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Hang them, scum, take their kids, feral brats, stop their benefits, take away their rights, forcibly sterilise them...

(270 Posts)
EricNorthmansMistressOfPotions Thu 11-Aug-11 09:43:51

are just a few opinions I have seen on this board in the last few days. AIBU to think that people who hold those opinions are a bit thick unpleasant and wrong?

Apart from the fact that plenty of the rioters were so-called productive members of society who apparently saw an opportunity to get some free stuff, we live in a democracy and if you take away people's human rights that extends to everybody - even you. If you stop benefits you send children into more poverty, which is a major factor in children growing up to become angry, violent and criminal adults. Remove children and do what with them? Place them with the thousands of suitable and willing foster carers who are hanging around twiddling their thumbs? And what about the consequences of removing children from their families - yes, more criminal, poorly educated and challenging adults. Parent and baby placements? Oh yes, we have so many of those! All well funded and easy to access! Never mind that the courts can and do place DCs in foster care over P&B placements because there aren't enough and that ShinyDave and his crew are doing nothing but cut social care budgets...oh yes, great idea.

It's not only our society that is fucked, it's the world. We are one of the most developed countries in the world and all people want is the opportunity to get stuff they haven't earned. Where does that impulse come from?

LareyLaptopLover Thu 11-Aug-11 09:46:06

are just a few opinions I have seen on this board in the last few days. AIBU to think that people who hold those opinions are a bit thick unpleasant and wrong?

so why should someone who holds different values to you be "thick"

maybe its the liberal lefties who are "thick" and deluded. They are getting the society they screamed and shouted for. Soft police force, soft judicial system, benefits willy nilly, kids having unwanted kids, the list goes on. Enjoy it. You created it.

BulletWithAName Thu 11-Aug-11 09:49:52

maybe its the liberal lefties who are "thick" and deluded. They are getting the society they screamed and shouted for. Soft police force, soft judicial system, benefits willy nilly, kids having unwanted kids, the list goes on. Enjoy it. You created it.

This.

GeekCool Thu 11-Aug-11 09:49:53

It really does come across as another way to bash the 'poor'. I'm horrified the e-petition to have rioters thrown out of social housing has nearly 100K signatures. Nothing like right-minded people foaming at the mouth wishing the underclass steralised etc.

Meglet Thu 11-Aug-11 09:52:57

Yanbu.

The taking away of benefits part is asking for trouble. Um....won't they just steal even more.

I don't know what the answer is, well I do, huge amounts of money, teachers, mental health and parental support thrown at deprived areas I expect. Taking away the little they have aint gonna help.

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 11-Aug-11 09:53:18

YANBU. Unpleasant events are always going to being out the hang 'em and flog 'em brigade.... natural knee-jerk, extreme reaction to perceived threats. Luckily, this is why we have a Parliament of elected representatives to make our laws in a calm and considered fashion rather than being held to ransom by idiot petitions and the Twitterati.

pictish Thu 11-Aug-11 09:53:41

I have read some jaw dropping opinions on here over the last few days.
Well done The Daily Mail - your following is strong.

Kormachameleon Thu 11-Aug-11 09:54:13

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BulletWithAName Thu 11-Aug-11 09:55:40

do you honestly think they should be entitled to state handouts and housing themselves ??

Oh of course they should. It's not their fault, poor diddums, it's everyone else's!

doesntfitin Thu 11-Aug-11 09:55:46

Attitudes towards anyone that doesn't fit the nice middle class norm created this mess

Well done

herbietea Thu 11-Aug-11 09:57:15

Message withdrawn

PeggyCarter Thu 11-Aug-11 09:57:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Gonzo33 Thu 11-Aug-11 09:58:41

Some of them might have gone too far, including mine. More in a knee jerk reaction than actually thinking about it properly. However something has to be done. The children of UK need to be taught that to have "Rights" means to have Responsibilities.

We are one of the most developed countries in the world and all people want is the opportunity to get stuff they haven't earned. Where does that impulse come from?

Greed probably.

