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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What do I you think about the way women are portrayed in Game of Thrones?

126 replies

Millie3030 · 13/04/2015 22:10

As the title says really, my husband watches it and loves it, but it annoys me, it seems like male titilation for me, half naked women, lots of prostitues, sex scenes and murder. But the main character is female and she seems a strong female character, and there are also other strong female characters in it.

What are your thoughts?

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almondcakes · 13/04/2015 22:19

I am divided on it.

On one hand, there is a really excellent range of female characters.

On the other hand, the level of sexualisation of female bodies is absolutely ridiculous. It is specifically the sexualisation of breasts and nudity. I watched all the different series in quick succession, and despite that fact that women are constantly naked for sexual reasons, there have been 2 or 3 scenes where women have been naked for other reasons - dragon woman once got changed and knight woman took a bath.

It is incredibly annoying, but I continue to watch for the characterisation.

The nudity would not be so annoying if it were applied to men too, like in Spartacus blood and sand where men and women were both sexualised. But Game of Thrones is just absurd levels of sexualising naked women.

almondcakes · 13/04/2015 22:25

In fact it struck me that the only women who are allowed to be naked just because sometimes people are, are the two strong characters, dragon woman is a leader and knight woman is, well, a knight. All other women in it are sexualised through nudity.

And how come if it is set in pseudo medieval land and all women keep getting their breasts out, how come nobody breast feeds, apart from that one woman who is showing breast feeding a nine year old as evidence she is a crazy woman?

Sorry. I'm just annoyed at myself for watching it.

Millie3030 · 13/04/2015 22:58

I'm so glad it's not just me, it's a strange program, it has strong females but then they are sexualised for silly reasons like that bath scene I remember it well and thought why? Why is this needed? I havnt seen all the episodes, but I havnt seen a penis on there, so it's not just that the producer likes nudity. It's definitely more naked women, and just the stereotypical pretty ones, the very tall blonde knight like type woman, don't think she has been shown naked?

OP posts:

almondcakes · 13/04/2015 23:04

Article about it here:

www.psmag.com/books-and-culture/sexual-politics-full-frontal-nudity-hbos-hit-television-shows-84737

LaurieFairyCake · 13/04/2015 23:10

Yes, Breana of Tar was shown in a bath scene naked with Jamie Lannister.

There are so few shows with such complex and so many female characters though. They are just as well drawn as the men.

sashh · 14/04/2015 06:29

I'm so glad it's not just me, it's a strange program, it has strong females but then they are sexualised for silly reasons like that bath scene I remember it well and thought why? Why is this needed?

It's quite a pivotal scene in the books, it sort of has to be there. Although they got rid of a few other pivotal moments.

But I agree lots of female nudity not much male.

nooka · 14/04/2015 06:37

I really enjoy GoT but hate the porn scenes. The newer series aren't as bad as the first couple which had exposition in brothels for no reason whatsoever. I think it is just a way for the producers to emphasise what an adult show it is, and I assume it's thought that it pulls in some viewers too.

There are a few naked men in it too, but they are very fleeting, unlike the lascivious shots of women. There are however lots of quite satisfying female characters, all acting in their own ways to try and survive and get one over on everyone else.

ovumahead · 14/04/2015 06:38

I stopped watching after 4 episodes because of this - I found it so annoying and unnecessary! Not against nudity, sex, whatever but it just seemed irrelevant a lot of the time. But so many people love it and I often feel tempted to try to watch it again... Frustrating!

RedCrayons · 14/04/2015 06:50

You don't see her naked in the bath scene do you? She's one of the few who we haven't seen naked i think. The others being the two Stark girls (obviously) and some of the older women.

It's the thing that really puts me off it a bit. There are lots of strong female characters, but way too many nameless, faceless women wandering around naked for no reason other than set decoration.

DoctorDonnaNoble · 14/04/2015 07:26

Books are better. However, there is a lot about prostitution in the city. Doesn't seem to linger in the same way in prose though.

EqualRites · 14/04/2015 07:31

There were far more lingering shots of naked men in last night's episode - a whole scene was played with two men naked in bed. There were a lot of boobs though too.

Hakluyt · 14/04/2015 07:37

It's the main reason I won't let my teenager watch it. Such a shame.

sooperdooper · 14/04/2015 07:45

I think the incredibly strong female characters outweigh the nudity tbh.

Danerys was shown naked coming out of the fire with her dragons but that was about her rebirth into the mother of dragons.

Last nights ep had a pretty long scene with two naked men in bed together

pregnantpause · 14/04/2015 08:04

It seems so unnecessary to the majority of the plot- it is obviously just for the male enjoyment factor. Nudity has a part to play in shows and the legality around female nudity is a lot laxer than that of male - which is one reason we don't see penis ( one of not the entire reason) and that fact in and of itself is ample for feminist dissection.

