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feels like theft

(39 Posts)
drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 18:46:10

aibu to expect that when my mother opened an account for each of my dcs when they were born that when my mother dies i would be given the books to continue saving money in the said accounts instead as my sister had legal rights to handle my mothers bank accounts ect she cancelled the accounts which were tax free and put the whole amount in her own currant account as if it was hers, it has caused a big row and for no reason she has said she did it to stop us using it i was shocked shes the one whos so bad with money and had no reason on gods earth to do this bad enough losing our mum but now shes cut me and the dcs off altogether i feel like shes stolen the money from them of course she says they can have it at 18 when mum intended but i fear she will have spent it all by then . i went with mum to open those accounts shes been nothing throughout my mothers illness, death, and she emptied the house before i even went round there and i live in the next road to herid looked after my mum on my own till i was 32 when i married she left home at 17 and she wouldnt let me have anything to do with mum near the end and now ive lost both of them...sorry rambling but feel so hurt

LadyThumb Wed 06-Jul-11 18:48:00

Jeez - some punctuation would help. There's no way I can read that!!

Imnotaslimjim Wed 06-Jul-11 18:49:13

I'm not surprised you feel hurt, it IS theft. I can't advise you on where you stand though as I know nothing about the law on these things. Hopefully someone more knowledgable will be along shortly. Was there a will stating that the money was for your DC?

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 18:49:13

sorry, im trying to look after my autistic sone on my lap blush rather lost track a bit.

Succubi Wed 06-Jul-11 18:49:19

drivemecrazy63 I can see why you are so upset regarding the accounts. I would be livid.

Imnotaslimjim Wed 06-Jul-11 18:53:19

Hope you don't mind, I've redone it so others can read it easier. You could cut and paste and restart your thread to make it easier if you want

aibu to expect that when my mother opened an account for each of my dcs when they were born that when my mother dies i would be given the books to continue saving money in the said accounts?

instead as my sister had legal rights to handle my mothers bank accounts ect she cancelled the accounts which were tax free and put the whole amount in her own currant account as if it was hers, it has caused a big row and for no reason.

She has said she did it to stop us using it. I was shocked, shes the one whos so bad with money and had no reason on gods earth to do this. Bad enough losing our mum but now shes cut me and the dcs off altogether. I feel like shes stolen the money from them. Of course she says they can have it at 18 when mum intended but i fear she will have spent it all by then. I went with mum to open those accounts.

Shes been nothing throughout my mothers illness, death, and she emptied the house before i even went round there, and i live in the next road to her. I'd looked after my mum on my own till i was 32, when i married. She left home at 17 and she wouldnt let me have anything to do with mum near the end. and now ive lost both of them...sorry rambling but feel so hurt

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 18:54:05

the will was the one she took our mum to have made up a few months before she died , unfortunately it didnt mention the existance of the accounts.
i did go to the building society but they said as she had permission to handle her banking ect there was nothing you can do , seems so unfair as my mother wanted them to have that money for a deposit on a flat or uni or a car maybe , looks like they wont get it now, its not really the money its the principle and the fact shes supposed to be family that hurts

skybluepearl Wed 06-Jul-11 18:54:13

Can you write to her explaining that childrens accounts were tax free and you wanted to pay into them. Did you know how much was in them before your mum died? How much do you expect to be in them when kids turn 18?

Desiderata Wed 06-Jul-11 18:56:30

I take it these are bank accounts and not trust funds?

TheMagnificentBathykolpian Wed 06-Jul-11 18:56:30

I think you need legal advice.

Lisaklf Wed 06-Jul-11 19:00:18

YANBU- my grandmother did the same thing for me and DSiS but when my grandfather died and the uncles were sorting things out, the bank accounts were emptied sad
I still feel queasy when I think about it - it wasn' a lot of money but she wanted something to leave 'her girls'.
Sorry that you have to go through this after losing your mum

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 19:12:48

I have tried to talk to her she seems like shes gone completely mad making all sorts of strange claims and saying we wont let her see the dcs to other relatives,
ive tried so have others shes just gone very strange and even left her husband since mum died and hes lovely just he couldnt handle her behaviour anymore
shes now telling all that shes depressed and lonely .

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 19:16:56

they were smart saver accounts which once 11 they are legally old enough to have the card ect(not that i would give them the cards yet) but as they dont exist now ive no proof desiderata
but the bank say as mum opened tham and sis had control shes allowed to close them , seems totally unfair to me as they had to have my signature when opened

Nagoo Wed 06-Jul-11 19:19:29

If the accounts were in your DCs names then your mum would have been trustee. Your sister then would have become the new trustee. It should be unlawful for her to use the money if it is not for the children since the accounts were tax free. I'm not an expert by any means.

Can you go to the CAB?

I'm sorry this has happened on top of you losing your mum sad

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 19:23:09

ty LisaKlf its really not the money although it atm would have been around £10,000 each , ive no idea how much that will be by the time they are 18 but not as much in a currant account as it would have been in a tax free dc account id imagine they are ages 11, 14, 15 so a few years to go yet

there's im sure no chance the money would still be there she is divorcing her husband now and just brought a new house on her own so im thinking this is her furnishing money

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 19:25:28

thats what i thought seems unlawful but as they are apparently my sisters now mums died even though a trustee they inform me they are deemed by law as her accounts to do with as she will although the building society agreed if nothing else its imoral.

fedupofnamechanging Wed 06-Jul-11 19:31:58

You need to see a solicitor and contest the will asap. If your sister arranged for your mum to write it shortly before her death, then it is possible she did it with the sole intention of taking everything your mum had. possibly you could argue that she is not a fit executor or that your mum was taken advantage of at a time when she was especially vulnerable. The bank will be able to verify the existence of the accounts and that the DC were the intended recipients.

