What are you watching & reading? Will you do the Beshdel Test on it?

(212 Posts)
Seabright Thu 24-Jan-13 23:32:02

I have been trying to apply the Beshdel Test to what I've been watching lately.

The wiki entry in the link above explains more, but basically to pass the Beshdel Test a work of fiction must have:

A) At least two female characters
B) Who Talk to each other
C) About something other than a man

This evening I have watched:

1. Rizzoli & Isles - pass, just
2. The Good Wife - pass

And I'm reading an Ian Rankin novel at the moment (yes, my choice of tv and books is pretty limited - crime & murder!) which so far fails, but I'm only part way through.

CrunchyFrog Thu 24-Jan-13 23:33:39

I'm reading The Hydrogen Sonata by Iain M Banks, which passes. Watching Bones, which is patchy!

kim147 Thu 24-Jan-13 23:35:21

Braveheart - fail.

The Queen and her lady in waiting. All they could talk about was William Wallace and how romantic he was.

Blushingly, I'm reading The Hunger Games.

Think it passes.

Watching Homeland. Meh. Not quite.

kim147 Thu 24-Jan-13 23:38:06

Stargate - massive win. Sam Carter (Army officer) and the Doctor - talking about science, theories and treatments.

No romance in that.

StickEmWithThePointyEnd Thu 24-Jan-13 23:42:41

Watching Game of Thrones and this episode passes, I think or maybe not. Queen Cersei and Catelyn Stark are talking about their children. Specifically, marrying them to each other and how pretty Catelyn's daughter is. In their defense there wasn't much else for women to do or think about in the time period the book is set.

I'd like to see a discussion between Arya and Brienne of Tarth. They wouldn't talk about men.

joanofarchitrave Thu 24-Jan-13 23:43:31

Reading the Hobbit to ds - epic fail grin

Just finished Jeanette Winterson 'why be happy when you could be normal' which is an epic pass, although it perhaps fails another test; is there more than one male character and do they talk to each other about something other than Jeanette Winterson?

Also recently finished Arthur and George by Julian Barnes. Erm... think it failed, in fact, though I wouldn't swear to it. I really enjoyed it, but I quite disliked The Sense of an Ending, which IIRC would have been a stonking fail, and that's one of the reasons I didn't like it.

JustAHolyFool Thu 24-Jan-13 23:46:23

I'm reading The Mystery of Mercy Close by Marian Keyes and it passes, but sadly not by a hell of a lot.

Chaos - I LOVED The Hunger Games!

PS - it's Bechdel not Beshdel OP. I feel like an utter knob pointing that out, but just so's you know.

Seabright Thu 24-Jan-13 23:59:54

I have just finished The Mystery of Mercy Close - I loved it. Thanks for letting me know about the typo - brain and fingers working at different speeds tonight!

Just watched a documentary on English queens with a female presenter - passes, though quite a lot of it was about the men they married/might have married.

Reading - Apple Bough by Noel Streatfield. Passes easily. Children's lit often does, I've noticed.

To clarify, if it's a conversation with multiple topics, say, gardening, Obama and housing costs, does that pass or fail? And do young boys count as men?

Either way, The New Normal passes more often than not.

MidnightMasquerader Fri 25-Jan-13 02:58:52

Ha, I went to see The Master last night (wonderfully acted; dire film) and came out having nodded off several times thinking what a waste of 2.5 hours that was, and it didn't even pass the Bechdel test...

ComradeJing Fri 25-Jan-13 03:14:01

I keep getting stuck bfing with Two Broke Girls on telly. It's DIRE but passes easily. Main characters are trying to start a cupcake business together so are often discussing that.

Reading a YA romance book at the moment called Torment. It fails rather spectacularly

AbigailAdams Fri 25-Jan-13 06:29:50

Watched Silent Witness - pass.
Reading Villette - pass

ThereAreNoBirdsHere Fri 25-Jan-13 07:03:42

Just read 'House of the Mosque' - passed

Last thing I watched was 'Eggheads' but I don't think that counts! next time I watch a fictional programme I'll take note though

SpeverendRooner Fri 25-Jan-13 07:26:33

The Wheel of Time - easy pass.

Just read When She Woke by Hillary Jordan - pass. Although the horrible situation the main character finds herself in was mostly caused by a man, she gets through it using her own strength and the support of her female sidekick. The 'knight in shining armour' character is also a woman. Feminism is mentioned positively and half of the group of feminists are men.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Fri 25-Jan-13 07:36:40

Watching Silent State - fail
Reading a guide book! Before that read The Playdate, which passed easily.

TheOriginalSteamingNit Fri 25-Jan-13 07:39:14

Ha, wuthering heights: not really!

Absy Fri 25-Jan-13 07:41:24

Watching - How I Met (various episodes). Some pass, some don't (it has two lead female characters, but three male)
Reading - the Power of One (about a small boy who wants to become the world welterweight champion, told from his perspective) barely passes.

MrsGeologist Fri 25-Jan-13 08:18:40

Mike the Knight grin it passes.

Doesn't mean it's not shit though.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Fri 25-Jan-13 09:10:30

Does Mike The Knight pass? I always assumed it would fail.

I'm reading Mumsnet too. That almost always passes grin

UptoapointLordCopper Fri 25-Jan-13 09:32:21

I'm reading Girl with the Dragon Tattoo (finally!) I think it passes.

ecclesvet Fri 25-Jan-13 11:26:39

Currently reading the MN Relationships board - does not pass!

Trills Fri 25-Jan-13 11:29:34

I started a Bechdel Test Thread ages ago.

I went to see Wicked this week - it only struck me at the end as the actors were taking their bows that it is unusual for the two main characters (the two who take a bow last, together) were women.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Fri 25-Jan-13 11:32:04

Yeah, Relationships not so much (but wouldn't pass a reverse Bechdel if a man was the OP, I expect). But some posts do eg practical aspects of planning a divorce.

AmandaPayne Fri 25-Jan-13 12:11:50

I have just finished reading Night Waking by Sarah Moss, which passes easily - even though the narrator spends most of her time on an island with only her husband and two young male children for company.

Also just read Life, Death and Vanilla slices by Jenny Eclair. Which I am 99% sure passed. The three central characters were all female. And Run by Ann Patchett, which passes.

I am carrying out an experiment, inspired by SGM on these boards to just read books written by women for a few months. Very refreshing!

Yeah, Joan, The Hobbit doesn't stand a chance! Watched it in the cinema, and then DD2 asked who was my favourite character. I said Galadriel, as she was the only woman (in 3 hours or so). She gets about 5 min on screen I think. One of the kids pointed out there was a female hobbit early on, who even had a speaking part, she says something like "Good luck." hmm

DD2 said her favourite character was the pony Myrtle - who after all is a female...

DH said there must be female dwarves, elves and orcs somewhere in order to reproduce, but I'm not so sure confused.

