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to be properly offended by this numpty?

(242 Posts)
maighdlin Mon 06-Dec-10 21:59:29

i love the BBC's have your say section. interesting read and you do get some clever people on it. today they were talking about "sexual" items aimed at children, t shirts that say "porn star" etc. one person said this

This does need to be addressed. Kids should be kids. I dispise seeing kids forced to give up fun for 'education' (some kids dont have a clue about fun) and I dispise seeing kids (usually young girls) wanting to look and act like tarts.

In my family I have cousins who were barely up to my knee in height but dance like lapdancers because of the pop singers at the time. Luckily their parents make them dress appropreately but I think if young kids were taught self respect there would be less rape cases. Being taught the difference between a prostitute/lapdancer/stripper and normal behaviour would make all the difference.

I completely agree with what they are saying except for the " I think if young kids were taught self respect there would be less rape cases" WTF????? I am very rarely offended but how bloody dare they say that a girl having low self esteem means she gets raped??? I hate this attitude that some people "deserve" or "ask for it" when it comes to rape. Rape is rape no matter what you are wearing or whatever. Its a stupid misogynistic way to think that only "good" girls get raped.

Im not sure im even making sense here but am so effing angry at this ignorance angry AIBU to think that some uninformed ignorant dickhead wrote this?

Octonauts Mon 06-Dec-10 22:01:28

YA SO NBU.

In fact I was just posting to pull you up about that very statement as it wasn't clear from your OP initially that you were quoting someone else!

Jaquelinehyde Mon 06-Dec-10 22:01:34

As I was reading through that I was thinking what the hell is the OP on about! Then I got to the rape bit angry

YANBU 100%

earwicga Mon 06-Dec-10 22:02:52

YANBU!

The only surefire way of not being raped is not to be in the presence of a rapist.

maighdlin Mon 06-Dec-10 22:03:40

to clarify the 3rd and fourth paragraphs are quotes. was very angry when i wrote OP.

Fibilou Mon 06-Dec-10 22:04:15

no, for a minute i thought that it was you saying it and I was about to launch into a rant grin

YANBU, attitudes like that is why rape is so difficult to prosecute and why it attracts shite penalties when it is. In the eyes of a lot of men, it appears, unless you're an innocent virgin/wholesome teenager/devoted mother/elderly lady you were probably gagging for it anyway. Especially in a short skirt

MogTheForgetfulCat Mon 06-Dec-10 22:04:33

Not at all surprised to hear such utter crap on Have Your Say - am surprised that you have ever found intelligent life forms on it, it seems to be full of reactionary drivel whenever I read it.

YANBU to be furious about the comment - it shows a total lack of understanding about what rape is, which is nothing whatsoever to do with the victim, the ways she was dressed or her self-esteem levels (hmm) and everything to do with the perpetrator.

otchayaniye Mon 06-Dec-10 22:04:34

You mean the Speak You're Branes section?

It's a repository of grief athletes, bewildered racists and armchair generals.

Take no notice.

(Oh, I've been raped in Russia but I was wearing clumpy boots and a zip up cardigan. And I don't have particularly poor self esteem. What that idiot said doesn't upset me as it's, well, the fartings of some unemployed greasy man in a dressing gown. Probably)

otchayaniye Mon 06-Dec-10 22:05:45

" attitudes like that is why rape is so difficult to prosecute and why it attracts shite penalties when it is."

No, that is absolutely wrong.

TattytinsellooksDevine Mon 06-Dec-10 22:06:14

Did the poster clarify what type of rape he meant? Because if he meant statutory rape where the girl was consenting with a boy of a few too many years older he might have a point in that if they had more self respect they wouldn't be pursuing sexual relationships that young but be out playing hopscotch or whatever.

I doubt that's what he meant though - clutching at straws but that's the only slightly excusable context. (I'm not saying in all cases of statutory rape the girl is the one pursuing the sexual relationship by the way - underage consentual sex not to be confused with being groomed by a paedophile)

If he's thinking that girls dressing like that then getting raped is what causes rape to happen, then that is offensive but smacks of ignorance more than anything about the motives behind rape.

frgr Mon 06-Dec-10 22:06:57

You are not being unreasonable. The BBC comment is vile angry

maighdlin Mon 06-Dec-10 22:07:41

this issue is very sensitive to me as i lost my virginity in a horrible way and nothing ever came out of it because i believed that everyone would think i was lying, that i deserved it etc and its only in adulthood that i realise how wrong an attitude that is to have and how much peoples view needs to change.

earwicga Mon 06-Dec-10 22:08:24

'Did the poster clarify what type of rape he meant? Because if he meant statutory rape where the girl was consenting with a boy of a few too many years older he might have a point in that if they had more self respect they wouldn't be pursuing sexual relationships that young but be out playing hopscotch or whatever. '

You can fuck right off as well. Equating rape with 'pursuing sexual relationships'!!!

