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Can we talk about terminations please?

(1000 Posts)

MNHQ have commented on this thread.

GahWhatever Fri 25-May-18 13:23:48

There's a vote going on over the sea which has enormous consequences for the women who live there. There are some strong feelings on both sides of the debate I'm sure but I think the debate is worth having. Can we do it here?

I believe that a foetus is an extension of the mother's body until it becomes viable outside it (with medical assistance if necessary) and until that point it is entirely the choice of the mother what to do with her own body. Thus I believe that the 24 week cut-off is about right, based on medical knowledge and facilities now, unless the mother's life is in danger.

StatusFan Fri 25-May-18 13:45:17

I agree all women should have that choice but I feel 24 weeks is far too late.

SheisAfucker Fri 25-May-18 13:48:03

I have had an abortion at 16 weeks because of anencephaly.

StatusFan Fri 25-May-18 13:50:48

Can I also add, I mean 24 weeks is far too late whereby the baby is healthy & will have no known issues that would serious affect their quality of life.

Should a scan reveal a baby to either have a diminished quality of life or not live very long after birth then I'd support anyone who made the decision to terminate.

The above is my opinion & only mine.

It's not my business what other women do. It's solely their choice.

mostdays Fri 25-May-18 13:55:06

I believe in the absolute right to abortion on demand and I am not comfortable with putting any time limit in place.

flufffysockks Fri 25-May-18 13:57:39

I am totally behind a woman's right to a termination, but I think 24 Weeks is way too late (medical reason/abnormalities aside).

I don't really know where I would put the cut off point but certainly far earlier than when a foetus already has the potential to be born and able to live.

FishFingerInjury Fri 25-May-18 13:59:31

My views are much the same as @mostdays

GahWhatever Fri 25-May-18 14:00:11

I think that 24 weeks was chosen because before 26 weeks the lungs cannot continue to develop normally even with intervention? So at 24 weeks the foetus is non-viable?
Presumably as the medical possibilities advance the time limit will come down?

SparklySeashell Fri 25-May-18 14:00:13

I'm a bit on the fence, I completely agree with termination for medical reasons, the mother or the baby.

I also agree that it's a Mother's right to choose. I do think that 24 weeks is very late though for a healthy baby. But then there are loads of other circumstances like rape, young teenager finding out late or similar which I understand too.

It's a very difficult subject to come up with an absolute answer to.

tinydancer88 Fri 25-May-18 14:06:05

I think access to safe legal abortions is incredibly important, and to deny that removes bodily autonomy from women. Nobody should have to continue with a pregnancy/become a mother if they don't wish to (whether they already have children or not). Lack of access to terminations also risks trapping women in abusive or unhappy relationships and punishing young girls for being subjected to sexual abuse. It must be harrowing to feel you have no control over your own body; allowing women to continue to have their choices restricted because of their biology has no place in a modern society.

I can completely understand that the 24 weeks cut off we have now troubles people because premature babies have survived from that age (think this is probably extremely rare), but I'm not sure personally whether I think it should be reconsidered as an upper limit or not. I think there are too many different sets of circumstances which could surround pregnancy which I couldn't even begin to imagine.

IHaveBrilloHair Fri 25-May-18 14:07:41

As soon as possible, as late as necessary, for any woman for any reason.

StarUtopia Fri 25-May-18 14:11:35

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

headstone Fri 25-May-18 14:11:52

I think it should only be for genuine medical reasons after 12 weeks. After 20 weeks I would consider it infanticide without genuine medical reasons.

Onesmallstepforaman Fri 25-May-18 14:13:27

My wife was a midwife when we met. She said that viability had increased with medical advances, but that in some cases it might have been kinder to all concerned had the baby not survived. She supported abortion. I feel that too. It's a woman's choice, and I have, and would continue to support any woman that has to make that difficult decision.

MrsPear Fri 25-May-18 14:16:09

Time limit is the only difficult part in my mind. But I do agree with safe termination on demand. When I had mine it was my grand parents that supported me and they were all nervous because they all heard of women who had a back street back then and it was horrifying. My granddad kept asking if I was sure it was a doctor and it was an operating table in a proper clinic. Let’s not forget that the way the law is understood means that women are dying from ectopics. That alone needs changing.

GahWhatever Fri 25-May-18 14:16:47

Abnormality scan at 20 weeks? Dating can vary by 2 weeks. One week to deice. 1 week to schedule?
If the woman is sure that she doesn't want to be pregnant then it generally happens much earlier I think. The 24 weeks is to allow the schedule above.

Apileofballyhoo Fri 25-May-18 14:17:36

Have a look at the FB page In Her Shoes.

GahWhatever Fri 25-May-18 14:18:04

@headstone@ What would you consider the be genuine medical or non-genuine medical reasons?

mostdays Fri 25-May-18 14:19:20

Not just because they can be viable at that age. But because they actually LOOK like a baby at that age. That's my issue.

Interesting- why does the appearance of a foetus matter more to you than its viability?

GahWhatever Fri 25-May-18 14:19:20

decide, not deice

tinydancer88 Fri 25-May-18 14:22:11

I once worked with a girl in her mid-teens who only found out she was pregnant at 18 weeks. She chose to continue with the pregnancy, and I can recognise why people feel very uncomfortable at the thought of a termination when the foetus 'looks like a baby', but I think as pregnancy, childbirth and parenthood are such monumental things, girls/women shouldn't be forced to go through with them. Sometimes reasons to terminate a pregnancy will occur later on and these procedures take time to arrange. Some women will choose termination, some adoption, some to continue with the pregnancy and raise the child. I think it has to be the individual's choice.
Nobody on this thread has said anything like this but occasionally when I see people described as 'pro-abortion' it makes me feel really angry. I don't think ANYONE is filled with joy when they think about terminations but it's about protecting a responsible, legal, safe choice for women.

ScrubTheDecks Fri 25-May-18 14:22:23

It is my conviction that a woman has to have dominion over what happens within her body. 'Medical reasons' brings more ethical issues. Is it OK to abort a disabled baby but not other babies?

The only way round this is to say 'it is a woman's choice. We do not place a value judgement on the foetus, only on the woman's choice'.

So very few women would choose to have a late termination without the kind of strong reasons that make it all too hard to live with. Most women, surely, want it all over and done with asap.

Do away with the patronising and disingenuous waste of resources that is needing two doctors to sign.

A woman's body = a woman's right to choose.

TammySwansonTwo Fri 25-May-18 14:22:25

Has anyone actually looked at the statistics on when abortions are performed and why? There are very very few performed after 18 weeks, and almost all of them are as a result of serious medical issues with the baby. I have a friend who had to have a late stage termination and it was horrific, the baby was very much wanted but the pregnancy could not continue. Anyone having a termination at that stage has to be induced, it’s very very unlikely that anyone would go through that simply because they don’t want to be pregnant.

And as others have said, there needs to be time after the point where anomalies are found, which is 20-21 weeks.

multivac Fri 25-May-18 14:29:59

As soon as possible, as late as necessary, for any woman for any reason

This. I am pro-choice, and this is what pro-choice means.

It doesn't mean I always agree with decisions to terminate. It doesn't mean I don't care about the foetus. It doesn't even mean that I don't think efforts should be made to persuade a woman to change her mind in certain circumstances. But it does mean that, in my opinion, a woman's right to make decisions about her own body is absolute.

ScrubTheDecks Fri 25-May-18 15:14:17

Exactly what Multivac said.

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