Your sister is not the sole next of kin and just because she's taken these things, the law won't necessarily uphold her 'right' to hang onto them. You could ask for your DC's money to be put in trust.

Get legal advice now, before she spends your children's money.

Nagoo Wed 06-Jul-11 19:34:36

What is a bare trust?
A bare trust (sometimes known as a 'simple trust') is one where the beneficiary has an immediate and absolute right to both the capital and income held in the trust.
Someone who sets up a bare trust can be certain that the assets (such as money, land or buildings) they set aside will go directly to the beneficiaries they intend. These assets are known as 'trust property'. Once the trust has been set up, the beneficiaries can’t be changed.
The trust assets are held in the name of a trustee (the person managing and making decisions about the trust) but the trustee has no discretion over what income or capital to pass on to the beneficiary or beneficiaries.
Bare trusts are commonly used to transfer assets to minors. Trustees hold the assets on trust until the beneficiary is 18 in England and Wales, or 16 in Scotland. At this point, beneficiaries can demand that the trustees transfer the trust fund to them.

From the HMRC website, I would have thought that if the accounts are in your kids names then your sister has stolen from them, legally. Def contact CAB. sad

Nagoo Wed 06-Jul-11 19:35:47

if the accounts are in the DCs names, then they exist are a bare trust already.

bubblesincoffee Wed 06-Jul-11 19:41:19

Get yourself to Citizens advice or find one of those solicitors that gives you the first hour appointment free to find out if anything can be done. Just because the bank can't do anything, doesn't mean the law can't.

drivemecrazy63 Wed 06-Jul-11 20:59:04

i did ring a solicitor, they said if she had just changed and put her name as trustee i could take her to court and i would probably win and her name taken off, especially as id signed with my mum to open them ,but as she had simply closed them and she had control there is nothing legal i can do except plea with her to reconsider.

she wont even speak to me now, ive the forms to get her to sign it over which was there advice but that just isnt going to happen.

the main thing is a she has twisted all these lies with the relatives and now a couple are being very off with me,
shes such a convincing liar and goes all tearful in there company so they feel sorry for her,and has made it look like ive a vendetta or something when really i just want them to wake up and see her for what she is, shes as hard as nails.
what makes it even worse is this lie ive stopped her seeing them when truth is in all there lives shes seen them say 20 times and lives 3 miles away she was always to busy.

so all this im looking after their best interests and doing what mum wanteds such a lot of billy bull, i guess i just wanted someone to say shes the one in wrong ... my aunt thinks now as this is what she has told them im only bothered about money angry im not but who would put their neice and nephews money into their private currant account in with all their money other than a thief

Nagoo Wed 06-Jul-11 21:08:55

I'm sorry OP.

All you can do it state the facts.

You need to tell your side of the story. write it down if you have to.

She has stolen thousands of pounds that your mum wanted to go to the children.

I don't understand how anyone can have another side to this story, but you need to get your sister in a room (preferably with witnesses) and just ask her. Don't accuse, or say anything, just ask her what is happening.

sad

drivemecrazy63 Thu 07-Jul-11 11:53:51

thanks for advice everyone, no there is no way she will come near me i really think shes mentally ill since mum died she was not close to me or the children before so it looks like ill just have to forget it, ive no energy after going through diagnosis and statementing with my autistic son at the moment and i think shes now already spent it more than likely, so even if i could prove it it would be a horrible battle taking your own sister to court, i dont think ive the stomach for that although she deserves it. this im sure all stems from the fact she was desperate to have dcs and couldnt as she changed years ago when i first fell pregnant and has never been the same since.
there was resentment on her part also because i looked after mum so many years we were so close and when she divorced (shes been married 5 times) she used to go home to mum, then when mum was termial she took over saying im the eldest she told me she wanted to be a mum/nan to the kids when she showed no interest before then she picked one argument after the other and even asked if she could move in with us and she hates my DH so the jist was get rid of him and move her in . she kept telling me shes the "head" of the family , this isnt victorian times i dont believe in heads of family were all equal in my eyes, so i think this is all about shes hurting and therefore trying to hurt and blame someone

MrsBethel Thu 07-Jul-11 15:47:11

As a trustee your sister basically has authority to manage the money, including closing the accounts.

However, a trustee has a duty to act in the interests of the beneficiaries.

I think your only option is to sue her. Start the ball rolling and she might cave in?

fiveisanawfullybignumber Thu 07-Jul-11 16:02:22

Her behavior is disgraceful. Your children may well need that money as they get older, and tbh, you need to fight their corner. Life will be difficult enough for your autistic son, having some money to help could make a huge difference for you all.sadangry
I truly would take legal advice, warn her first that if she doesn't right this wrong you WILL take her to court. Divorce or not, what she has done is immoral, and I would be telling family in no uncertain terms that she has stolen your DC's money and refuses to let you have access to the accounts as your own mother wished. So angry on your behalf.

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