UptoapointLordCopper Fri 25-Jan-13 13:04:44

In one of the Tolkien books it was explained (perhaps by a dwarf) that female dwarves look so much like male dwarves (or is it the other way round hmm) that "people" often assumed that dwarves don't reproduce in the traditional way (!?) but are born of the earth.

Do I win a prize for remembering the most useless things I read? grin

Or was that in the movies!? Anyway.

StephaniePowers Fri 25-Jan-13 13:19:35

I feel a bit sorry for The Master, since it's all about a very very controlling man and his mad cult of acolytes: surely no two people would have been permitted to talk about anything other than HIM? grin

meditrina Fri 25-Jan-13 13:22:29

Right now: watching Tracey Beaker (with poorly DC) - pass
Rereading the Peabody series of Egyptological murders (Elizabeth Peters) - pass

oranges Fri 25-Jan-13 13:26:23

Reading Freedom by Jonathan Franzen. Pass

MrsGeologist Fri 25-Jan-13 13:27:19

TheDoctrine, Evie and the Queen talked about the dogs, so today's episode did indeed pass.

Mike the Knight is an odious little turd though, which cancels out any Bechdel test passes, I think.

harrietspy Fri 25-Jan-13 13:30:16

I'm reading Are You My Mother by Alison Bechdel. Passing test so far. grin

StewieGriffinsMom Fri 25-Jan-13 13:30:53

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AmandaPayne Fri 25-Jan-13 13:41:24

I think I have seen you talking about that one on your blog. I must put it on my list.

I am currently working away at my new local library (just moved) so going for books by authors I have enjoyed previously (Ann Patchett - I enjoyed Bel Canto. Although I couldn't be sure it passes, but for plot reasons very few on the characters can actually talk to one another as they don't speak the same language. I'd have to go back and look. And also see whether conversations through a male translator count!). Also, random books that seem light or just jump out at me from the shelves.

I have a couple of Atwoods coming up, which I would hope would pass. I just lurve her . I read 'The Year of the Flood' just before Christmas, which again would pass easily - and hence where I got my current name.

greenhill Fri 25-Jan-13 13:46:54

'Call the Midwife' failed because they were talking about abusive partners / prostitution and the doctor needing a button sewn on his coat by a woman because his wife had died. Odd. Considering it is marketed as being about babies, it is actually about the misery women find themselves in as caused by men.

Does listening to something count? The comedy series 'Clare in the Community' on R4 was a massive argument between Clare and Nali exploiting her previous role as the family nanny to Thomas, so failed.

Yet last weeks episode was about how Helen was committing massive fraud in relation to expenses, so passed as Helen and Clare were talking about work. Any male characters that talk to one another are normally talking about their relationships with women too.

greenhill Fri 25-Jan-13 13:55:13

sgm for the last 20 years I have only read novels by women or gay men (unless reading crime fiction), but in the last year I have started to read male writers again and have not been enjoying reading anywhere near as much as I used to. It may be time to give up on my heterosexual male writer experiment.

grin at harrietspy

Schooldidi Fri 25-Jan-13 20:57:40

I'm watching room 101 and it passes this week but often doesn't.

Earlier today I watched Charmed - pass, The big bang theory - pass but not in the first series I think.

I'm reading Magic Bleeds by Ilona Andrews - passes easily.

JustAHolyFool Fri 25-Jan-13 21:10:16

But how can Room 101 pass or fail? There's only one person on it a week isn't there? And they're always talking to a bloke?

Schooldidi Fri 25-Jan-13 21:12:52

Not any more, there are 3 guests who battle it out to get their thing put into room 101. Today there were 2 women as guests and they were debating which of their things should go in, so it passed. When there are 2 men and only 1 woman as guests then it fails.

DiegaMartinez Fri 25-Jan-13 21:21:53

Reading A Place of Greater Safety by Hilary Mantel. I think it fails. Which means Wolf Hall would fail too. Bit of a surprise.

feministefatale Fri 25-Jan-13 21:34:14

Wordgirl Passes with flying colours.

drjohnsonscat Fri 25-Jan-13 21:36:47

It's no coincidence that she won the Booker for books written in a man's voice which comprehensively fail the test. I love the books but hate the Booker.

I'm not reading anything atm due to lack of inspiration but I can identify the worst failure in film in 2012. Killing Them Softly. Hundreds of men. One unnamed woman in the entire 100 minute saga. She plays, guess what, a hooker. Honestly I don't know how they convince themselves this is ok.

ImNotDrunkIJustCantType Fri 25-Jan-13 21:39:45

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

feministefatale Fri 25-Jan-13 21:40:50

Parks and recreation yesterday which not only passed but had a specifically feminist plot and 30 rock yesterday passed too.

feministefatale Fri 25-Jan-13 21:43:51

oh and i watched ashes to ashes last night which i am pretty sure passed too

badguider Fri 25-Jan-13 21:46:23

I don't think there's a Rankin book that will pass as all his main characters are always male and the minor characters don't talk to each other much.

I'm reading a book about sailing in the caribbean - the female in the sailing couple often talks to local women about food and cooking.
And I'm watching Bones, where two female characters often talk about the case.

NeverKnowinglyUnderstood Fri 25-Jan-13 21:47:16

silent witness..
kind of passes.

I'm reading specials (the third book in Scott westerfield's uglies series). It fails. The first book in the series would pass as the two main characters are female and they talk to each other about all sorts of stuff that isn't boys (it's teen fiction). I think the subsequent books in the series fail because the talk is generally about boys (sometimes slightly obliquely but the plot is driven by the main character wanting to get her boyfriend made into a 'special' so they can be together/she won't be repulsed by him any more). They do talk about other stuff too, but mostly it's all about how boys have come between them.

We're watching American restoration. Unsurprisingly it fails. There are no women in it at all.

Jessepinkman Fri 25-Jan-13 22:02:37

I have been reading Dickens for the last five months. They would all pass.
I'm going to complete Dickens, then I would like to read Moll Flanders.

Seabright Fri 25-Jan-13 22:05:00

New Tricks - failed
QI - so far no female panelists

SanityClause Fri 25-Jan-13 22:06:23

I'm reading this which doesn't pass!

It's fascinating, reading, though!

Seabright Fri 25-Jan-13 22:06:25

ArbitaryUsername - I love American Restoration. American O
Pickets fails too, although I love Danielle.

Seabright Fri 25-Jan-13 22:08:21

American Pickers, even. Grrr!

I love American pickers too. They've got a female manager for the second store now. Danielle was talking to her about inventory and stuff in one of the episodes, so it might be moving towards the occasional pass.

MousyMouse Fri 25-Jan-13 22:16:14

a cathy reichs novel definitely passes (and very enjoyable)

MousyMouse Fri 25-Jan-13 22:19:25

and of course mumsnet. smile

I am so very glad that this place exists, a real eyeopener on soooooooooo many levels.

