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GUILTY - rest in peace dear Elsie

(78 Posts)
bostonkremekrazy Mon 06-Nov-17 13:14:43

Adopter found Guilty today of the murder of little Elsie.
Eight months of abuse behind closed today - after his second daddy went to work, not knowing how her injuries were caused.
A broken leg, facial bruising, a catalog of injuries while in the care of SS - reported by the health visitor - and yet the adoption still went ahead - how on earth did this happen?
An inquiry will now begin with the relevant Social Services.

Sad beyond belief.

bostonkremekrazy Mon 06-Nov-17 13:16:37

meant to say -
eight months of abuse behind closed doors, found guilty today
(I cut the names out and lost a bit sorry!)

feelslikearockandahardplace Mon 06-Nov-17 14:22:48

So sad. I've been following this case as it's covered on our local news. Like you say, it's a wonder the adoption went ahead. I think I read in a report earlier in the trial that there was a sibling, it's terrible that they have had this additional trauma in their lives and lost their sister.
Hopefully when the authorities etc inevitably say that "lessons will be learned" that something positive will come from such a dreadful situation.

bostonkremekrazy Mon 06-Nov-17 15:55:55

There is a sibling yes...siblings through adoption, not birth siblings placed together.
But as you say, another loss for an adopted child, and such a huge loss it will have been sad

flapjackfairy Mon 06-Nov-17 17:35:45

I wonder what will happen to the other adopted child now ?
Will they stay with other dad? I would imagine that would by no means be a done deal !

Stressyseller Mon 06-Nov-17 19:56:50

It's so sad that case sad

JamesBlonde1 Mon 06-Nov-17 20:26:49

Absolutely tragic. I know nothing of the circumstances of why she was unable to stay with her birth parents, but my God she would still be alive if she was with them.

I wonder if she had some issues though as a result of neglect. The adoptive murderous F was calling her horrid names.

JamesBlonde1 Mon 06-Nov-17 20:27:59

Flap, yes there may have already been fresh care proceedings on the surviving child.

Flower20166 Mon 06-Nov-17 20:32:13

It is so so sad. That poor baby.
How old is the other child?

CertainHalfDesertedStreets Mon 06-Nov-17 20:43:13

I can't imagine other dad would be allowed to keep the sibling? At the very least he has failed in safeguarding.

So so sad.

Why did he not just disrupt the adoption?

bostonkremekrazy Mon 06-Nov-17 20:46:06

Elsie was removed at birth from her drug addict birth mother - i'm not sure how relevant that is however. Her removal was necessary as deemed by Social Services - so its not fair to say she would have survived if left in her care - she needed to be removed, and was.

Re the sibling
It is more likely that they are safely in the care of the completely innocent other father, but I imagine he was put through some serious investigation/assessment in order to keep his child.
We may never know.
I hope for both, that they are together and well.

Kr1st1na Mon 06-Nov-17 20:54:29

This is just terrible sad

PurpleStarInCashmereSky Mon 06-Nov-17 22:42:35

It seems he was a good liar. May also be a case of SS being blinded by upper middle class, white gay dads as able to do no wrong. Evil fucker deserves to burn.

bostonkremekrazy Mon 06-Nov-17 22:56:52

I can assure you Purple, there was no 'upper middle class' going on.....they came from humble roots.
other dad especially

PurpleStarInCashmereSky Tue 07-Nov-17 09:37:36

I was going on the other dad's job but I realise class is much more than that.

bostonkremekrazy Tue 07-Nov-17 10:57:52

Just shows what a (self-imposed) job title can do, but no uni, sink hole high school etc etc....working class upbringing.
Not disimilar to many of our children.
Very sad.

Rainatnight Tue 07-Nov-17 15:52:09

I am absolutely haunted by this and keep asking myself what the lessons are for adoption processes.

Could their PAR assessment possibly have been thorough enough if it missed his lack of basic understanding of babies?

Were the SWs who visited pre-adoption order negligent, and didn't ask the right questions?

Should he have been told he needed more experience with babies?

Or is it not just an 'adoption issue' at all, but just the case of one bad person flipping out as happens in sadly too many birth families too?

Interested to know what others think.

flapjackfairy Tue 07-Nov-17 15:55:08

It was their second adopted child so presumably he was already experienced with babies / children!

Rainatnight Tue 07-Nov-17 16:01:20

Ah my mistake, I'd assumed it was siblings placed together for some reason. Then it's all the more reason to wonder what went wrong in assessment, twice.

bostonkremekrazy Tue 07-Nov-17 16:05:00

I dont think this was about lack of experience....but about not coping.
The neighbour reports highlight that - it was also clear that all the behaviour occured once second dad left for work - which shows that he was hiding the behaviour and the fact he wasnt coping.
Older child had been in the home for a few years, arrived as an infant and so far no reports have emerged saying there were any concerns; indeed if there were, they would never have been approved to adopt a second time.
We all have bad days, I know I do. Difference is I call my DP on bad days and say gosh this is tough going....x has done this, y has done this, can you get home early and help me with dinner?!

fasparent Tue 07-Nov-17 17:28:14

DISPICABLE still lot's public do not know.
Must not forget there are lots of children Adopted and in care who have survived such abuse, who are receiving love and care they deserve by some remarkable people. Despite their disability's and trauma.

Jellycatspyjamas Tue 07-Nov-17 17:35:26

I think it's about not coping too - it's so bloody hard to settle adopted children and I don't think anyone can predict or plan for just how hard and each child brings its own challenges.

Not speaking about how hard it is, hiding the fact that you're struggling to cope or indeed not coping is dangerous ground. Not sure how anyone could predict this tragedy if he appeared to be doing ok. In saying that I do wonder just how much is partner knew or suspected - there's no way I can pretend to my DH that all is ok when I'm having a bad day.

thomassmuggit Tue 07-Nov-17 21:43:10

That poor baby.

Any new parent describing their child as 'satan' should trigger alarm bells, surely? If a postnatal mum said that, surely their partner would worry about PND? I do think PAD isn't asked about enough. With my BC, I was asked directly about depression, and screened for it by the HVs. With my AC, even when I said 'this is really hard!' I just got a blank look of 'but this is what you were waiting for?!' I am in no way excusing what this man did, but I hope the investigation looks at what happens when a parent is struggling to bond.

I, too, hope the sibling is with their other dad, so they haven't had that loss, too, unless really unsuitable. If the other dad was unaware, he should no more lose his child than a mother should lose their other children if their other parent murdered them. Of course the question will be asked about the sibling, but I hope they haven't been disrupted as a knee-jerk.

bostonkremekrazy Tue 07-Nov-17 22:04:47

The other dad has been accused of no crime. Please lets not throw accusations around. I dare say his life will be difficult enough now, he has lost his daughter and his husband. Nobody knows for sure at the moment whether he has kept his first child.
Lets be kind to a fellow adopter who I am sure is in terrible pain regarding the situation he has found himself in.

thomassmuggit Tue 07-Nov-17 22:08:47

Sorry, that's what I was trying to say. I'm just not trusting SSs to have been sensible about it.

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