DoMeDon Thu 11-Aug-11 09:59:08

That impulse comes from growing up in a society with no sense of personal responsibilty/self-respect. Too much is handed out for free - the idea you HAVE to work is dwindling. I beleive a benefit culture is partly responsible for that. Before benefits there was less crime because there was the idea that you should provide for yourself and your family. Years ago there was a stigma attached to claiming benefit - now it is a badge of honour with some.

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 11-Aug-11 09:59:33

"...state handouts and housing..."

If anyone has committed a criminal act of any description they should be tried under the law and punished according to the statute books. Fines, imprisonment, tagging, whatever that may entail. It is not right to deny them the basic means of support or make them homeless into the bargain. Justice is justice. Revenge makes savages of us all

PeggyCarter Thu 11-Aug-11 09:59:39

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

hiddenhome Thu 11-Aug-11 10:00:33

How long can this country sustain large numbers of a none contributing 'underclass' for?

maybe its the liberal lefties who are "thick" and deluded. They are getting the society they screamed and shouted for. Soft police force, soft judicial system, benefits willy nilly, kids having unwanted kids, the list goes on. Enjoy it. You created it.

totally agree with this.

Iggly Thu 11-Aug-11 10:00:48

Yanbu.

People assume it's "undeserving poor". It's not. People think they can explain it away so easily - oh they're feckless, on benefits, scum. Ridiculous.

EricNorthmansMistressOfPotions Thu 11-Aug-11 10:01:24

do you honestly think they should be entitled to state handouts and housing themselves ??

Yes I do, and I'll explain why.

'State handouts' are subsistence benefits. If they are convicted of a crime and go to prison they will stop receiving subsistence benefits. If they are out of prison they have as much right to subsistence benefits as anyone else. Benefits aren't, and cannot be, stopped for those who are suspected of a crime, or those who have served their sentence for a crime. If they were, hundreds of thousands of people would be in complete poverty, street homeless and more likely to commit crimes to survive.

'housing' - well when you have a tenancy agreement it's a legal contract. You cannot break a legal contract due to someone's behaviour if the contract does not cover that behaviour. Tenancy agreements cover behaviour relating to the responsibilities of the tenancy. If a person is convicted of a crime and goes to prison they may lose their tenancy due to inability to pay rent - but as a society we don't have the right to remove housing from people who are suspected of a crime, or who have served their sentence. Likewise, if this was legal, there would be hundreds of thousands of street homeless people (including children, who then have to be removed and placed in care) leading to more criminality and a far more dangerous society.

Please explain how you think society could legally or morally stop benefits and remove housing from people who were involved in the rioting?

Morloth Thu 11-Aug-11 10:01:26

What I have found interesting over the last few days is how so many people on here seem to view benefits as 'protection money'.

So you give people enough money and they don't smash things up?

Am not at all surprised by the shift in attitudes on MN. As I said on the other thread, it is fashionable these days to be mostly to the left. But when faced the reality of the screaming mob most people quickly change their minds.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the UK now.

pictish Thu 11-Aug-11 10:04:21

Could not agree more CogitoErgoSometimes!!

Yes, sterislise the poor, make teenage mums live in mother and baby units, tie them all naked to the town centre railings and throw chunks of raw meat at them occasionally etc etc....

I am saddened by how many people on Mumsnet would take away the basic human rights of thousands and thousands of people, based on the actions of three hundred.

I know who the savages really are. hmm

BulletWithAName Thu 11-Aug-11 10:05:13

make teenage mums live in mother and baby units

Why would this be a bad thing?

DoMeDon Thu 11-Aug-11 10:05:46

I beleive that if you commit crime you should not be entitled to benefit. there would then be an incentive to behave well. If you can act as you please without consequence then that leads to moral corruption.

To quote my nan 'there's no shame anymore' and more's the pity!

PeggyCarter Thu 11-Aug-11 10:05:54

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

stripeywoollenhat Thu 11-Aug-11 10:05:56

if you treat people like scum, do they have an incentive to behave otherwise? the benefit-bashing discourse which seems to have gripped the uk in the last couple of years does have an effect, the people who are being dismissed and dehumanised in this discourse are neither deaf nor stupid, in general.

and eugenics? sorry, but hmm, let's see, what does that remind us of...?

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