TooMuchRain Fri 25-Jan-13 22:21:42

Silver Linings Playbook - fail (but has two great actresses and is pretty fab)

ouryve Fri 25-Jan-13 22:32:28

Currently watching something trite on channel 4. Reading 2 books. One on Pathological demand avoidance, so doesn't apply. The other is Terry Pratchett's The Reaper Man. Men, Women and Undead. It makes the application of the test a little more complex. I'm only about 1/3 of the way through and so far, it fails, since the two female characters haven't met. I do find that many of Pratchett's female characters really have their heads screwed on, though.

ouryve Fri 25-Jan-13 22:44:13

Actually - there's a 3rd female character who appeared, briefly, married to an undead man. She acts undead and moves in undead circles to please him. Being Pratchett, though, the purpose of the character really clearly portrayed her situation as rather ridiculous as opposed to desirable.

Greythorne Fri 25-Jan-13 22:52:46

I am watching an old episode of ER. It passes multiply!

Carrie and Hathaway discuss Hathaway going to Med School.

Doyle and Hathaway discuss their professional rivalry.

Jeannie discusses Suicide with a patient with HIV.

Hathaway and Haleh talk about her being a nurse.

Multiple pass. I think ER would pass 7 out of 10 episodes. Will check and report back.

Seabright Fri 25-Jan-13 22:58:34

Newsnight (I know it's not fiction): Pass-o-Rama!

Emily Maitiss hosting, two female experts & 1 male political, who Emily (rightly) seems to think is a pollock. Now seeing a female Malian musician.

kim147 Fri 25-Jan-13 23:01:22

Gladiator - I don't think it has 2 females talking to each other.

The main female character seems to be talking about Russell Crowe all the time. And fending off her brother.

ouryve Fri 25-Jan-13 23:20:58

Newsnight sometimes fails drastically, though. There's been times I've turned on and a topic which affects men and women equally is being discussed by a panel of predominantly grey haired men.

joanofarchitrave Sun 27-Jan-13 00:16:47

Diega I was thinking about Mantel's work and this thread last night, and was suprised that I didn't think Greater Safety or Wolf Hall would pass. I think Beyond Black would probably pass, but (despite the fact I thought it was amazing) have no intention of reading it again so can't be sure. I wonder, though.

How many Booker winners pass...?

CaseyShraeger Sun 27-Jan-13 00:38:17

Tucker and Dave vs Evil passes.

FrothyDragon Sun 27-Jan-13 20:41:59

Reading The Man In The Iron Mask, by Alexandre Dumas. Fails miserably.

fluffywhitekittens Sun 27-Jan-13 20:46:22

Watching "Fringe". Pass

SucksToBeMe Sun 27-Jan-13 20:49:12

Bill Bryson. A short history in nearly everything. Fail

Telly is switched off as I'm trying to get DS to bed. Fail

EduCated Sun 27-Jan-13 20:49:33

Watching Call the Midwife. Fairly easy pass.

bran Sun 27-Jan-13 20:56:22

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Rufus43 Sun 27-Jan-13 21:11:35

Watching a film called Just my luck.... With so far lots of women in successful careers and not talking about men ( although that is about to change as it's a rom com). Reading David Starkeys Six Wives, not sure if that works!

LineRunner Sun 27-Jan-13 21:14:02

Conan Doyle's A Study in Scarlet. Failing so far.

sayanything Sun 27-Jan-13 21:15:30

I'm watching the first season of The Killing - so far, it passes. I'm trying to read Elizabeth George's latest and I think it passes, but I keep falling asleep every couple of pages, so don't quote me on this one.

piprabbit Sun 27-Jan-13 21:16:59

I am watching Keeping up with the Kardashians. It does pass - they are discussing mother's business empire at the moment.

discorabbit Sun 27-Jan-13 21:20:03

oh the bloody beshdel test, only on mn is this hauled out every month or so.

if you know where to look for good intelligent films, the items set out in the op aren't relevant at all, as there are tons of films released that tick all the boxes all the time!

SingySongy Sun 27-Jan-13 21:23:39

I'm reading The Night Circus. So far about a quarter of the way through, and it doesn't pass. Will read on with interest.

I read The Adventures of Tom Sawyer last week. Don't think that passes either.

Dr Dolittle - so far (and we've nearly finished watching it), one female main role and a couple of minor parts. Unless things like "Won't you come in?" count it definitely fails.

tigerdriverII Sun 27-Jan-13 21:35:38

Reading one of the Wallander books. It fails. But I'm still enjoying it.

Watched Master and Commander last night. Complete fail. Barely a woman in it, and those few didn't have speaking parts at all. I love the film though.

EduCated Sun 27-Jan-13 22:41:32

Really Disco? Because I struggle to find them, at least mainstream films, anyway. It's still an interesting way of looking at films and books.

TunipTheVegedude Sun 27-Jan-13 22:44:48

Bring Up The Bodies.

ok it fails but I can't really blame Mantel for that given the subject matter.

CaseyShraeger Sun 27-Jan-13 22:51:34

That's not the point, though, discorabbit - it's that most mainstream culture, the stuff that makes the money and lots of people see and that has the studios thinking "Hey, let's churn out another dozen films like that" doesn't tick the boxes. Very very few commercial movies ever have a lack of male characters talking to each other about a range of subjects, but it's perfectly routine where female characters are concerned, to the extent that you only really notice it if you're specifically looking for it (as per the bloody Bechdel Test). The default is for any given character to be male unless there's a particular reason it has to be female.

coldcupoftea Sun 27-Jan-13 22:58:08

Just read 'The Casual Vacancy' by JK Rowling- it passes but only just tbh, I had to rack my brains to rember a conversation between 2 women that wasn't about a man, despite the fact there are a lot of female characters.

porridgeLover Sun 27-Jan-13 23:12:19

Very lightweight addition to the thread. I watched Brave on DVD with DS and DDs. We loved it and I was happy for DDs that they can see girl characters who are self directed, and powerful in their own right.
I think I am right in saying it passes.

KatyTheCleaningLady Thu 31-Jan-13 23:13:07

I'm reading The Talented Mr. Ripley, which fails. There's really only one female character (Marge.) However, the main character is a misogynist who resents Marge and is obsessed with a man so it's not a problem to me.

AbigailAdams Thu 31-Jan-13 23:48:55

Watched Despicable Me earlier (watched in the loosest sense of the word!) and that passed I think.

Still reading Villette which although passes the Bechdel test is a feminist fail. Especially with one very scary abusive male character. In fact all the men are pretty bad in it.

PretzelTime Thu 31-Jan-13 23:57:22

The Hobbit, which I love, obviously fails like all Tolkien stuff. People like to excuse him because the books were written in the earlier parts of the 1900's but him appearing to most of the time seriously forget that women exists at all is just weird. Even the most sexist of old male authors knew women existed and would have some in their books.

monsterchild Fri 01-Feb-13 00:09:41

I'm watching the Sherlock series. So far it is failing. Not too many females and they don't seem to talk to each other; fun nevertheless!

