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To think my friends dc school should review their first aid policy? Any first aiders around

(46 Posts)
veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 09:45:03

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

belgo Mon 27-Jun-11 09:46:38

Yes they should have phoned an ambulance.

worraliberty Mon 27-Jun-11 09:57:17

Did they see the height the child fell from? Being a climbing frame, it'll have soft ground underneath it...so unless the arm looked obviously, immediately broken I'd say they did the right thing.

Obviously if the child was showing lack of conciousness, they shouldn't be moved.

CookieRookie Mon 27-Jun-11 10:01:29

They are very lucky she didn't have an unstable fracture of her spine or they could have found themselves in very hot water.

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:06:55

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ginnybag Mon 27-Jun-11 10:07:19

My God, no!

Complain, definitely. Your first aid training is NOT leading you astray, they shouldn't have moved her.

They've missed the broken arm, the shock that must have accompanied that, the bang to the head - not to mention the real biggie, potential neck and spine injuries.

To move herat all was stupid. To make her walk twenty minutes to school, then wait whilst theycalled her mum was downright negligent. That poor child must have been in agony!

They'll be lucky if they've not complicated the break. Theyare lucky that they didn't miss something sinister. A fall that could shatter her arm, could easily have broken something far more important.

Scream blue murder - and don't accept 'we didn't know how far she'd fallen!'. They should have - they should have been watching.

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:08:08

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ashamedandconfused Mon 27-Jun-11 10:09:35

Firstly, when you say they were taken for a "treat", was this a surprise, or a planned excursion (as in, did the parents know where the DC were and had signed consent forms for their kids to go?) If not I would be more than LIVID, even without the accident and its bad handling.

secondly, the proceedure should have been for an ambulance to be called, for school to be called to contact the parents, for a member of staff to travel with the child in the ambulance. They should also have had a first aider and kit with them - even if our school do a walk round the village they take one!

Also, do you know how many adults to children they had (ratio depends on age or year group of children?) off site activities require extra staff or paretn volunteers to supervise.

sounds like this school could be in hot water on more than one account.

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:10:42

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sausagesandmarmelade Mon 27-Jun-11 10:11:00

A complaint is definitely in order...

They should not have moved the child but called an ambulance straight away.

ginnybag Mon 27-Jun-11 10:14:02

Speak to the head, yes - tell her to ask for a copy of the school's First Aid procedure, their emergency procedure and ask who the first aider was on that trip.

It's not being difficult. That accident genuinely could have caused some really serious injuries. I'm furious that they moved her - it's damn near first aid 101 NOT to move someone - and I feel sick at the the thought of that poor child having to wait all that time for help, being made to walk what must have been a fair distance. Did no-one actually look at her to see what she looked like - with a bad break she'd have been pale, sweaty, unsteady on her feet.

How old is she, OP? How bad is this? It's slightly better if this is a teenager who could have articulated how she felt but I'm thinking not given climbing frames and parks as a treat.

ginnybag Mon 27-Jun-11 10:15:49

Just caught Reception/year one. So 5 or 6 then sad Poor little mite.

What a cock-up start to finish.

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:16:05

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ashamedandconfused Mon 27-Jun-11 10:16:16

verity - I am so angry on behalf of this family!
please get her to WRITE to the head, asking for his reply IN WRITING then there can be no back tracking if there is any attempt at half truth/playing it down etc etc

get everything IN WRITING - send copies of letters to chair of governors

ALSO - ask to see the RISK assessment, which SHOULD have been done by the teacher in charge, and signed by the head BEFORE THEY WENT - this is a detailed document & will cover adult/child ratios, likely dangers (roads, climbing frames etc) and the procedure for event of accident. They may well have gone against their own written document, IF they did not have one that is even worse!

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:17:57

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

zipzap Mon 27-Jun-11 10:18:30

Could your friend ask the doc that saw her dd to also make a complaint or at least write a stern letter about how much this child suffered needlessly and the possible dangerous repercussions of their actions to add weight to her complaint?

I'd also make sure she copies it to the board of governors, ofsted and the local education person at the council (sorry not sure of their official title)

Hope her dd's feeling a bit better now...

ginnybag Mon 27-Jun-11 10:20:06

Oh dear - and worse and worse again.

3 staff to 30 children is under ratio.

I'm wondering if the teacher saw thefall, panicked and picked the kid up, dusted her off and hoped she was alright, because they knew they were in trouble.

Backing up ashamedandconfused - this school needs a serious reality check. Accidents happen, yes, but schools should minimisethe chances of them and know how to respond correctly when they do. This one has done neither.

veritythebrave Mon 27-Jun-11 10:21:04

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ashamedandconfused Mon 27-Jun-11 10:23:54

verity - they need consent forms to take the kids of site for any reason for any length of time - 5 minute walk to local church, 10 mins to duckpond and we dont ever go without parental consent form and one adult per 4/5 kids
eg what if the child were on medication that would affect their having a GA, for example?

the only way they could get round this IMO is if they had a general airy fairy comment on their home school agreement that parents have signed that SAYS children may sometimes go short distances off site without prior notice, and the option to withdraw your child from this

(am ex teacher and am really really angry about this whole episode!)

there is so much apparently wrong here, i think your friend should actually seek legal advice - it is possible a bad break could affect this little girl long term. i am not at all for the "where theres blame theres a claim" culture, but this school have massively cocked up here

weblette Mon 27-Jun-11 10:24:27

School needs a rocket up its arse.

Ambulance should certainly have been called if the child had a fall like that, never mind the fact that children that age shouldn't be playing on inappropriate equipment.

Hope the little girl's starting to feel better sad

mummytime Mon 27-Jun-11 10:29:00

I would suggest also copying or making a complaint to the LA. As the LA and the school are both putting themselves at huge risk of being sued. Actually I can't imagine the teaching unions being impressed by this either.

MajorBumsore Mon 27-Jun-11 10:30:35

We don't take the kids out at our school without a belt and braces risk assessment for every trip. We also don't take kids out without a first aider being present. I would consider us to be quite a free and easy going type of school. I'm amazed that they've got away with this. Ofsted would be crawling all over them and your school OP. No way can you just bung kids in a mini bus and take them for a jaunt anymore.

ginnybag Mon 27-Jun-11 10:31:22

OK, I run a youth group. We had an adult trip playing dodge ball and end up with a break like that.

Now, this is a big bloke - very tough, engineer, outside all weathers up ladders type.

He was white as a sheet, dripping with sweat and struggling to focus enough for conversation.

That's an adult.

Somebody's head needs to roll here. Poor, poor child. That kind of break can have long lasting effects, although from that perspective it's good she is so young. They heal better!

pozzled Mon 27-Jun-11 10:32:05

I agree with everyone, really disgusting treatment of the girl and shockingly casual attitude to trips. just wanted to add that if they didn't see how far she fell, that should have made them more willing to call an ambulance, not less!

ashamedandconfused Mon 27-Jun-11 10:34:41

"they dont do risk assessments for trips AT ALL! She just sticks them in the mini bus and off they go off, even in holiday club, to teachers house to play, parks, nature reserves, beach etc".

shock seriously? all the time, without parental consents and correct ratios and risk assessments ?? (you would not necessarily KNOW abot the RA, unlesss you went as an adult helper in which case you should be given a copy to read)

bloody hell!!!!!

all I can think is this is a very elderly head in a small rural school who thinks modern regs do not apply to them because they know better?? (not that that makes it OK)

no way should this be able to happen

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