CBBC - just a girl

(211 Posts)
kua Sat 29-Oct-16 23:50:47

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3885922/Parents-slam-damaging-BBC-sex-change-aimed-six-year-olds.html

Someone listened , I didn't think it would be the DM though!

HedgehogHedgehog Sat 29-Oct-16 23:56:31

Dont get why this is a problem. Just the same as gay story lines will not make your child gay, transgender storylines will not make your child transgender. Talk to your kids and explain what this all means so they are not confused or worried. Its not hard. Being transgender is more than just wanting to play with toys aimed at the opposite gender or not wanting to wear clothing designed for their gender etc etc you dont need to be worried that 'tomboy' children are all suddenly going to decide they are actually boys or vice versa. It really really reminds me of the things people used to say about gay, lesbian and bisexual people being represented in childrens programs.

BeyondReasonablyDoubts Sun 30-Oct-16 00:03:25

I will not explain to my child that some people are born in the wrong body as that is codswallop. Zero scientific evidence to support this propaganda.

BeyondReasonablyDoubts Sun 30-Oct-16 00:05:18

Do what you want, where what you want, fuck who you want. I'll support your right to do so.
But you will remain the same biological sex you were the moment mr sperm met ms egg.

MrsKCastle Sun 30-Oct-16 00:06:36

* you dont need to be worried that 'tomboy' children are all suddenly going to decide they are actually boys or vice versa.*

If we keep telling children that it is possible to change sex and that they could well have been 'born in the wrong body' that is exactly what will happen.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:11:22

I can't watch this because the BBC website hates me and I wouldn't trust The Daily Mail while I had a fucking hole in my head.

Until I watch it I will have to withhold judgement but I would be deeply troubled about a show aimed at 11 year olds talking about puberty blockers.

Being transgender is more than just wanting to play with toys aimed at the opposite gender or not wanting to wear clothing designed for their gender

Cool, what is it then?

kua Sun 30-Oct-16 00:13:36

Feck knows...no one has been able to explain.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:15:20

I am sure Hedgehog will be back shortly to tell us.

HedgehogHedgehog Sun 30-Oct-16 00:21:11

I dont know, i dont really understand it because im not transgender! Just like i dont really know what being gay is because im not gay.
But i do know what it is to be straight and to believe i am a woman so if its as deeply as ingrained thing as those things then i dont think anyone is going to be convinced by a tv program to change.
If your child is transgender a program like this will help them massively not to be ashamed of themselves and to understand that they are not alone. If your child isnt transgender, they may be puzzled by it but it will not make them transgender!!!
Honestly can you not see what you are saying and how similar it is to the anti gay rhetoric of the past? People used to say that depictions of gay people in mainstream media would encourage young boys to experiment, would encourage peadophilia, would be trendy so that loads of children who didnt want to be gay would be forced into doing it to look cool and all sorts of mad rubbish.
The only thing it does is to help children who were already feeling that way put their feelings into words and to help children who dont feel that way understand those that do.

HedgehogHedgehog Sun 30-Oct-16 00:30:56

and im not arrogant enough to believe i have any right to tell another individual what sex they are.
I know what sex i am, i know what gender i am. How another person defines sex and gender and their relationship to those things is none of my business. Its that persons business.

Just because you have no experience of something does not mean it doesnt exist. Weather you like it or not people are able to change their anatomy to that of the opposite gender now and some of them want to do that in a way that is incredibly deep seated and intense.
Now you can sit here and mouth off about weather its 'real' or 'right' or what the fuck ever, but it doesnt change the fact that its happening to people and so it does need talking about.
Its happening to children so it does need talking about.

I dont feel its my place to judge in terms of right and wrong other than what is causing pain and what isnt. In my view a program like this stands to lessen pain for children who may be experiencing something like what the character depicted is experiencing. Both by making them feel like they are not alone and also by providing insight into how they may be feeling to their peers.

Its such an incredibly difficult thing to go through physically and mentally that i find the suggestion that kids will do it on a whim because they saw it on tv completely and utterly ridiculous.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:31:30

I dont know, i dont really understand it because im not transgender!

Then how do you know what it's not?!

Just like i dont really know what being gay is because im not gay.

False analogy. I didn't ask what it felt like to be transgender. I dunno what it 'feels' like to be gay or lesbian in as much as I don't understand the experience of being gay lesbian in our society. I know what it is though. It's being sexually attracted to people of your own sex and not sexually attracted to people of the other sex. Did you not know that?

If my son said to me that he didn't fancy girls or that he fancied boys I would think "ah my child is probably gay". What is the equivalent with 'trans' kids? If my son said "I feel like a girl" then my first response would be "how would you know?". Apparently the answer is some indescribable feeling.

I don't feel like a woman, I am one I can't tell you what it is like to be cisgendered because it's a made up thing that has no meaning.

AskBasil Sun 30-Oct-16 00:37:09

Hedgehog, could you kindly tell me what a woman is please?

I'm confused.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:39:28

im not arrogant enough to believe i have any right to tell another individual what sex they are.