Pretzeltime I agree it is very weird about Tolkien and the dearth of females in his books. I think the most normal females are Rosie and Tom Bombadil's wife. Otherwise his strong women (and Eowin was a very tough gal!) are sort of stiff, overly formal figures. For a guy who captured male camaraderie and epic storytelling it's odd he had zero grasp of strong women.

garlicblocks Fri 01-Feb-13 01:18:07

Ever since I found out about it I apply it to everything! Wish I wouldn't; I spoil things for myself - especially films - by being all cross about its androcentricity.

I'm not reading any fiction. Have watched East Enders, which passed as usual, and Midsomer Murders, which contained a scene that seemed to pass but turned out to be about a man between the lines.

Funny thing about soaps: you'd think they'd all pass, given the target audience and whatnot, but very few do. Corrie hardly ever does! Lots of women talking - about men.

Will read thread tomorrow smile Guaranteed Bechdel pass grin

garlicblocks Fri 01-Feb-13 01:43:12

Some good ideas here - thanks Just remembered I listened to a bit of Tales Of The City today; think it was the first episode. Nothing but women talking about things other than men smile Very witty stories, iirc - I should see if the library has it - and written by a man, shock horror!

greenhill Fri 01-Feb-13 11:03:24

Is Tales of the City by Amistad Maupin? It helps to pass if there is a gay writer. <sweeping generalisation>

greenhill Fri 01-Feb-13 13:39:54

That should read Armistead Maupin.

This week 'Clare in the Community' on R4 passed again, it helps pass the test because the majority of the characters are women and the one man that works in the office is gay.

LaFataTurchina Fri 01-Feb-13 19:23:20

Watching - The Big Bang Theory - most episodes seem to pass.
Just read - The Waitress - The main character and her best friend/mum/sister discuss her career quite a lot as well as various love interests.

Pascha Fri 01-Feb-13 19:28:25

Letters Between Six Sisters - Pass, Some of it at least. Some of the mitcords did rather lead their lives around their men.

scaevola Fri 01-Feb-13 21:28:06

Not so sure about BBT series 1-3 (only Penny and occasional other females, who invariably talk about Sheldon). More females in 4-6, though.

KatyTheCleaningLady Sat 02-Feb-13 00:52:41

Penny is the only main character on the show who doesn't have a last name!

sashh Sat 02-Feb-13 08:29:51

I watched terminator two a couple of weeks ago and I don't think it passes.

The only 'conversation' between two women is Sarah Connor telling Tarissa Dyson to lie down, and Dyson's reply is a whimper. Is that a conversation?

CrunchyFrog Sun 03-Feb-13 20:26:04

Just finished the last season of Star Trek: Voyager. It passes with flying colours in every episode I think

ImNotDrunkIJustCantType Sun 03-Feb-13 20:35:05

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Schooldidi Sun 03-Feb-13 21:33:27

I've just watched QI - fail, not a single woman on that particular episode (it was a repeat).
HAve also watched today Jamies 30 minute meals, failed obviously.
Dog the Bounty Hunter (not my choice) passed easily, it usually does.
The six nations rugby failed obviously.

I'm reading The Unlikely Pilgrimage of Harold Fry, it's failing so far and I'm 3/4 of the way through. It's good though.

EduCated Sun 03-Feb-13 22:03:07

I'm not sure I've ever seen more than one woman on QI at once confused

Watched 2 episodes of New Girl tonight, one passed, one failed.

Watching Agatha Christie - pass.
Reading Gimpel the Fool, Isaac Bashevis Singer - a surprising fail.

I'm watching Romancing the stone atm. I know Kathleen Turner and her sister talk together about the treasure etc etc but I think Michael Douglas creeps in there too and the only other conversation is between Kathleen and her publisher - revolved around romance fiction and how hopeless Kathleen is. I'm failing it.

Ice age 2 also failed.

The west wing - pass

Schooldidi Sun 03-Feb-13 22:22:47

I've seen two episodes of QI that have had 2 women on. One of those was directly talking about gender differences.

CaseyShraeger Sun 03-Feb-13 22:31:02

I don't think you can fail Romancing The Stone on the basis that they are talking about romance fiction and how hopeless Kathleen Turner is. That's still a Bechdel Test pass, but a useful opportunity to stress the associated note "Passing the test does not necessarily make it more feminist, or otherwise positive-for-women".

AdriftAndOutOfStardust Sun 03-Feb-13 22:31:47

Watching: "The Killing" - Lund does speak to various females at various points but I'd struggle to think of an instance where the subject of the conversation wasn't a man (though obviously that'll be in a suspecting-him-of-murder rather than in a romantic sense). "Misfits" I think will have some individual episodes that pass but not all of them - it does have 2 female characters but they aren't often shown in conversation with one another and when they are the subject is usually one or other of the men. "Game of Thrones" - I think it passes, just - two matriarchs converse with one another about a variety of matters some of which are not about menfolk.

Reading: "Her Fearful Symmetry" passes easily - central characters 2 female twins who talk to all sorts of people both male and female about a variety of subjects.

CaseyShraeger Sun 03-Feb-13 22:44:08

Interestingly, the current (tenth) series of QI has featured three episodes including two women:

Episode 4 "Jack and Jill" (Katy Brand and Sue Perkins)
Episode 5 "J-Places" (Susan Calman and Sandi Toksvig)
Episode 9 "Jeopardy" (Sue Perkins and Julia Zemiro)

This is the same number as in all of the previous nine series put together (if you exclude the 2011 Comic Relief special); previously we had had

Series 1 Episode 6 "Arthropods" (Jo Brand and Jackie Clune)
Series 4 Episode 12 "Domesticity" (Jo Brand and Jessica Stevenson/Hynes)
Series 7 Episode 7 "Girls and Boys" (Ronni Ancona and Sandi Toksvig)

So this could be a sign that something is changing... maybe...

CaseyShraeger Sun 03-Feb-13 22:55:01

Further suggestion that it might be a deliberate policy change...

Season 1: 4/12 episodes (33%) were all-male
Season 2: 5/12 episodes (42%) were all-male
Season 3: 8/12 episodes (67%) were all-male
Season 4: 7/12 episodes (58%) were all-male
Season 5: 7/12 episodes (58%) were all-male
Season 6: 6/12 episodes (50%) were all-male
Season 7: 8/16 episodes (50%) were all-male
Season 8: 8/16 episodes (50%) were all-male
Season 9: 6/16 episodes (38%) were all-male
Season 10: 3/16 episodes (19%) were all-male

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Sun 03-Feb-13 22:58:08

Hallelujah re QI.

How are you getting on with HFS, Adrift? I much preferred TTTW.

