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To be despairing of teen girls particularly nowadays....

(76 Posts)
Mowiol Sat 13-Nov-10 00:21:29

Don't get me wrong...... I think general standards have dropped across the board from the days when I was young so bear with me.... please!! After all, I'm quite old and a Grandma!!

I am a teacher and I am constantly non-plussed at the swearing/burping/farting/discussion of drinking habits/sex etc. amongst girls nowadays. Being discreet or remotely lady-like seems to be anathema nowadays.

I'm most definitely NOT saying that I accept any of that from boys, but it saddens me that girls in particular seem to have no decorum nowadays - for example they discuss periods etc. in front of boys, and I'm afraid I came from the generation where you would have died before mentioning that in front of a boy!!

And these are 13-14 year olds - I remember my Mum and Dad taking a very dim view of youngsters (of either sex) being out beyond 8-9pm on a school night or having "boyfriends and girlfriends" at that age. I was very conscious that they were highly disapproving of shenanigans at that age.

Am I a silly old-fashioned woman??

maktaitai Sat 13-Nov-10 00:28:30

Swings and roundabouts? I'm glad to be honest that girls feel able to talk about periods in front of boys, I think that's absolutely a good thing. I would be OK with ds having a girlfriend at that age as I think it did my dh no good at all to be so excluded from normal mixed society that he was 27 before he had a girlfriend!

But I would be upset if a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship was sexual at that age, or if children of that age were drinking and boasting about it. So YABU and YANBU smile

Clary Sat 13-Nov-10 00:31:46

I think it's great that girls can discuss periods in front of a boy.

The swearing and burping I can do without, but that's from anyone tbh.

I work in with teenagers and I am constantly amazed by their positive attitude, spark and wit.

Maybe the girls are a bit more out-there than I was - but mostly to the good IMO.

Girlfriends at 13-14 sounds fine to me.

duchesse Sat 13-Nov-10 00:34:42

I for one am GLAD that girls and women no longer feel that periods etc are shameful and should be hidden. I am also glad that girls are no longer taught to be "ladylike" (code for subservient) and are taking an equal part in life. I revel in girls being tomboys. At least they have a chance to be equal to the boy peers, unlike my generation that constantly had to prove itself and be 3x better than boys to do the same things.

So, I disagree with you most vehemently. You may not like the way they express their place in society, but how they take that full place matters less than the fact that they are taking it.

OTTMummA Sat 13-Nov-10 00:36:46

yes, you are silly and old fashioned.

Not always a bad thing, but on the points of girls talking to boys about periods, well, i thinks thats progress tbh.

13-14yr olds IMO shouldn't be having sex, and should be in before 9pm school days, and 10pm weekends.

The way i behaved at 13 -14 is no where near what i behave like today, im so embarresed about it i have a few skeletons lol.

Its quite normal for girls to have a few wild years etc and then usually they calm down and focus on being a productive member of society and like to be seen as respectable.

BitOfPom Sat 13-Nov-10 00:38:02

I have to agree with duchesse.

I dislike rudeness and lack of judgement of what's acceptable in public etc, but I welcome girls having fun and being confident.

scottishmummy Sat 13-Nov-10 00:45:11

i wouldnt single out girls they don't have higher attitudinal/behavioural benchmark to attain to than males.

is about judgement and capacity - for all young people

males and female need self respects,confidence and positive risk taking

Mowiol Sat 13-Nov-10 00:47:09

Well, with reference to discussing periods - I'm admittedly old-fashioned here. My Mum impressed on me that it was a private matter and not to be discussed in front of men.

I'm happy to be disagreed with on this but quite simply I see no need to discuss it in front of males - they do not get periods and can't contribute.
Admittedly they need to be informed about the effects of menstruation such as pain and mood swings.
But beyond that I'm afraid I object strongly to the type of comment I overheard a girl making the other day in class about "smells when you are on your period" - made to a boy by the way.

Besides the period issue I just feel the general willingness to burp/fart/lash out/discuss sexual things even amongst 14 year olds is depressing.

ForMashGetSmash Sat 13-Nov-10 00:50:11

Since girls have felt a lot of shame aand embarrasment over their bodies with regards to periods etc for many many years, it's a wonderful thing that this is out in the open now.

I don't like body functions involving gas from either end from ANYONE though...it's gross and belongs in the lavatory.

I lso think the term "Ladylike" is dead to most girls now and "dignified" should be used instead. That can apply t either sex and pretty much means the same thing.

QueenOfTheNight Sat 13-Nov-10 00:50:52

I agree 100% with duchesse

Do you also expect boys to have 'decorum'?

My DM remembers having to go to the chemist's in the 1950's and having to ask for a 'brown paper parcel' which was the euphemism for sanitary towels. When my DM and DF married he had no idea about periods because his DM and DF had been too embarrassed to speak to him about it and his sex education at school somehow didn't deal with human reproduction. Apparently they only covered insects and a small group of mammals.

Periods are normal, natural and nothing to be ashamed of and there is no reason why they should not be talked about. If I were you I would be proud of your girls! What does lady like mean exactly?

Mowiol Sat 13-Nov-10 00:52:59

OK - seems I'm a silly old-fashioned woman!!

Agree it shouldn't be a gender issue either really scottishmummy - but don't get me started on under-achievement by boys at school That is also very depressing when you have the notorious "dip" that seems to happen round S2/S3.

