Feminism for dummies

(111 Posts)
Nigglenaggle Mon 26-Nov-12 21:46:00

Hi. I have never really read much about feminism, but I always thought, in its essence, it was about bringing equality for men and women. however reading threads in this section has lead me to believe in fact that is not the case. In fact I've come to wonder if that is even a large part of it. Please explain to me, in plain English, what feminism is. An overview of the different schools of thought within it would be welcome, however please stick to simple terms, for a simple girl grin

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Sat 01-Dec-12 21:43:48

OMC, in your first post that cited the article about the rise, you quoted Abigail saying that violent women in relationships were rare, and you seemed to be using your various citations as a counterargument to this quote, saying her view was dated.

Perhaps I misunderstood.

OneMoreChap Sat 01-Dec-12 19:09:28

TheDoctrineOfSnatch the issue is the rise in reports and convictions; we welcome it for rape; we should welcome it for other offences, neh?

TeiTetua Sat 01-Dec-12 17:45:54

I've heard anecdotal claims that the rate of domestic violence is about the same among heterosexuals as it is in gay male couples and lesbian couples. If that were to be true, it would say that when two women are cooped up in a relationship, they're as likely to descend to violence as anyone--except that if it's "anyone" of differing genders, it's much more likely to be the man hurting the woman than vice versa. I don't know what to say about that. There are things that a man will do to a woman that a woman won't do to a man, and the same doesn't apply to two women or to two men?

PortoDude Sat 01-Dec-12 17:25:09

Good blog POST that should say....

PortoDude Sat 01-Dec-12 17:24:11

Good blog about the subject of male dv here

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Fri 30-Nov-12 22:48:42

OMC that link and the link from it talks about 7% of convictions for DV being of women ie 4,000 out of 59,000.

OneMoreChap Fri 30-Nov-12 22:39:08

Rise in *women* convicted or did we miss that?

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 21:57:33

It was OneMoreChap that posted the "stats" and I saw ncg at the bottom of the page and got the blokes mixed up.

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 21:54:30

Oh sorry NCG - indeed it was NOT you. I am very sorry. blush

namechangeguy Fri 30-Nov-12 21:09:31

That was not me.

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 19:37:12

ncg - but you posted "statistics" re domestic violence with the aim of showing that WOMEN are guilty in large proportions too. The statistics might show that more men are subject to dv - but they don't show that it is women that are responsible.

namechangeguy Fri 30-Nov-12 18:58:05

Very interested. Back in an hour or 2 though, when I'd like to discuss it more. TTFN.

ashesgirl Fri 30-Nov-12 18:53:47

Of course, NCG. But feminism is about looking at overall trends rather than individual cases and challenging why they occur.

If 89% of violent offences are committed by men, wouldn't you be interested in what biological or social reasons are behind that? To examine and then try and change that?

(I believe I read that stat in an earlier link on there - pls correct me if I'm wrong)

namechangeguy Fri 30-Nov-12 18:49:08

I could not possibly comment, as I did not ask the question. But the point about whether another man was responsible was raised in the case of a male sufferer, and yet women-on-women violence was not brought up. It seemed a little lop-sided.

My gut feel is that there is more male-perpetrated DV, but I don't have any stats on the matter. I just think it's all sad. If I was a victim, I don't think I would care whether my attacker was male or female. I would just want it to stop.

ashesgirl Fri 30-Nov-12 18:43:46

And why that is.

ashesgirl Fri 30-Nov-12 18:43:01

No one is condoning violence.

But we are asking questions about who is perpertrating it.

ecclesvet Fri 30-Nov-12 18:42:50

Actually, that's an interesting point - are fights between house-mates counted as domestic violence?

namechangeguy Fri 30-Nov-12 18:40:40

It shouldn't matter though. Violence is violence, and nobody should be subjected to it. Is it more acceptable if a women is attacked by her female partner, or a random woman in a club? Sometimes it seems like people want to out-victim each other. Nobody should have to accept being the victim of violence in any scenario, regardless of the gender of the perpetrator.

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 18:25:58

The statistics you mention do not go in to any detail as to who the perpetrator was. Was it another MAN perchance? - not every man lives with a woman. To what degree was the recorded violence due to retaliation/self preservation etc?

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 18:22:06

Oh OneMoreChap - bless you for trying. There are lots of informed pieces out there that explain those figures very well. How many men do you know that have had to flee their partners because they fear for themselves and their children? How many press reports do you read on the subject of women's violence against men? How often do you hear of cases where a man has accused a women of sexual assault?

Of course these things happen. No-one denies it. But these cases are hugely in the minority.

OneMoreChap Fri 30-Nov-12 15:35:10

In passing AbigailAdams
You enquired Where do you find women intimidating, bullying, frightening, beating up men? Where are the men whose partners force them to have unwanted sex? Where are the men fleeing to shelters in fear of their lives? Where do you find all these violent women? They are rare. Lets start by Naming the Problem for what it is. The problem is violent men. And DV has nothing to do with being weak. That is offensive and ignorant.

Of course, you're aware that the definition of DV has changed?

Some of your figures - and your rhetoric - are beginning to sound a tad dated...

25% of DV against men

150% rise in women convicted of DV over 5 years

*40*% of DV victims male

Shelter's advice for male DV victims

So, you know, your attitude that it's all one sided? And, you know, people being offensive and ignorant?

Have a wee think.

grimbletart Fri 30-Nov-12 15:21:40

Nigglenaggle: you can't afford to be a sensitive flower on MN. I've been a feminist since I was a little girl (60+ years ago) and because I posted something that was deemed critical of women I was told by one of the self-describe radical feminists no longer posting here that I did not understand feminism. Considering I had lived it for my entire life I found that amusing (though it was indeed deeply offensive).

PortoDude Fri 30-Nov-12 13:30:48

Who was talking about stereotyping anyone?

Trills Fri 30-Nov-12 12:47:06

Did you post that on the wrong thread, OP? It doesn't seem to have any relationship to the posts I have read.

scottishmummy Thu 29-Nov-12 21:01:52

a good ideological argument is stimulating,if the name calling can be avoided
i expect to be disagreed with on points, dont need posters to concur with me
mn is robust, but thats what i like

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