WoTmania Mon 04-Feb-13 11:38:44

I apply the Beshdel test to everything (so glad we only watch DVDs or, going by stuff I've seen at other people's houses) it would ruin my entire viewing experience. As it is I often end up seething at the end of DVDs.

Currently reading Wheel of Time book 1 (again) passes.
Watching mainly Stargate - passes (as pointed out upthread), however this aren't current programmes or books.

CaseyShraeger Tue 05-Feb-13 08:36:02

Watched The Descendants last night, which passed.

AmandaPayne Tue 05-Feb-13 14:09:39

Watched Borgen last night. Passed many times - Birgitte/Laura, Birgitte and other female politicians, Katrine/Hanne...

WhichIsBest Tue 05-Feb-13 14:32:57

Watched last night - Breaking Bad= fail.
Reading - Just about to start The Eye in the Door, so I can't judge it yet!

Takver Tue 05-Feb-13 17:51:00

Last film I saw was Les Mis on Sunday - does pass the Bechdel test but fails comprehensively on general feminist principles (and I wanted to slap most of the characters & tell them not to be so stupid).

Currently reading a book about the politics of food in WW2, none of the people mentioned talk to each other as such, but quite a few women's voices from Mass Observation records.

tourdefrance Tue 05-Feb-13 17:55:21

Just finished The Kingmaker's daughter. Pass

coldcupoftea Tue 05-Feb-13 17:59:39

Watched Silent Witness last night- despite having 2 strong female characters it didn't pass as as far as I can remember they didn't actually talk to each other!

stubbornstains Tue 05-Feb-13 18:00:31

Riders, by Jilly Cooper blush

But it does pass the Bechdel test...at least in places; Fen's doing a lot of discussing showjumping tactics with her female groom at the moment.

....I wouldn't say it's a great work of feminist literature in general though ....(still love it).

ethelb Tue 05-Feb-13 18:23:58

Persopolis - pass

Trills Tue 05-Feb-13 18:27:37

Gilmore Girls passes in probably every episode.

Maebe Tue 05-Feb-13 18:51:56

The Bourne Legacy, which surprisingly does pass.

Was a fail on any personal 'feminist' level though as I spent the entire two hours trying not to lick the screen ogling Jeremy Renner blush

RM76 Tue 05-Feb-13 22:27:06

Okay, I'm hoping I'm right with these.
'Brave' the animated movie.(got slated by some fools as a 'chick flick' I think mainly because the hero didn't have a penis!) although, it is about the daughter not wanting to get married, does that count as talking about men?

'Warehouse 13' the T.V. Show. (Sci-if channel have been trying to get more female viewers) they even team two women up as partners, more than once, and there's no cat fight or anything!
Warehouse 13 really is the best IMO when it comes to great female characters. They even have a woman, over the age of sixty, without Botox, as a desirable lady, shock, horror!

'The Guild' (written, made, starring a woman, shown online)

Christ, that really took some effort, there are hardly any, and most are Geeky shows because they knew they had a sexism problem in the area and made an effort.
Really depressing.

ApplesinmyPocket Tue 05-Feb-13 22:33:14

Reading (male author) Phil Rickman's Merrily Watkins series at the moment.

Main characters are a woman and her teenage daughter. Good, strong characters. Definite pass.

"got slated by some fools as a 'chick flick' I think mainly because the hero didn't have a penis!"

Well didn't you know RM76, films with a women/girl as the main character(s) are "chick flicks", films with no women in them at all are just, you know, films... confused

CaseyShraeger Tue 05-Feb-13 22:36:46

They aren't just talking about the daughter not wanting to get married in Brave -- they talk history and tradition and sense of family in general, plus their mother-daughter relationship, so I think that definitely counts. I like Warehouse 13 too -- it's not great television but it's enjoyable and you're quite right about the range of non-stereotypical female characters.

Captain America fails; not precisely a surprise.

CaseyShraeger Tue 05-Feb-13 22:42:46

DS and I got to go to a preview test screening of Brave before they'd finished it. It was reasonably clear from the questions in the feedback form that their main concerns were (a) whether it was too scary for small children, (b) whether the stereotyping was offensive to Scottish people, and (c) (although I'd say this was a more minor concern lagging way behind the others) whether boys would enjoy a film with a female lead. DS (7 at the time) was quite outraged at the idea that he might object to it on that basis (and, incidentally, I explained the Bechdel test to him while we were waiting for the film to finally start and he found it quite interesting (although I suspect he's forgotten the specifics by now. Still, it primed the ground)).

LadyPeterWimsey Tue 05-Feb-13 22:43:52

Gaudy Night - easy pass.

CheerfulYank Tue 05-Feb-13 22:45:04

I'm just reading two young adult novels 'Book of a Thousand Days' and 'The Midwife's Apprentice', both which pass.

I actually sort of chose them for their strong heroines. I'm not entrenched in feminism, so to speak, but I'm having a DD in the spring and it's made me think a bit. I started looking at lists of books that are good for girls. I ordered these two because they sounded so interesting that I wanted to read them. Plus the midwife book is by Karen Cushman, who wrote 'Catherine, Called Buddy' which I love.

CheerfulYank Tue 05-Feb-13 22:46:50

Birdy. Sigh. Autocorrect!

RM76 Wed 06-Feb-13 00:33:14

caseyshraeger thought Brave was a breath of fresh air. Lucky you getting to go to a preview! This whole, boys won't bother with things with girl characters seems self-fulfilling to me, extremely frustrating!
You're right, Warehouse 13 isn't GREAT T.V. (did I say that? Can't flip the page back to check whilst typing a comment, if I did, sorry, that would be an exaggeration) but of it's type, it's a pleasant surprise.

ladypeterwimsy can tell you're a Sayers fan from your user name, and also, obviously your comment. Yes, 'Gaudy Night' is excellent.
Weirdly, I'm listening to 'Strong Poison' right now!
Just got the audiobook radio dram of 'Gaudy night', also have pretty much everything she's done in both book and audio. (Ian Carmichael is so good, and Patricia Routledge.) although some of her religious/academic stuff sounds a little intimidating!
Have you read her biography? What an incredible person! Sorry to go on, but nobody I know has ever heard of her.
Harriet Vane, your namesake, is such an excellent character, something modern authors could do with replicating!

RM76 Wed 06-Feb-13 00:35:50

If we're talking kids books, The 13 Treasures, by Michelle Harrison, and the following books are all excellent. Female characters, exciting, kind of scary story.

WhentheRed Wed 06-Feb-13 01:59:34

Binge-watching House of Cards. Passes.

No time for books, but did start Wolf Hall. Too early to tell if it passes.

Tortoiseonthehalfshell Wed 06-Feb-13 02:03:31

Game of Thrones (reading) - hahahahaha. Er, nope. But, to be fair, every single character spends 1000+ pages discussing Who Should Be King, so everyone is talking to each other about a man. Technically.

