What do MRAs want?

(722 Posts)

...aside from a blow job and, oh, a sandwich would be nice love.

grin

Right, seriously now. I try and be an open minded sort of a person, and I've been wondering about this. When I look at the world, my perception is that women are disadvantaged, belittled, by many things. We all know what those are.

When feminist women and non-feminist women have discussions about things like Page 3 for example, usually the feminists are trying to get the non-feminists to see the world in a different way: Page 3 not as a bit of harmless fun that the girls are happy (and get paid handsomely) to do, but as a "choice" pre-set by patriarchal values. That's just one example. So, I am open to the idea of people who hold different opinions trying to convince me to try and see the world through their eyes for a time.

Trying to see through an MRA's eyes, I think I'd see a world where women were protected by law and custom, vast majority got to lounge about at home pottering about with kids while the men had to work to provide, weren't expected to be violent and had lots of support when violence was committed against them. Had the deck stacked in their favour in family courts even though the father loves his kids just as much and has had to work so hard to provide for them. Was expected to just carry on when he had mental health problems, laughed at if he admitted depression or other problems. That sort of thing.

But where I get stuck is what MRAs want to be different. If they want the chance to shrug off the manly provider role, feminists are cool with that. If they want to campaign for more DV shelters, better mental health provision, prostate cancer research, that's OK with me. But they don't seem to want to do that. Rather, they just seem like an oppositional group that just wants to blame feminism for all their problems.

I'd be interested to hear the views of others on this... What DO they want?

Panzee Mon 19-Aug-13 22:51:24

I had to google it as I can't see the full phrase mentioned in the thread, and the Mumsnet acronym guide didn't help.

The Urban Dictonary has some great definitions. grin

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 22:54:29

Ssssh! Don't mention the Illuminati.

I shall send you the special crucifix and the goat's blood in the post.

SigmundFraude Mon 19-Aug-13 23:00:16

You know, if you want to know what they want, why don't you just ask them?

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:01:50

We totes should, right?

CiscoKid Mon 19-Aug-13 23:05:35

Is the illuminati/goat comment aimed at me too? Have I missed something again?

FreyaSnow Mon 19-Aug-13 23:05:44

Well I know what they say they want, but as what they say they want is totally at odds with reality as it exists anywhere in the world, I have to speculate on what they really want by looking at the underlying psychology, which I don't feel equipped to do.

contortionist Mon 19-Aug-13 23:08:37

LRD - my hypothetical reasonable MRA doesn't believe society is structurally misandric, but rather that there are gender roles and assumptions which disadvantage both men and women, in different ways - and he's more exercised about the ways in which men are disadvantaged. Not necessarily because he thinks men have it worse than women, but because the issues affecting men are personally more relevant, and perhaps also because he has more idea of what might need to be done.
I don't think this is reprehensible - it's only human to be more concerned with what affects us personally (or people we identify with) than with more distant or abstract injustice.

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:08:42

cisco - check out the references suggested. wink

And no, it wasn't aimed at you.

freya - it's interesting though, trying to work it out, because it does make me wonder more what the heck is going wrong.

SigmundFraude Mon 19-Aug-13 23:10:40

'We totes should, right?'

Yes. You totes should.

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:10:43

Sorry, cont, cross posted.

I see where you're coming from. Yeah, ok. I've never come across a MRA who thought remotely like that, though - it's more what I'd associate with men who identify with other political ideologies including feminism. Do you mean you reckon this is what some MRAs might be like (and we should be fair and acknowledge they may be out there), or do you mean, going by the words alone, this is what a rational one would be?

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Mon 19-Aug-13 23:15:04

A few may remember the thread on the Politics board a while back - about a certain -ahem- MRA who started his own political party and who should remain nameless because few things bring the trolls, or even the man himself, over quicker than his name on a thread

A very angry young MRA came over and thought he was clever (he wasn't) fisking everyone's posts, and moaning about the poor men and that nasty women send them off to die in wars and constantly trick them into pregnancy etc.

But when asked what 3 laws he would bring in to address his perceived injustices - what did he want to change - he just could/would not answer. I think he just didn't know - but was suffering from a deep, deep fear and mistrust of women. He seemed to see them as a different species.

AnyFucker Mon 19-Aug-13 23:17:27

SF, why don't you tell us instead

g'wan, you know you want to

imagine how satisfying it could be, to actually contribute instead of uselessly sniping

FreyaSnow Mon 19-Aug-13 23:18:22

Contortionist, I think it is a sensible approach that people who are in a group determine particular issues for that group. With domestic violence for example, it is more sensible for male victims of domestic violence to be listened so that appropriate support can be created, rather than assuming they will want or need the type of support set up for female victims.

LRD, there are a lot of people who come on here who have a lot of knowledge in one area or another, and it is a shame there isn't anybody on here who knows a lot about psychology, because it applies to so many of the issues discussed on here.

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:18:45

Is sig a MRA, AF?

I always assumed s/he just hated women and feminism.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Mon 19-Aug-13 23:18:46

Love the Urban Dictionary definitions of MRA. grin

flowers for UD.

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:19:43

freya - sorry, I didn't follow you, but yes, I agree.

AnyFucker Mon 19-Aug-13 23:21:29

I don't know, LRD. This could be an ideal time to lay the cards on the table. This thread isn't wholly hostile to the thought processes of MRA-types.

btw, SF, your well-used refrain of "I fear for my sons" is wearing thin. Lots of us have sons.

FreyaSnow Mon 19-Aug-13 23:25:35

LRD, I meant in terms of trying to work out what motivates MRAs, a psychologist might have a lot of insight. I've found out a lot of stuff on this board because so many people bring their knowledge of specific types of analysis, and I'd like the same to be true of a psychological approach.

LRDPomogiMnyeSRabotoi Mon 19-Aug-13 23:25:59

Fair point.

I think a lot do really believe in their cause, some are at the bottom of society's priorities and feel hard done by (as they should) and see the cause of the problem as such, but not the reasoning behind it. They see the patriarchy as such, but see the bits they think are bonuses for women and not men, instead of how it is bad for both men and women, and see women as to blame?

Bunnylion Mon 19-Aug-13 23:30:11

SF - still awaiting your definition of feminism that you said you'd think about and share earlier today.

AF, I've not got a son yet but I'm 9 months pregnant with my first - god help him, I'll have him dressed like a princess, baking cupcakes by Christmas.

AnyFucker Mon 19-Aug-13 23:30:31

Yes, it's a fundamental mistake that people who hate and distrust feminism make isn't it, RCP

that a male-centric society damages both men and women, particularly those at the bottom of the heap...if you look at it from a sociological POV

AnyFucker Mon 19-Aug-13 23:32:30

grin @ bunny, when my son was small he wore a pot towel on his head as "long hair" and insisted we call him "Aurora"

SigmundFraude Mon 19-Aug-13 23:32:38

As you and LRD have been so rude, I don't think I'll be discussing anything with you. Nice to see LRD reverting back to type anyhow.

If I said 'I fear for my daughters' would you be quite so scathing? I highly doubt it, I think the tone would be entirely different.

SigmundFraude Mon 19-Aug-13 23:33:37

* to AF

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