Good job you aren't a gynocologist eh?

How another person defines sex and gender and their relationship to those things is none of my business.

Tell your kids that when they are sitting GCSE biology. It'll be super helpful.

Just because you have no experience of something does not mean it doesnt exist.

True, but you would have to be pretty fucking thick to blindly believe something when there is so much evidence to the contrary.

people are able to change their anatomy to that of the opposite gender

No they aren't. It's absolutely fucking impossible. Do you actually believe that?!

some of them want to do that in a way that is incredibly deep seated and intense.

They may want to but they can't.

*Now you can sit here and mouth off about weather its 'real' or 'right' or what the fuck ever, but it doesnt change the fact that its happening to people and so it does need talking about.
Its happening to children so it does need talking about.*

Something we agree on! Sadly though many transactivists would prefer we didn't talk about it.

I dont feel its my place to judge in terms of right and wrong other than what is causing pain and what isnt.

You are coming across as more than a little bit judgey here.

In my view a program like this stands to lessen pain for children who may be experiencing something like what the character depicted is experiencing.

I am all for that but I don't think normalising chemical castration and forcing kids to live such a fragile existence is the way to go about it.

Its such an incredibly difficult thing to go through physically and mentally that i find the suggestion that kids will do it on a whim because they saw it on tv completely and utterly ridiculous.

Indeed, so should we be allow fucking 11 year olds to go through this at all?

HedgehogHedgehog Sun 30-Oct-16 00:40:46

look i dont think i can argue with you because we obviously disagree on some very fundamental precepts of existence.

essence precedes existence/existence precedes essence

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:42:28

So I am watching it now.

Mum always knew something was different. Dad wanted Amy to play football. Amy wanted to play with dolls.

That's it. We've moved on now to how Amy transitioned. That's the whole explanation of how Amy's parents and Amy figured she was trans.

QueenLaBeefah Sun 30-Oct-16 00:43:17

Chemically castrating children - what could possibly go wrong?

SpeakNoWords Sun 30-Oct-16 00:46:07

Why is it always football and dolls?

Has there ever been a case where the child has not had any interest in the opposite sex gender-stereotyped behaviours but still felt they were transgender?

HedgehogHedgehog Sun 30-Oct-16 00:46:45

for example i do believe that being a woman is a belief i hold and a feeling. I do think that my sexual attraction to men is a feeling.

Im not sure how transgender people feel because i am not one. I do honestly think that its invasive and morally wrong to force my own view of gender onto someone else. Thats their body. If they are going to tell me they are a woman then despite any signs i may interpret as being to the contrary, i would just accept that.

If i were a gynocholgist i would just work with whatever anatomy was presented to me without passing judgement or labelling a persons gender based on what i saw.

Long and short of it is NO ONE knows what being a woman means as it is different for everyone who identifies as one.

My reasons for saying im a woman are obviously different to yours for example.

aforestgrewandgrew Sun 30-Oct-16 00:48:25

The problem with this kind of show is that children may find it more socially acceptable to become - for example - a transman than a butch lesbian, and there is some evidence that this kind of thing is happening - that some teens find it more acceptable to be "in the wrong body" than gay, and that homophobic parents may find it more acceptable for their DC to be trans than gay.

Showing positive trans role models on TV is unlikely to make DC with no issues suddenly decide they are trans. But pushing the idea that it's possible, and cool even, to change your sex may well encourage DC who are already feeling confused about their identity and how they fit into society to start down a road that may lead to puberty blockers, infertility and surgery before they mature to the point to recognise that they didn't have the medical condition of gender dysphoria after all.

QueenLaBeefah Sun 30-Oct-16 00:49:14

Still absolutely no closer to understanding know what feeling like a woman is. Very frustrating.

SpeakNoWords Sun 30-Oct-16 00:50:37

You would be a very bad gynaecologist then as you'd have no idea what issues the person presenting to you might face, and it would be dangerous for patients being treated that way.

QueenLaBeefah Sun 30-Oct-16 00:52:17

Wouldn't a gynaecologist be completely wasting his/her time if a woman with a penis rocked up?

HedgehogHedgehog Sun 30-Oct-16 00:52:17

I do actually work in healthcare. And its considered best practice not to make assumptions about gender but to instead ask and listen.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:52:36

If i were a gynocholgist i would just work with whatever anatomy was presented to me without passing judgement or labelling a persons gender based on what i saw.

Really? So if I walked into your office got a penis and balls out and asked for my smear test you would.... do what exactly?

Long and short of it is NO ONE knows what being a woman means

So there are no such thing as women then?

My reasons for saying im a woman are obviously different to yours for example.

How do you know you are a woman? You may just be a particularly intelligent hibiscus.

Miffer Sun 30-Oct-16 00:54:28

I do actually work in healthcare.

I also used to work in healthcare and you know what is stamped along the front of every form along with DoB, name, GP surgery? Sex. It's almost as if sex is a scientific term which is vital when treating a patient.

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now