Nudity can be used effectively as to convey shock, brutality, eroticism, vulnerability etc but in this show most of it isn't ( though the bath scene I felt did help convey their vulnerability and how 'stripped' they both were after what they experienced together - though more was made of her nudity I think if they could show his nudity as fully they would have)

I'm Also increasingly annoyed at despite the medieval dress, lifestyle, world- all of the ladies have either a full wax or landing strip. Some thoroughly modern fannies under that old fashioned dress.

Hakluyt · 14/04/2015 08:13

I agree, pregnantpause - that is my objection. I was about to say it's so bloody unnecessary- but it obviously isn't. I bet a significant % of the viewers are only there for the porn.....

Such a shame- it could be fantastic........

Flowerfae · 14/04/2015 08:15

I'm only halfway through the first book of A Song of Ice and Fire .. but glad to say there isn't anywhere near as much nudity and sex as there is in the TV adaption .... I think its for viewing ratings, unless it does get more like the series later on. It hasn't been as bad in recent episodes but was ridiculous at first.

I think there are a few strong female leads in Game of Thrones, Daenerys, Melisandre (although they do all seem to be fond of stripping) Catelyn Stark was quite a strong charector .. I don't think she had any naked scenes that I remember?

There is definitely more naked women then men though, would prefer it if they all kept their kits on personally :P

Blu · 14/04/2015 08:24

I only saw half of one episode: full of sexual violence / 'titillating' shots of willowy women with C21st levels of spa grooming. Couldn't watch any more.

Chopsypie · 14/04/2015 08:29

Hakluyt - given the volume and diversity of porn readily and freely available online I don't think people are watching it for the regular showing of topless women. If you want porn, there is plenty out there (including some characters from game of thrones!)

Hakluyt · 14/04/2015 08:38

I am always amused by the GOT apologist- they say that the reason so many of the women are treated as disposable sex objects and there is so much sexual violence is because it is a realistic depiction of a medieval world.

However, they also say that it's a feminist triumph because there so many strong female characters. Which means it's not a realistic depiction etc etc

And not one of them has ever adressed the pubic hair/general female grooming issue. Which also suggests it's not a realistic etc etc......

And they generally hate it when you mention the pornographic sensibility.........

Trills · 14/04/2015 08:39

Rather than talk about "strong" female characters, can we talk about "complex" female characters?

A "strong woman" is nearly as one-dimensional as a damsel in distress, and does no more for feminism.

True equality is when women can be strong and weak and good and evil and clever and stupid and noble and selfish and cunning and naive and have many other features along all the axes of personality.

(btw we've definitely seen Theon's penis, but it was a while ago...)

Millie3030 · 14/04/2015 08:39

I thinking of a different bath scene I think, the blonde one with the dragons was in the bath, is there a different bath scene you are talking about?

The two men last night were naked, but you did not see a penis, yet within 5 minutes of the show starting I saw 2 different pairs of breasts and a full frontal female (she did have hair) Had a great feminist discussion with my DH last night about this (and many things) and he said it's annoying as he likes the story lines but the gratuitous nudity doesn't add to the story and that it makes it seem slightly seedy, (probably not the right word) but he would love me to love it to so we can watch it together, but after seeing the 2 breasts and full frontal within in minutes I thought how ridiculous.

I feel like this show moves us back 10/20 years with the representation of women, but then the strong females feels more like 2015. The producer is bound to stay to the storylines but surely he makes the decision on how the women are represented within the show? Passive/active/powerful/sexualised etc?

OP posts:

Millie3030 · 14/04/2015 08:46

Wasn't that penis shown when he was about to be castrated? I looked it up and there has been one penis scene so far, can't remember the name.

Thanks trills I see what you mean about strong and complex, never thought about it like that. So the prostitutes and brothel female characters are not complex as they are just pretty slim women (without opinions) and the complex characters are the queen, the blonde dragon one, the tall blonde knight, that younger knight girl etc? Is that what you mean?

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TheFirstOfHerName · 14/04/2015 08:55

Lots of gratuitous male nudity in last night's episode!

Hakluyt · 14/04/2015 09:05

I find it very frustrating. There is no possible reason for the way any woman not a main protagonist is depicted except the pandering to a pornographic sensibility.

And I find it very disturbing and depressing that it is a favourite programme among my 14 year old ds's friends. I hate to think what it is adding to their "mental furniture".................

LaurieFairyCake · 14/04/2015 09:10

It's a 15 rating and they shouldn't be watching it. Some of the earlier episodes like when Joffrey tortures and murders a prostituted woman are horrible - they may even be rated an 18?

We watch walking dead and some of the episodes are 15 and some are 18 (for gore). I watch the 18's before my 17 year old to check that it's suitable and to warn her.

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