Life on Mars (watching) - hahahahahaha. Er, nope again. I feel like the '1970s' thing is just a vehicle to allow them to make an all-male cop show with one token woman.

MsInterpret Wed 06-Feb-13 03:07:57

Watching Girls and it passes - funny that!

Reading Disobedience and it doesn't pass yet but I feel sure it will, just started.

CheerfulYank Wed 06-Feb-13 04:52:16

Well, is it talking to about a man for romantic reasons? Or any reason? Because as Tortoise says, they talk a lot about men in GOT, but they're often political discussions. Likewise the Stephanie Plum books blush where she and her female bounty hunting partner discuss men they're going to apprehend.

To me, both of those have more of a feminist bent than, say, women discussing shoes forever, even if they're not mentioning men at all.

Chubfuddler Wed 06-Feb-13 04:55:45

I'm reading wolf hall. So far a fail - Thomas Cromwell has had two conversations with women so far - one with his sister about his father and one with his wife about their son. No women have spoken to each other at all. I am only about 80 pages in though.

Chubfuddler Wed 06-Feb-13 05:01:36

Thinking about it my favourite film passes - the not terribly feminist Working Girl. Although there is a bit of an implied life triangle (although there is never an actual discussion between the female leads about it) the main thrust of the competition between them is business related. And at first it's made very clear tess thinks she's escaped macho corporate sexism by coming to work for Katherine, although she is quickly revealed in typical 80s business woman ball breaker mould.

Hmmm

I still like it though.

Tortoiseonthehalfshell Wed 06-Feb-13 05:08:32

I actually think GOT fails either way, though; usually it's one woman per 'place' - you know, they're all over the country - talking to a bunch of men about the king. Or it's (I'm only up to partway through book three) Sansa and Cersei/Margarey/various other women talking about who Sansa is going to marry. Maybe Dany talks to her handmaids about having a bath occasionally, but that's all I can think of.

When it comes to books, there has to be a proportion argument, surely? Books have a lot more talking in them than films, I can't imagine that many books manage to have NO scenes of dialogue where two women talk about something other than a man. You know, just to establish a scene or whatever.

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Wed 06-Feb-13 07:53:15
TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Wed 06-Feb-13 08:27:39

I'm now pondering which Wimsey novels do pass. From memory:

Whose Body - fail
Clouds of Witness - fail? The Dowager and Mary are in a conversation but Parker and Wimsey are there and the conversation is mostly about a male suspect.
Bellona Club - fail, I think
Unnatural Death - pass, Miss Climpson and the niece (Wikipedia tells me the manuscript for this was called, "The Singular Tale of Three Spinsters")
Strong Poison - pass, Miss Climpson and the nurse.
Murder Must Advertise - pass? Two of the secretaries go out to tea but not sure if they only talk about the men at the office.
The Nine Tailors - fail
Five Red Herrings - fail.
Have His Carcase - fail? Harriet talks to the widow but I think it's all about the male characters.
Gaudy Night - pass. A lot. But doesn't fail the reverse test!
Busman's Honeymoon - pass, Harriet talks to various named female characters
Thrones, Dominations - pass, Harriet talks to Rosamund, and to Sylvia and Eiluned.

<bored on the train!>

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Wed 06-Feb-13 08:42:19

Tortoise, I think there are quite a lot of books without even a "pass me the salt, thanks" "you're welcome" level of dialogue between two named women (though it's more unusual to have unnamed figures in books than in films which might make it a bit easier for books to pass)

Cheerful, it is talking about a man for any reason - if you are talking about politics and there are no female politicians being discussed, then that's an indication in itself. Which books fail the reverse Bechdel (no two men holding a conversation that's not about a woman)? Maybe "chick lit"?

princessx Wed 06-Feb-13 09:08:44

Film: just watched Django Unchained - massive fail! A woman barely spoke in the film

Book: reading Ian rankin's Rebus : Naming the dead - pass. Siobhan speaks to undercover female detective and her mum.

Tv: Borgen - pass

I'm really glad I came across this thread, I hadn't heard of that test. It is so simple but shows how almost every film fails the test.

I also saw Les Mis last week. Do you think that would pass? The scene at the beginning is the women workers kicking Fontaine out because she has a child.

ParsingFancy Wed 06-Feb-13 09:21:25

Was going to say easy pass, as I'm reading Susanna Clarke's The Ladies of Grace Adieu.

But flicking back, I think it only squeaks through. And then only because the women are talking about the OW rather than the man. There are exchanges about one being injured and her clothes damaged, but this has happened while searching for the OW. So not a glorious pass.

CaseyShraeger Wed 06-Feb-13 09:22:39

Mme Thenardier also talks to Eponine, I believe. And possibly to Cosette?

OptimisticPessimist Wed 06-Feb-13 09:31:14

Binge-watching The Vampire Diaries. The last few episodes have passed (the episodes have all merged into one in my head, so individual episodes may have failed). Bonnie and Elena talked about Bonnie's mum, Caroline and Abby (Bonnie's mum) talked about Bonnie, the mayor and the sheriff (both female) discussed an ongoing serial murder and I'm pretty sure there was a discussion between two of the girls about Rebecca. That said, it's not a particularly strong pass and probably not particularly feminist (but I still luffs it blush).

Also re-watching series one of GOT. Scraped a pass in the first two episodes - both times for a brief conversation between Cersei and Catelyn regarding their children (male children in one of them, but not actually A Man).

Reading This Charming Man by Marian Keyes. Passes (several conversations where the narrator discusses clothes/fashion/her job with a couple of friends) but so far the narrator is falling to pieces because her boyfriend is marrying someone else, so all of her narration seems to come back to him. Really annoying writing style too, but I'm trying to stick with it because I normally love MK.

Also reading Clash of Kings (Game of Thrones book two). Fails so far. Quite a few named (and strong and interesting) female characters but they tend to be surrounded by men.

CaseyShraeger Wed 06-Feb-13 09:47:20

Most episodes of Supernatural fail (I can think of a few that pass). But then I, ahem, don't really watch it for its portrayal of women... blush

WhichIsBest Wed 06-Feb-13 09:55:52

Peppa Pig - pass.

WhichIsBest Wed 06-Feb-13 09:59:15

The IT Crowd - I think every episode fails.

And I saw there was a Frasier thread on mumsnet yesterday, I think that would possibly fail every episode too.

I'm rereading the Wheel of Time series, huge pass. Lots of strong female characters who talk to each other about things other than men.

And I'm obsessively working my way through an NCIS boxset atm. Again a pass, the female characters are in the minority but are strong characters and frequently discuss subjects other than men.

Trills Wed 06-Feb-13 10:27:44

With the number of characters in WoT it'd be really disappointing if they failed. I'm up to the penultimate book in my re-read! grin

True. grin I'm halfway through The Gathering Storm now - book 12 I think that is (it's so easy to lose track!).