Fair enough - I'm old-fahioned - I can accept that! grin

scottishmummy Sat 13-Nov-10 00:56:49

your post contains value laden jargon.think bout that

Mowiol Sat 13-Nov-10 01:03:03

"value laden jargon" - explanation??

Rachyandmeg Sat 13-Nov-10 04:15:08

Hi mowi

I'm. Young, I agree in some ways with u . Why do boys need to hear about periods at 14? I don t think girls should be talking about this to young lads , there's no need. I think their needs to be boundaries and today it seems there are not many.
I also don't get all this equal opportunities stuff that they spout out. Why do some women go on a crusade to prove there equal to men? Women will always be different from men that's nature. Look at nature .
Coming back to your point yes I believe girls should be confident etc same as boys but today morals and respect seem to have gone downhill. Letting kids get away with so much is wrong and down to bad parenting and the school system.

Coralanne Sat 13-Nov-10 06:52:33

Saw two young girls yesterday about 13-14 screaming out at a boy of similar age
"Is that your dick sticking out of your trousers"?

Very very sad.

Goblinchild Sat 13-Nov-10 07:05:37

One of the things I enjoy about the constant flow of teenagers through my house and my life, is how lovely they are to each other and me. They are funny but not foul, broad-minded and tolerant, with a huge capacity for friendship and supporting each other.
I also think that it's a good thing they can discuss 'women's matters' as a mixed group, surely the more open and aware they all are about periods and sex and contraception, the better for both sexes?
I do like good manners in either sex, and part of that is knowing when not to upset others, such as silly, old-fashioned women by discussions in their hearing.
But if you are a teacher OP, a lot of that is to wind you up and be disruptive and shocking because they can. Another sign of their age, and relationship with you. smile

notyummy Sat 13-Nov-10 07:26:49

I think it is possible to be confident, open and well mannered at the same time. Talking about periods is a good thing I think, but it doesn't need to come hand in hand with bad manners in either sex. There are plenty of well mannered confident teenagers out there..... Although some take longer to mature and show it than others. As a slight aside, a couple of years ago I was pushing a hugely heavy buggy with lots if shopping hanging off it. It kept tipping up and bags falling off up a steep hill. All of a sudden 2 lads from the local secondary school ( looked to be about 15 years old) came running across the road and carried the bags up the hill for me!! They were so lovely and just said 'that looks like a right nightmare, can we help?' and proceeded to take the heaviest stuff. I always remember them and think their parents did a good job!

Goblinchild Sat 13-Nov-10 07:35:01

notyummy, you realise that your response will help them to be friendly and helpful to others in the future?
Rather than thinking OMG!OMG!
Teenagers, coming to be feral and endanger My Baby!
Sometimes it's disheartening to be treated with constant suspicion, before having done anything wrong. smile
Sometimes they think it's funny and laugh at the paranoia.

notyummy Sat 13-Nov-10 07:43:52

Goblin - I worked as a teacher many years ago in secondary schools in some quite deprived areas. I loved working with teenagers and quite agree that a lit if them are stigmatised by the minorities behaviour. Some of the ones I worked with had behavioural issues, but the more you found out about their backgrounds the more you knew why sad.

One particularly troubled girl told me that she liked me because I said please and thank you to her. 'Noone says that to me at home Miss. They just shout and wallop.'

Goblinchild Sat 13-Nov-10 07:48:55

I used to work in a tough area, one of my happy memories is of being told that I'd have no trouble at a weekend festival in a local park that I was involved in.
Because some of the lads I'd taught a few years previously were now running two of the local gangs, and had let it be known that
'Any trouble for miss and we'll fucking 'ave you'
They obviously knew their audience, we had a lovely time. Very peaceful.

BelleDameSansMerci Sat 13-Nov-10 08:05:57

It worries me slightly that a teacher believes that teenage girls should be judged by different standards than teenage boys.

When I was at school (early 80s as a teenager) it was perfectly normal for boys to talk about "wet dreams" etc but there was no way we'd have discussed periods in front of them. Quite frankly, if young teenage girls now have the confidence to do so, I'm pleased about it.

I'm not so keen on the burping/farting but I'd hold that view with either sex.

TryLikingClarity Sat 13-Nov-10 08:16:57

OP - value laden jargon = you're saying things in your post which has pre-conceived prejudices and assumptions based on your own knowledge.

Jargon means you're using terms that not everyone can understand.

It wasn't me that said that about you, I'm just clearing it up.

Gooftroop Sat 13-Nov-10 08:20:50

YANBU. Agree with you completely.
But spare a thought for the parents. It's very hard raising girls now when so many matters are taken out of your hands as a conscientious parent. Girls are exposed to ... everything ... on the internet and it's impossible to avoid this as so many of their homework assignments involve computer/internet use.

No going out on school nights. No boyfriends/girlfriends/alcohol before sixth form. No swearing. - all make sense and are rules in this family, but I wouldn't use the work 'ladylike'. I prefer ice queen grin

Alouiseg Sat 13-Nov-10 09:14:04

I havnt got a daughter but if I did I would hope she wasn't as crude as the girls you are describing, I also expect that of my boys.

ccpccp Sat 13-Nov-10 09:21:48

YANBU.

Its hard to tell the girls behaviour from the lads nowadays.

A few pints of alchopop and a fight anyone?

Lovely.

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