of her Alien-based nickname grin <stalker>

jazzchickens Fri 02-Sep-11 20:33:15

Personally, I think there should be more mixed sports. Both men & women come in different shapes & sizes and either sex could have an advantage.

DS2 is small for his age and you would not necessarily consider him to be a good contender for basketball. But, by god, is he nippy and he can run rings around a lot of the players grin

defrocked Fri 02-Sep-11 20:37:30

sport should be banned, full stop smile

plupervert Fri 02-Sep-11 21:32:42

One argument often made is that if "top" women were competing with the men, it would cream them off and weaken women's sport as a whole.

slightlymad72 Fri 02-Sep-11 21:38:25

I think DD's boyfriend is going to get a roasting, maybe I shouldn't show this thread to DD, there is too much ammo for her to use and for him to deal with.grin

PrincessFiorimonde Fri 02-Sep-11 21:58:01

Interesting points made by Yama ('I think the very top end of each sport would be male but the rest would be a mixture of male and female') and by plupervert ('One argument often made is that if "top" women were competing with the men, it would cream them off and weaken women's sport as a whole').

Note that men and women do compete on equal terms in equestrian events - have been side-by-side in show-jumping, etc. for many years.

izzywhizzyletsgetbusy Fri 02-Sep-11 22:11:00

As Wimbledon pay women players the same rate as their male counterparts I see no reason why games should be segregated, and I also see no reason why women only be required to play 3 sets.

GetAwayFromHerYouBitch Fri 02-Sep-11 22:11:53

thankyou Jodie

izzywhizzyletsgetbusy Fri 02-Sep-11 22:12:04

'women only be required'

please amend to
'women should only be required'

nancy75 Fri 02-Sep-11 22:13:47

izzywhizzyletsgetbusy - games at wimbledon are segregated because all of the women would be out in the first round - even the top 5 women players stand no chance of winning against the top 50/100 men

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