WoTmania Wed 06-Feb-13 11:16:38

Have you read MoL yet Trills (I started a thread in Fiction smile )?
My thoughts on WoT though is that although the dragon reborn is male there are probably more powerful female characters than male - and they don't all fit neatly into gender stereotypes either.

WoTmania Wed 06-Feb-13 11:23:59

Urgh that post didn't make much sense - I was trying to write two different sentences at once. Think the general gist is gettable though.

Trills Wed 06-Feb-13 11:26:56

No, I am finishing my re-read of the others first!

I'm not sure that Robert Jordan has a very high opinion of women, for all that his characters are "strong" they are all stubborn, convinced they know better than anyone else, unwilling to ever listen to advice from a man, and generally quite patronising towards men. Pretty much every single one of them.

With such a number of women he could at least have made them have different attitudes towards men.

Tbf most of the male characters have the same opinion towards women! But yes, that is a little frustrating.

That came out wrong. blush I meant that the women view the men in much the same way - stubborn, unwilling to listen etc.

Hullygully Wed 06-Feb-13 11:31:52

Watching: Revenge: no idea, everyone is insane

reading: Music for Torching: no one talks about anything, everyone is insane

Trills Wed 06-Feb-13 11:32:47

The men think they don't understand women.
The women think that they do understand men, and that men need training and telling what to do.

It's all very Mars&Venus, but I guess it has to be given how the magic works. Their entire world is based on "men and women are very different".

Trills Wed 06-Feb-13 11:35:01

Sorry for the diversion.

I'm about to try New Girl - as far as I kow it's about one girl (who I may want to strangle for her kookiness) and a bunch of guys, so not very optimistic about it passing.

Hullygully Wed 06-Feb-13 11:36:07

It's awful, dd watches it.

Hullygully Wed 06-Feb-13 11:36:28

I also hate Two Broke Girls

However 2 Broke Girls does actually pass the test!

Hullygully Wed 06-Feb-13 11:41:05

But they only talk about cookies (it seems to me), can that really count?!

CaseyShraeger Wed 06-Feb-13 11:43:01

RM76, no, you didn't say Warehouse 13 was great TV, don't worry -- I was just qualifying the positive comments that I was about to make about it.

FairPhyllis Wed 06-Feb-13 11:45:08

I am rewatching BSG. The episode I watched last night from the first season passed - and I think all of the ones I have rewatched so far passed. But in at least one case because Laura Roslin is addressing groups with women in them.

Hully it's inane conversation I agree, but I think it still counts.

Arcticwaffle Wed 06-Feb-13 11:57:04

Been watching:

Miranda: pass (though they do talk about men quite a lot they also talk about other things).
Call the midwife: pass. The one I watched this week they talk about being missionaries, and babies.
House of Elliot: pass. they talk about sewing as well as men.

Recently read:
Those Happy golden years (just checking it out for the dc): pass, the women there talk about sewing too.
Some of Casual Vacancy. I suppose it passes, teacher talks to a girl. social worker talks to the girl. It's very boring though, I've ditched it.

Chubfuddler Wed 06-Feb-13 13:44:38

Depressingly I can't think of a single cbeebies programme that passes.

piprabbit Wed 06-Feb-13 13:48:36

Chubfuddler - really? What about Tweenies? Or Balamory?

princessx Wed 06-Feb-13 14:34:11

Talking about cbeebies and that age group I was going to say earlier that Julia Davidson is quite good on female characters. Anyone read 'hide and seek pig'? Mostly female animals, the first 5 or 6 times I read it to dd I kept saying he instead of she each time. Shows how out of the ordinary it is to have main characters and supporting characters as women.

WhichIsBest Wed 06-Feb-13 14:41:22

It is so automatic for generic characters to be male. I think Julia Davidson is quite good at not falling into that too.
Funnily enough, MIL was driving me mad the other day calling the Gruffalo's child "he" and DD's toy dog (who happens to be a girl dog) "he" and something else "he".

Female isn't "other"! Argh.

CheerfulYank Wed 06-Feb-13 14:41:42

Doctrine I agree. However if a book takes place in the past, two women having a political discussion about women politicians would be inaccurate.

AmandaPayne Wed 06-Feb-13 15:12:12

I run an ongoing experiment on myself where I try to see whether I can call animals of indeterminate gender (you know, dogs you pass in the street, etc) 'she' without having to make a conscious decision to do so. Not managed so far. Even when talking about a field of bloody cows (i.e. they are going to be female), I find I have to consciously say 'she'. It is so ingrained to default to the male.

At least English doesn't have male and female versions of 'they', with the female only used for an exclusively female group.

Julia Donaldson is quite good. We currently have a Room on the Broom obsession. The witch is obviously female, so is the bird and I don't think you know the gender of the cat. The dog, frog and dragon are male. I also like Pearl in Zog - "Don't rescue me, I won't go back, to being a princess. And prancing round the palace in a silly frilly dress". Love her.

Schooldidi Wed 06-Feb-13 15:26:52

Amanda - I do that too. I'm starting to win. All of dd2's stuffed toys are automatically female and although I struggled to start with I am now calling all dogs and cats we pass 'she'. It was hard to train myself to do it, so I'm hoping that it will just be normal for dd2 to assume animals are female seeing as she's growing up with me doing it (dd1 is more vocal about this sort of thing than I am so I have no worries about her any more)

I'm currently reading the worst princess to dd2 and we quite like itas the princess ends up doing her own thing and going off with the dragon, but it annoys me slightly by calling her the worst princess, and she does hang around at the start waiting to be rescued instead of getting herself out of her tower. I don't think it passes though because the princess is the only female character as the dragon isn't specifically female (it is in our house but others may think of it as male)

That’s interesting Amanda. For me it depends on the animal - dogs, horses and pigs are automatically 'he' while cats, sheep, ducks and chickens are automatically 'she'. Weird. I do catch myself doing it but not usually in time to change it!

CaseyShraeger Wed 06-Feb-13 16:14:07

Thinking about Cbeebies I'm pretty sure most episodes of Me Too would pass (many of them wouldn't pass a reverse Bechdel test, though), also many episodes of Nina and the Neurons (ditto). ^ Come Outside^ would pass on quite a few episodes (when the person explaining stuff to Auntie Mabel is female) but wouldn't generally pass a reverse Bechdel. Charlie and Lola would pass when Lotta is in it.

Chubfuddler Wed 06-Feb-13 16:31:27

Balamory tends to involve discussion between miss hoolie and another woman about fixing a problem PC plum is having, or Archie, or Spencer. There may be episodes that pass.

Me too - well doctor juno's dog is male, so she discusses him with granny Murray, the lady who cleans buses has a son so that's out, can't remember any other female characters.

Still just some episodes of me too and balamory is pretty rubbish out of the entire channel.

