Saying 'no I don't want to kiss you' is clear enough not to have a date lunge at me anyway? (long)

[heleninahandcart]

Internet first date, walk by the Thames late afternoon. We have spoken on the phone twice. I arrive, I greet him 'kiss' on both cheeks, and introduce myself. Within 30 seconds he has taken my hand as we start to walk around. I disengage several times over the next 10 minutes, then think ok maybe I should loosen up, what's the harm and stop wriggling out of the hand holding.

All going well, we go and sit in some cafe gardens, he is a little 'full on'r/over exuberant with me and strangers milling around (made several women and a couple look uncomfortable by loud comments on clothing/what they are doing/saying etc). I have relax and think he is just very tactile. After a couple of hours, there is an attempt at a snog and I dodge it. We carry on chatting. Hands on bare legs between my thighs which I manage to politely get out of, generally over familiar. I'm trying to give benefit of doubt.

Some things feel 'off' eg I explained I keep my dating life separate from my teenage son, unless its a serious long term relationship. He said he wanted to be sure he could come to my home any time he wanted to if we were together. I explained if I got to that stage I would be happy to spend time at his place until we were sure about things at which point of course he would be part of my life and therefore very welcome. Instinct warning.

Fast forward to 5 hours later, its evening. I feel he is going to go for a snog. I say' really sorry, I don't want to kiss you'. I explain that I am not a big kisser, that snogging is very personal for me and it takes a lot for me to be ready for this. For me if I want to snog them I usually feel I would want to shag them. He asks for a hug, this feels natural I'm happy with this and we have a big, long hug. After a couple of minutes, I'm taking photos of the river, he is standing behind me and nuzzling my neck. He then turns me around at the waist and goes in hard for a snog, I avoid it by having to turn my head a couple of times. I have to really pull away with some strength.

I react badly. Say which bit of I don't want to kiss you didn't you understand? I am straight, I already told you this and I meant it. If I wanted to it would be very very clear, beleive me. I'm very pissed of and feel a bit unnerved. He apologises. I say ok, we walk on although I'm surprised that I'm a bit shaken. A few minutes later, he puts his arms around my waist from behind, I give no encouragement and then very quickly he tries to turn me again. I get very angry.

He calls after me by the name of his last gf. She was 'lovely girl that he finished with after 2 months as he wanted a future with someone' and she couldn't give him enough time as she has a job in different part of the country. He didn't ask her if she wanted a future with him, just finished it. Second instinct alert as if I needed it.

Apparently he wasn't trying to kiss me the second time, just hug to make it up. I believe this. AIBU to have reacted like this, feel I may have given mixed signals being happy with the earlier hug and neck nuzzling but OTOH I was absolutely clear about not wanting to snog him. I think he was unstable, he probably thinks I am.

[Numberfour]

YWNBU at all. I would most certainly not see him again. He ignored both your body language and your very, clear explicit request for him not to kiss you.

Stay far away from him.

[aldiwhore]

YABU to have given him 5 hours plus of your time. Doesn't sound like a match made in heaven unfortunately!!

I'm tactile, but please don't lump all tactile people with his type, there's tactile and there's stupid, he falls into the latter category... I can't imagine ever kissing someone who wasn't all puckered up and ready.

Your post did make me chuckle though (sorry) sounds like a bad date is all, and you haven't been U at all (other than the time out of your day you gave him) I think I'd have run off before the first hour was out!

Good luck for next time!

[kreecherlivesupstairs]

I would be really pissed off that he did not respect you enough to not paw you.
Maybe he thought he was onto a winner when you kissed him when you met?
Some people don't have a social nicety radar.
Better luck next time.

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

I really don't think he's the person for you. He's either trying too hard, only out for a shag or a very intense and/or controlling person.

For me there are quite a lot of red flags, he doesn't seem to respect your personal space: physical, emotional, family and home.

I would be inclined to head in the opposite direction very quickly.

[Pixieonthemoor]

The only thing you were being unreasonable about is staying for over 5 hours with this freak show. Reading your op made me feel very uncomfortable even before you described the hands-on-thigh and snog lunge. Under no circs see him again and I agree with Reality - I would be warning the website that he made you feel very uncomfortable. I hope you have much better luck next time!