Fuck off with your types of rape. And when you get to fuck you can fuck off some more.

hatwoman Mon 06-Dec-10 22:08:58

yasnbu - but the worst bit, to my mind, is when you combine the sentence you dont like with the last one - it sounds like raping prostitutes/lapdancers/strippers is ok.

earwicga Mon 06-Dec-10 22:09:15

Sorry to hear that maighdlin. Me too. Did you see Tracey Emim's film about it?

otchayaniye Mon 06-Dec-10 22:09:56

maighdlin I'm sorry.

I empathise as my rapist was my second sexual 'partner'

Fibilou Mon 06-Dec-10 22:14:20

"" attitudes like that is why rape is so difficult to prosecute and why it attracts shite penalties when it is."

No, that is absolutely wrong."

I work in the police - in the criminal justice department, working in the court. I deal with this every day and I can assure you that rape attrition rates are very low and penalties are pathetic on the whole

begonyabampot Mon 06-Dec-10 22:20:48

I wonder if they are talking more about the amount of alcohol many young girls/women drink and the fact many often get into such a state (been there and done it myself so not judging them) that it can make them more vulnerable to men who take advantage of this. When I think back to myself, i put myself in many dangerous situations (was having such fun at the time)as I was quite drunk at the time and didn't always consider possible dangers. This doesn't excuse the men but I feel the reality is that often we as women need to think what we can do to keep ourselves safe and clearer headed. Again, I'm not blaming women for any attacks at all but wonder how many rapes are facilited through the women not being in a position to be more aware and make sure she doesn't make sometimes unwise decisions.

MrManager Mon 06-Dec-10 22:22:07

Fibilou the police are part of the problem. Even in 'good' counties, only 80% of people claiming they were raped are actually reported as crimes.

Even then, the CPS will only go for a prosecution if there is at least a 51% chance of a conviction, and even then there are a lot of 'witness issues', usually meaning that the 'complainant' (bizarre way to refer to an alleged rape victim, but there you go) understandably doesn't want to be in the same room as the rapist.

Plus the necessary 'innocent until proven guilty' principle causes a lot of problems, since a rape usually has the complainant as the only witness, making it a him vs her scenario.

earwicga Mon 06-Dec-10 22:27:58

Where are these magical 'good counties' MrManager? The reporting rate for rape is 5-10%

maighdlin Mon 06-Dec-10 22:32:09

begonyabampot i agree with a lot of what you have said. there needs to be more education for young girls about the dangers of drinking to much, beyond your liver.

what happened to me was that i was 15 and had just had a fight with my mother (as usual) and went to a house party and get very very drunk. i got very ill and went to the toilet and threw up and then passed out beside the toilet. the next thing i knew some guy was having sex with me. i had never had sex before. at the time i never thought that this was rape. i had the clichéd naive attitude that rapes happen in dark alleys by strangers. i was just a drunken eejit. that night still affects me 8 years later and i don't think it will ever go away. would what of happened happened if i had of not got so drunk? probably not. but i hate the fact that so many people would have took the attitude that i brought it on myself for getting myself that drunk.

there need to be education to girls to not get so drunk you ignore your safety and for boys that a drunk woman is not an open opportunity.

MrManager Mon 06-Dec-10 22:44:17

earwicga
About 1 in 8 rapes are reported to the police. The police will actually only record about 80% as a crime, depending on the county (one I heard of was about 30%, shocking), aka 'no-criming' the incident. The conviction rate for those actually recorded by the police is about 6%.

begonyabampot Mon 06-Dec-10 22:56:14

maighdlin - Could easily have been me, sorry to hear of what happened to you. Problem is as well, that it not only puts us in a vulnerable situation but any reports or attempts to get justice will be hard to be taken seriously if large amounts (probably any) of drink is involved, it probably would seriously affect any case and your credability as a witness.

DitaVonCheese Mon 06-Dec-10 22:56:36

maighdlin I'm so so sorry. That is absolutely not your fault - it's the fault of the bastard who sees a vulnerable woman and thinks it's okay to prey on her. Hope you manage to get some closure.

WhereYouLeftIt Mon 06-Dec-10 23:01:59

"I am very rarely offended but how bloody dare they say that a girl having low self esteem means she gets raped??? I hate this attitude that some people "deserve" or "ask for it" when it comes to rape. Rape is rape no matter what you are wearing or whatever. Its a stupid misogynistic way to think that only "good" girls get raped."

I think I'm reading this person differently to you. Surely if he's calling it rape, he does not think she is asking for it? I read it as meaning that low self-esteem would possibly lead a girl to accept abusive/predatory behaviour (and therefore be at risk of being raped) that someone with high self-esteem would reject and remove herself from. But he calls it rape, not 'asking for it'?

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