Discussing feminism with women today

(129 Posts)
ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 18:54:24

A post was opened about feminism on a forum I'm on. I'm a feminist, leaning more towards rad feminism but not buying into all their ideology. I don't believe men can be feminists, I think they can sympathise with the movement, as I can say against race rights, but they haven't truly experienced being a woman in a partiarchal society.

I got called names and a "man hater" and all sorts of horrible things, and I wondering if my beliefs are really out there and a bit insane?! I'm married to a man with two sons, and I don't "hate men" and I know that's a lazy thing to call a feminist but it's really got me down.

GrimmaTheNome Tue 30-Jul-13 18:59:04

>wondering if my beliefs are really out there and a bit insane?!

nah, its more likely that you ran into a bunch who enjoy being nasty to anyone who identifies as being a feminist. (BTW - your NN doesn't sound very rad fem, I was expecting this to be rather a different sort of post!grin)

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 19:07:25

They said they were feminists and that it was all about "equality" and the fact I was refusing to make it about men meant I didn't want equality?! I asked if they'd read Caitlin Moran's definition of a feminist; then they went into a mob mode and said I was slating women for not being fluent in "feminist" literature. I feel bad that they got the wrong end of the stick, but also that they don't seem to know what they're talking about. What's an NN?

GrimmaTheNome Tue 30-Jul-13 19:13:52

NN == Nickname smile

I've never read Caitlin's definition of feminism.... please do tell! smile

I'm not fluent in feminist literature but I'm always happy to learn.

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 19:17:10

Oh, it's along the lines of "put your hands down your pants, if there's a vagina and you want to be in control of it then you're a feminist". This clearly outlaws men. Ah my NN is because my babies were whispers Gina Ford babies (her book is Contented Little Baby!)

SconeRhymesWithGone Tue 30-Jul-13 20:04:12

Wasn't Moran speaking to women when she said that?

I am a feminist (and a woman). Men can be feminists, too. I married one and I raised one. But they do have to understand that being a feminist does not erase their male privilege, and they must be willing to be educated and led by women in their feminism.

But I don't think you should be attacked for a different view. I know radical feminists who believe that men can only be allies, but not feminists (or at least not radical ones). I recognize that it is a valid point of view, even though I disagree with it.

ImNotBloody14 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:14:15

Outlaws men? Men are illegal? confused

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:14:36

I think that men can be "pro feminists" but not feminists mainly because they're not women and therefore can't understand the struggle from a womans' perspective. I read it online quoted, but can't say where it was originally from, but I know it was in one of her books too.

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:16:44

Does it really matter if they want the same outcome?

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:17:41

It matters to me, because I don't need a man to fight my battle to be truthful. Can't anything just be womens'?

ImNotBloody14 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:21:49

Being a feminist isnt about experiencing the struggle women go through.

ImNotBloody14 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:22:20

I think you seem a bit confused about the definition of a feminist tbh.

ImNotBloody14 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:22:44

And what is this about outlawing men? confused

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:24:53

Sorry for using the wrong terminology.

I'm confused? How so? I believe in removing the patriarchy and I don't believe in needing a mans' (generally speaking) help to do it. What do you think feminism is?

ImNotBloody14 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:30:06

Its not about needing a man's help - its about people wanting the same thing and lots of the people that want that are men.

Backonthefence Tue 30-Jul-13 20:31:11

How are you going to remove the patriarchy without men?

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:31:37

I believe that people of different races should be treated equally. I've not experienced racism but I think it's wrong.

I believe people who are disabled shouldn't face discrimination. I've not experienced that but I think it's wrong.

I believe trans people should not face discrimination. I have experienced that and value the support of people who are not trans but support trans rights.

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:33:08

Kim it's exactly that, they can empathise but haven't first handedly experienced.

Maybe I'm more rad fem than I thought.

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:33:54

handed* sorry

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:38:09

But can they say they are a feminist?

What do you think a feminist is and a feminist wants?

How does that differ from someone who supports trans / race equality / disabled rights?

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:40:19

You said "if you want to be in charge of your vagina, that makes you a feminist"

Which is a good quote.

But it does not say "Only a person with a vagina can be a feminist".

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:41:05

I think a woman (born a woman) wanting to get rid of the patriarchal system because it effects her makes her a feminist. I don't think men are targeted by the patriarchal system, unless I'm reading into it all wrong

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:44:45

You're saying what that a woman can be a feminist.

But you're not defining what a feminist is. Just who can be one.

IYSWIM.

What do you think a feminist wants? Is it "for women to be in control of their vaginas"? If so, surely that can include men who want that as well?

kim147 Tue 30-Jul-13 20:45:41

And the patriarchy (or the system) affects men as well.

ContentedLittleMummy Tue 30-Jul-13 20:47:39

A feminist is a woman who wants to remove the patriarchy and what it stands for. A feminist wants equality for women, to end exploitation and misogyny; a feminist is someone who can see through her eyes how women are treated differently, being that she's experienced it, and wants to get rid of that treatment/stigma

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now