[knittedbreast]

why did your date last 5 hours if it was your first? this alone should be a nono.

say away from this man,

[ILoveYouToo]

why are you even asking this?? He sounds like a creepy nutcase. Why on earth did you continue the date when he kept touching your thighs, let alone the kissing.

[tazmin]

i wouldnt say dangerous or predatory, they tend to be much more clever than this. This sounds more like desperation (no offence) to hurry into a proper relationship and general clingy/neediness


would turn me right off

[heleninahandcart]

This was also my gut feel. I consistently find myself with arrogant fuckwits as men my age seem to think they can simply 'buy' me as they have 5 acres and a paddock or whatever. He was odd but not arrogant so I guess I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt and also thinking maybe I was being too dismissive with the men I'd met.

Knitted and others, yes 5 hours much too long. I should have set a clear boundary of coffee only. Lesson learnt. btw it was that eh site which insists they match you, the men also seem to think that's the deal done already.

[TurkeyBurgerThing]

Uuurgh he sounds horrid. I hope you're not too shaken up by this! Make sure you block him from your emails/phone. Men who are that full on on a first date would set alarm bells off for me. (not that I've had a date or anything since 1996!)

[IvyAndGold]

if you're uncomfortable, you're uncomfortable, you don't have to justify it to anyone! he also sounds like a complete nightmare, so no, YADNBU!

[Saggyoldclothcatpuss]

Wierdo!
Just think yourself lucky, le didnt expect rimming and have a dangling poo nugget!
seriously though, you are definitely better off without that one!

[heleninahandcart]

oh and no way I will ever meet with him again, I do think he was desperate rather than dangerous as no narc red flags more totally overfamiliar. I'm very tactile too, but when I'm ready and I absolutely was not.

[WhoAteMySnickers]

Really? You really need to ask?

And 5 HOURS. For that YABU. "Hands on bare legs between my thighs" is the point at which unless I fancied the pants off him and was up for a shag, I would have ended the date.

[heleninahandcart]

saggy no dangling poo nugget as he explained he shaved. Rimming probably next move though!

Thanks all for the reassurance that IANBU. The whole dating thing does begin to make you wonder if its me, not them...

[charliejosh]

I find it strange that you stayed 5 hours, let him out his hand between your bare legs, but KISSING makes you uncomfortable

[izzywhizzyletsgetbusy]

I'm with aldi on this. You squandered 5 hours on that tosser???!!!! Jeez, gal, what were you thinking? I'd have made my excuses and left shortly after getting to the cafe, even if I'd had to climb out of the window in the Ladies and do a runner*.

He's stalker material clearly unstable; you're not. End of.

Block any further contact from this loser, and cast your net again. There's no guarantee you won't have to throw more tiddlers back but the the law of averages dictates that, the longer you fish, the more chances you'll have of landing a keeper.

*Top tip - always take a pair of flats on blind dates, and have friend call/text half an hour after the off so that you can be urgently needed elsewhere if necessary.

[EricNorthmansMistress]

First date is an hour for coffee, or a couple of hours in a bar if they have proper potential, surely?

[heleninahandcart]

Charlie please say what you mean by strange. I could have given him a blow job and still not wanted to kiss him on the mouth, no?

Izzygood tip .

5 hrs as you should have seen/heard/smelt the others I've met so I was really, really trying to be open minded. The feedback here has been a reality check on sticking to my own standards, so thank you.

Update: he has sent text saying 'last part of date was a disaster and that shouldn't happen on first date so he thinks its best we don't see each other again' (as if) but can he have the photos I took. WTF I read that as he has told friends and they have suggested I'm mad woman and to stay away.

[LRDTheFeministNutcase]

Oh, he sounds horrible. Please don't feel you gave him 'mixed messages' - the only clearer thing you could have done would be say 'right, I'm going now'. And that is surprisingly hard to do - we're conditioned to behave in a certain way in public, aren't we? Would defintely recommend having a friend phone half an hour in next time, though - you needed a get-out plan.

[charliejosh]

Well yes thats true, and again strange. I find the hand between bare thigs to be much more personal than a kiss

[GetOrf]

What a freak o'nature

[AnyFucker]

I react badly.

no, you didn't

you didn't react strongly enough

his text makes him sound completly bonkers, as well as predatory

that is 5 hours you will never get back ...