CaseyShraeger Wed 06-Feb-13 17:29:40

There's Tina the taxi driver too. But the characters discuss all sorts with Granny Murray. Last week Doctor Juno was off on a sponsored bike ride to France and she chatted about that with GM before she went; the week before Doctor Juno and bus-cleaning woman (whose name I forget) had a talk about the "Be Seen, Be Safe" publicity campaign. Tina is heavily into am dram so she tends to talk to Granny Murray about that. Women who have male dogs and/or sons are capable of talking about something else. i can't offhand think of many episodes I've seen that wouldn't pass.

On Balamory over half the recurring cast (and the only character who's in it every single week) is female. So 50% of the time the person who first turns up to talk to Miss Hoolie will be female and it'll automatically pass.

Did you mean to just deliberately ignore all the other examples people gave? I mean, I'm prepared to load quite a bit of opprobium on Cbeebies fir the sexist tosh that is Tree Fu Tom but I don't feel the need to whitewash entire shows out of the collective consciousness to make my point.

Xiaoxiong Wed 06-Feb-13 17:35:36

ouryve I'm reading Wyrd Sisters by Terry Pratchett, having just finished Equal Rites.

I think every Pratchett book I've ever read would pass both the Bechdel and reverse Bechdel tests with flying colours.

WowOoo Wed 06-Feb-13 17:43:21

Watched Borgen and it passed.

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Wed 06-Feb-13 17:44:04

YY amanda - I saw a hang glider on holiday and made a conscious effort to say "where's she gone now?" etc to DS. It's a definite effort.

Trills Wed 06-Feb-13 18:04:28
ouryve Wed 06-Feb-13 21:29:17

These blog posts are fab, Trills. I'm slowly working my way through them!

ImNotDrunkIJustCantType Wed 06-Feb-13 21:32:18

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

paperclips Thu 07-Feb-13 01:52:13

Reading "The Secret Life of Bees", it passes easily.

I've been enjoying Frasier every morning with my breakfast but it always fails.

Also watching "My Mad Fat Diary" which only just scrapes through, they talk about "lads" most of the time but not always.

Our current box-set is "The Fringe" season 4. There are a few more passes this season, as Nina Sharpe talks to Olivia more about "stuff other than men". Otherwise, Olivia and Astrid only talk about the male characters or the cases, although about half the cases are women. It usually passes.

CheerfulYank Thu 07-Feb-13 15:06:45

I watched 27 Dresses last night...it passed.

kerala Thu 07-Feb-13 16:57:19

Zero Dark Thirty passes frequent scenes of 2 women discussing their work.

kim147 Sun 10-Feb-13 20:45:08

Chocolat

Massive win - and it highlights some issues as well such as domestic abuse and personal choice on how to live a life without being told how to do it by society.

ImNotDrunkIJustCantType Sun 10-Feb-13 20:52:38

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FrameyMcFrame Sun 10-Feb-13 20:54:56

Just watching Call the Midwife with DD. It does pass but women are beaten up and humiliated, another is sexually abused on a cargo ship by the sailors. I know it's set in the past but it's not really family viewing

EduCated Sun 10-Feb-13 21:17:58

Not quite right for the test, but am watching the BAFTAs. Will be interesting to see how many women present as compared to men.

kim147 Sun 10-Feb-13 21:21:06

Well you can guess what the pictures and the comments will be on the women in the morning, can't you.

Look at this outfit, look at that outfit, that was a controversial outfit. All on the front page.

AmandaPayne Sun 10-Feb-13 22:20:23

I have already browsed the outfits (oh the shame blush). I was pleased to see quite a few women actually wearing coats on the red carpet. Small improvements and all that.

Sunnywithshowers Sun 10-Feb-13 23:17:58

I'm watching Piranha.

Epic fail on all counts.

Melpomene Fri 15-Feb-13 15:37:43

Just saw Wreck-it Ralph at the cinema. It passed the test on the basis of two scenes - one scene where some girl video game characters are discussing a go kart race (although this does involve bullying), and a second happier discussion at the end involving the same group of girls.

Two of the main four characters in the film are female - they play a more significant role in the film than I expected from watching the trailer. They don't really ever talk to each other, but both are presented as feisty, active and resourceful.

msrisotto Fri 15-Feb-13 15:44:01

Les Miserables...I think it fails? I know Fantine is bullied out of the factory where she was working by women who were bullying/talking to her but I don't think they actually had names.....

kim147 Fri 15-Feb-13 15:49:02

I can't recall Les Miserables having much conversation between 2 women. Except Mme. Thenardier being awful to Fantine and Eponine.

AmandaPayne Fri 15-Feb-13 15:49:43

I think it fails too. The bully Fantine essentially about a man - the whole conversation is about her sexual behaviour. Eponine and Collette never speak, which is a bit chance missed IMO.

Trills Fri 15-Feb-13 15:59:05

There's a conversation between Cosette and Mme Thernardier along the lines of "work harder, go get water", "I'm scared and I don't want to". So that's technically a pass.

ThePathanKhansAmnesiac Fri 15-Feb-13 16:11:26

I,m watching the Golden Compass, thats a pass i think, isn,t it?.

tangledupinpoo Fri 15-Feb-13 16:55:21

Reading The House of Sleep at the moment. Not far through it but so far, it just passes.

Watched the Iron Lady last night and that barely passed, surprisingly. There was quite a lot of MT talking to Carole, but mostly about missing Denis. Some of it must have been about what she was going to wear that night, or going to buy milk.

My DH used to think me over-earnest changing half the animals' genders in Dear Zoo. Seriously, they're all male!

Can't even articulate the level of fail of the Godfather films and Apocalypse Now.

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub Fri 15-Feb-13 20:35:54

James has just got to the centre of the Giant Peach and met the insects.

The text goes something like, "The Spider stretched her legs (for she was a female Spider)..." needless to say, Roald Dahl doesn't specify that the Grasshopper is male...

It is a pass though, as the two Aunts talk about eating the Peach.

Schooldidi Fri 15-Feb-13 20:57:48

I'm reading A wise man's fear by Patrick Rothfuss. It passes, there aren't many female charachters who meet each other but when they do they talk about magic or their studies rather than a man usually.

Trills Fri 15-Feb-13 22:42:03

I really enjoyed that book - do you know when the third one will be out?

Schooldidi Fri 15-Feb-13 22:42:46

I don't. I hope it's soon.

13Iggis Fri 15-Feb-13 22:46:21

A re-run of detective series Vera - passed.

Trills Fri 15-Feb-13 22:49:37

Mean Girls mainly has women talking to each other about other women rather than about men.

Schooldidi Fri 15-Feb-13 23:11:48

The walking dead - passed.

sydlexic Fri 15-Feb-13 23:28:33

I heard of the Bechdel test a couple of weeks ago and have been thinking about it. Sadly the only programme that passed was silent witness. It really makes you think.

Love big bang theory but that was a massive fail.

Spooks. Episode mumble of series mumble. Passed with bells on.
Wodehouse (Company for Henry). Failed with bells on.

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now